To not be able to believe what I'm reading

[Butwasitherdriveway]

Had a leaflet through my door......

I'm lost for words.

Just to point out that this party backs the removal of sex based protections for women in employment - so would like to see laws on equal pay and sex discrimination in the workplace removed ultimately.

They see womens' place in life as being at home, raising children and looking after men and the house and want to disincentivise women to work.

What’s inaccurate in that paragraph?
The fact it’s not true obviously..
I have no negative feelings towards women who have abortions whatsoever so no, I’m not wanting to ‘punish’ them at all.

If they feel they want or need an abortion the law says they can go and just do that.
I don’t agree with it because I don’t agree with abortion but at the end of the day they are doing what they feel is right.

I am going to stop commenting now.
It’s too divisive a subject.
My view is my view and I’m sorry that offends people, I am well aware of the arguments for pro choice but I am a pro lifer and always will be

@DiddlyWiddly

What’s inaccurate in that paragraph? The fact it’s not true obviously.. I have no negative feelings towards women who have abortions whatsoever so no, I’m not wanting to ‘punish’ them at all.

If they feel they want or need an abortion the law says they can go and just do that.
I don’t agree with it because I don’t agree with abortion but at the end of the day they are doing what they feel is right.

I am going to stop commenting now.
It’s too divisive a subject.
My view is my view and I’m sorry that offends people, I am well aware of the arguments for pro choice but I am a pro lifer and always will be

It isn’t inaccurate, then. Like I said, it’s just illogical.

@DiddlyWiddly

What’s inaccurate in that paragraph? The fact it’s not true obviously.. I have no negative feelings towards women who have abortions whatsoever so no, I’m not wanting to ‘punish’ them at all.

If they feel they want or need an abortion the law says they can go and just do that.
I don’t agree with it because I don’t agree with abortion but at the end of the day they are doing what they feel is right.

I am going to stop commenting now.
It’s too divisive a subject.
My view is my view and I’m sorry that offends people, I am well aware of the arguments for pro choice but I am a pro lifer and always will be

And it’s a shame you didn’t tell everyone about all your work as a protector and advocate of the unwanted, and all your charity work with all the children you adopted. What a missed opportunity for you.

@DiddlyWiddly I have no negative feelings towards women who have abortions whatsoever so no, I’m not wanting to ‘punish’ them at all.

You believe they are murderers who are deliberately killing human beings, but you have no negative feelings towards them?

That doesn't make any sense at all.

@Quaagars

I will ask MN to remove the comment you are referring to as on reading it back it can be read as people are saying they are fine with this party because they agree with people when it comes to trans people - when all I meant was people do seem fine with hate speech when it comes to trans issues (define hate speech, blah blah is a whole separate tangent before anyone says) and also seem fine with far right views for the same reason (as shown several times on MN fairly recently with references to Breitbart or far right you tubers being agreed with.) Didn't mean people were fine with this party. Sorry for not being clear, I can see it was an ambiguous comment

That's yet another outright lie, isn't it? Your comment wasn't 'ambiguous' and it absolutely did refer to this party and this thread. You wrote:

Quaagars Tue 27-Apr-21 11:23:59
Seems quite a few going by these comments are fine with them because well at least they agree with me on trans!

That was a lie, wasn't it? And now you're lying again about having said it.

Oh good grief lol - how do you come to the conclusion from my comment that I'm saying I never said it?!
I didn't - I said it could be taken one of two ways.
Which on reading back, I realised.
Which is why I asked for it to be removed.

@DiddlyWiddly

What’s inaccurate in that paragraph? The fact it’s not true obviously.. I have no negative feelings towards women who have abortions whatsoever so no, I’m not wanting to ‘punish’ them at all.

If they feel they want or need an abortion the law says they can go and just do that.
I don’t agree with it because I don’t agree with abortion but at the end of the day they are doing what they feel is right.

I am going to stop commenting now.
It’s too divisive a subject.
My view is my view and I’m sorry that offends people, I am well aware of the arguments for pro choice but I am a pro lifer and always will be

That view though, is the same as those who take away the right to choose if they were to make it illegal (albeit a more extreme version of your view) its still the same. As in they don't agree with it either. So how can they just 'go get one if they want to?' If your views were to come into practice? The right to would have been taken away.

It isn’t inaccurate, then. Like I said, it’s just illogical.

If your claims about this were actually true, it would be inconsistent, rather than illogical, which means something different.

But while there are certainly people who are inconsistent, and systems that are inconsistent, I think you will find that there are plenty of people who support their views in this area quite consistently.

Your idea however that this means that they should be adopting lots of babies is a little weird, in most places that's quite difficult.

You also might want to be a little careful about demanding people have perfect track records of consistent moral behaviour in a system that doesn't share their views entirely. Do you believe in polluting third world countries with toxic metals used in western countries, or sweat shops that exploit workers? I really hope we wouldn't find things in your house like computers or clothing from major retailers.

@SmokedDuck

It isn’t inaccurate, then. Like I said, it’s just illogical.

If your claims about this were actually true, it would be inconsistent, rather than illogical, which means something different.

But while there are certainly people who are inconsistent, and systems that are inconsistent, I think you will find that there are plenty of people who support their views in this area quite consistently.

Your idea however that this means that they should be adopting lots of babies is a little weird, in most places that's quite difficult.

You also might want to be a little careful about demanding people have perfect track records of consistent moral behaviour in a system that doesn't share their views entirely. Do you believe in polluting third world countries with toxic metals used in western countries, or sweat shops that exploit workers? I really hope we wouldn't find things in your house like computers or clothing from major retailers.

I think you need to re-read what I wrote. It’s the idea that being anti-abortion is being pro-life. It isn’t, and it’s illogical to pretend it is.

[quote dropdtuning]@Quaagars

I will ask MN to remove the comment you are referring to as on reading it back it can be read as people are saying they are fine with this party because they agree with people when it comes to trans people - when all I meant was people do seem fine with hate speech when it comes to trans issues (define hate speech, blah blah is a whole separate tangent before anyone says) and also seem fine with far right views for the same reason (as shown several times on MN fairly recently with references to Breitbart or far right you tubers being agreed with.) Didn't mean people were fine with this party. Sorry for not being clear, I can see it was an ambiguous comment

That's yet another outright lie, isn't it? Your comment wasn't 'ambiguous' and it absolutely did refer to this party and this thread. You wrote:

Quaagars Tue 27-Apr-21 11:23:59
Seems quite a few going by these comments are fine with them because well at least they agree with me on trans!

That was a lie, wasn't it? And now you're lying again about having said it.[/quote]
No, she isn't lying.

It's clear what she meant.

Any chance you could leave her alone now?

@DiddlyWiddly fair enough diddly. We won't agree but it's a sensitive topic so I'm sorry if I was mean.

www.thenational.scot/news/15483217.new-scottish-family-party-leader-defends-jo-cox-joke-and-comparison-of-same-sex-marriage-and-incest/

THE leader of the Scottish Family Party, the country’s new right-wing, pro-Brexit, anti-feminist political movement, has defended comments comparing same-sex marriage to incest.

Party leader Richard Lucas also denied a sick joke about the murder of Jo Cox posted on his Facebook less than a week after she was killed was “making light of her death”.

In schools, the party want children taught “about the correlations between homosexual relationships and physical and mental health problems”.

They also call for an end to the NHS paying for the revolutionary HIV prevention drug PrEP.

Scotland became the first part of the UK to have the medication on prescription.

The Scottish Family Party say it “facilitates a person’s sexual recklessness”.

Last year on his Facebook page, Lucas mentioned the Holyrood petitions committee’s rejection of a call to legalise incest – and drew comparisons with same-sex marriage.

“[The committee] disagreed with the notion that mutual love alone serves to validate a sexual relationship. Is this the same parliament that introduced same-sex marriage, accepting unanswerable arguments such as these?”

Then, two days before last year’s referendum on the EU Lucas, a fervent Brexiteer, joked on his Facebook page that one reason to vote Remain was “no deranged gunman has attacked a Brexit campaigner”.

The fact that this man is a teacher is far more worrying than any of the SFP's scaremongering about sex education.

@bgxqt

www.thenational.scot/news/15483217.new-scottish-family-party-leader-defends-jo-cox-joke-and-comparison-of-same-sex-marriage-and-incest/

THE leader of the Scottish Family Party, the country’s new right-wing, pro-Brexit, anti-feminist political movement, has defended comments comparing same-sex marriage to incest.

Party leader Richard Lucas also denied a sick joke about the murder of Jo Cox posted on his Facebook less than a week after she was killed was “making light of her death”.

In schools, the party want children taught “about the correlations between homosexual relationships and physical and mental health problems”.

They also call for an end to the NHS paying for the revolutionary HIV prevention drug PrEP.

Scotland became the first part of the UK to have the medication on prescription.

The Scottish Family Party say it “facilitates a person’s sexual recklessness”.

Last year on his Facebook page, Lucas mentioned the Holyrood petitions committee’s rejection of a call to legalise incest – and drew comparisons with same-sex marriage.

“[The committee] disagreed with the notion that mutual love alone serves to validate a sexual relationship. Is this the same parliament that introduced same-sex marriage, accepting unanswerable arguments such as these?”

Then, two days before last year’s referendum on the EU Lucas, a fervent Brexiteer, joked on his Facebook page that one reason to vote Remain was “no deranged gunman has attacked a Brexit campaigner”.

The fact that this man is a teacher is far more worrying than any of the SFP's scaremongering about sex education.

Lovely fella.

@bgxqt

www.thenational.scot/news/15483217.new-scottish-family-party-leader-defends-jo-cox-joke-and-comparison-of-same-sex-marriage-and-incest/

THE leader of the Scottish Family Party, the country’s new right-wing, pro-Brexit, anti-feminist political movement, has defended comments comparing same-sex marriage to incest.

Party leader Richard Lucas also denied a sick joke about the murder of Jo Cox posted on his Facebook less than a week after she was killed was “making light of her death”.

In schools, the party want children taught “about the correlations between homosexual relationships and physical and mental health problems”.

They also call for an end to the NHS paying for the revolutionary HIV prevention drug PrEP.

Scotland became the first part of the UK to have the medication on prescription.

The Scottish Family Party say it “facilitates a person’s sexual recklessness”.

Last year on his Facebook page, Lucas mentioned the Holyrood petitions committee’s rejection of a call to legalise incest – and drew comparisons with same-sex marriage.

“[The committee] disagreed with the notion that mutual love alone serves to validate a sexual relationship. Is this the same parliament that introduced same-sex marriage, accepting unanswerable arguments such as these?”

Then, two days before last year’s referendum on the EU Lucas, a fervent Brexiteer, joked on his Facebook page that one reason to vote Remain was “no deranged gunman has attacked a Brexit campaigner”.

The fact that this man is a teacher is far more worrying than any of the SFP's scaremongering about sex education.

One of their members is Philipp Tanzer, who’s a well known MRA.

@Pumperthepumper there is nothing wrong with being a MRA, and this is not relevant or comparable to the points made.

[quote Butwasitherdriveway]@Pumperthepumper there is nothing wrong with being a MRA, and this is not relevant or comparable to the points made.[/quote]
Do you know what an MRA is? It’s very relevant to this party’s aims.

No, I responded directly saying there's nothing wrong with it when I have no idea what it is.

@Butwasitherdriveway

No, I responded directly saying there's nothing wrong with it when I have no idea what it is.

So you know it stands for Men’s Rights Activist and don’t think it’s relevant to a party who are anti-abortion and think a woman’s place is in the home? You don’t think it’s even a tiny bit relevant?

And you don’t think there’s anything wrong with being an MRA?

Yes pumper, for the third time there's nothing wrong with it.

I didn't say it wasn't relative to the points per se, what I meant was his position as an MRA is not comparable to the hideous comments about same sex marriage and Jos murder which you appeared to be trying to do.

@Butwasitherdriveway

Yes pumper, for the third time there's nothing wrong with it.

I didn't say it wasn't relative to the points per se, what I meant was his position as an MRA is not comparable to the hideous comments about same sex marriage and Jos murder which you appeared to be trying to do.

There’s a lot wrong with being a MRA.

You should have read properly then, and been more clear in your reply to me.

@Pumperthepumper

In your opinion. Not mine.

I could, but it was bloody obvious what I meant.

I did read it properly. Your response about the unspeakable comments was 'X is am MRa' why was that relevant to the unspeakable comments if not to ridiculously suggest that being an MRA is comparable?

[quote Butwasitherdriveway]@Pumperthepumper

In your opinion. Not mine.

I could, but it was bloody obvious what I meant.

I did read it properly. Your response about the unspeakable comments was 'X is am MRa' why was that relevant to the unspeakable comments if not to ridiculously suggest that being an MRA is comparable?[/quote]
Because that’s the kind of person that party attracts.

I’m not surprised you don’t see anything wrong with men’s rights activism, actually.

there is nothing wrong with being a MRA, and this is not relevant or comparable to the points made
Whoa!
What?!
Men’s Rights Activism often goes hand in hand with viewing women as lesser beings, wanting an end to sex safe spaces, being against positive discrimination re women in the workplace, being against women’s equality laws etc.

That is extremely relevant when you look at the aims of the party; wanting women at home and not working and obedient to their husband.
It speaks volumes.

@DiddlyWiddly and feminism can go hand in hand with all sort of batshittery.

I don't judge a whole group of people based on their beliefs. Ironically enough pumper was wide eyes on another thread asking how we can possibly think there's double standards on MN.

@Pumperthepumper I'm glad you're not surprised but frankly I couldn't care less.