Do I treat DC the same for Uni fees?

[teerocks]

Hi,

2 DC, both due to start Uni this September. DC1 is older and has done a 3 year apprenticeship and so has been told they will qualify as an independent student and get the maximum student loan. DC2 will be fresh out of 6th form and will only get the minimum loan due to our incomes.

I'll obviously need to top up DC2's to at least the maximum loan amount, but morally it feels like I should be offering DC1 the same.

Any thoughts?

In answer to the question from a few PP, yes, DC1 has lived at home for the past three years and paid a token amount of board to us. DC1 is therefore considerably better off than DC2, having savings, but has worked hard for it.

You should give so they have the same amount to spend, not receive the same amount from you.
And it doesn't matter if they have different size loans as no one ever pays the new ones off anyway.

I can answer this from my experience of being the "less favoured" child that I grew up angry and bitter and that sense of being second best, no matter what I achieved, never left me.

When I was same age as your DC2 (18ish) I wanted to take the internal qualifications of my chosen career. I would have got a full maintenance grant to pay my fees and general upkeep. However I had been working for 2 years and my parents had got used to a certain amount of money being tipped up for my "keep". They did not value education and my wish to qualify was seen as "faffing about being a student". They would only consent to the full time study if I was able to continue handing over the same amount for my "keep" as if I was working. That was impossible. I cannot tell you how angry and bitter I felt towards my parents, particularly as every pound I handed over seemed to go onto my sister's back to provide her with nice clothes.

Eventually I did manage to qualify but it took me three years of part time study where periods of employment alternated with study. As soon as I qualified I left home and I know my parents missed the money I had been earning.

I would urge you to treat the two DCs equally in the sense that they both have the same amount of money available.

Absolutely not. That’s insane. So long as they both have the same amount to spend that’s all that is all that is imprtant

I am guessing your first child had some support over the three years they did their apprenticeship in terms of living costs etc...

These things even themselves out without over thinking them. You give to the child who needs it and that will change over time. It's about equity not equality.

They need the same total currently. So no I wouldn't give dc1 any more unless there were genuine extra costs incurred.
What I give my dc will be based on what they need, how much they do for themselves to address that need and finally equality between siblings.

@teerocks

Zennudist the apprenticeship was Level 3 not degree, this will be a first degree for both of them.

So is your eldest older than 19?. Did they opt out of Alevels etc or not do well at school as didn't go at 18 so went the apprenticeship route?

As harsh as it sounds, I think that you presumably have supported financially their education to date and that's the equivalent of university length in addition to compulsory school and 6th form?

BusyLizzie61 DC1 did a year at college, then after work experience was offered an apprenticeship which is a rare opportunity in that industry, so left college and took it, but now needs a degree to progress any further in the industry. It might all be moot as there may be a possibility of a degree apprenticeship...

Totally agree that the most equal way is to take the same amount of loan debt on, and you top up both.

Fair is tricky. Do they both have the same fixed outgoings? Housing cost varies between cities.

If DC1 is getting the Mac loan then at the end of it he will have more to pay off, DC2 will have less and have had help from you

DC1 needs to take the same loan asDC2 then you support both the same outside of that. Thus we they finish Uni they both have the same amount of debt

I would top up the younger child and then I would help the older child pay off the extra loan in the future - so that you don't have to overstretch yourself now, but I would want neither to have more future debt than the other if possible.

Your older child has already had extra support through the apprenticeship, equal doesn't mean the same.

No. DC1 has been supported through an apprenticeship and doesn't NEED support through a degree. If you give DC1 the same though their degree as DC2 you'll need to top up DC2 after their degree so they get equal financial and practical support as DC1 did. Then what happens if one needs to move back home but the other doesn't, how will you ballance that?

Trying to give each child equal money will never work, you supported your child when they need it. DC1 doesn't need it, so there's no reason to. You want them to be independent, not always coming back to mummy for a top up or because the other one got something so they should have the same.

Good point CocoMarine - DC2's halls are more than DC1.

So DC 1 will get full loan of £8900ish and pay halls of £5700

DC2 will get minimum loan of £4700ish and halls are £7000

@Sarahandco

I would top up the younger child and then I would help the older child pay off the extra loan in the future - so that you don't have to overstretch yourself now, but I would want neither to have more future debt than the other if possible.

This!

Its a loan so your older child is basically taking on a larger debt which will need paid off. They always make it seem like its not a lot but over 10 years paying it I found a massive difference when I had repaid.

@MyGorramShip

No.

DC1 is getting the maximum loan, DC2 the minimum loan.

You need to make sure they have the same amount of money.

Fair doesn’t always mean equal.

This - with the caveat that if one of them is living in an expensive part of the country (London, obviously, but also places like Bristol are becoming surprisingly expensive) then they may need more rent money

Dc2 should have more money, so when they both go to university, they both have the same amount to spend.

Ie. If dc1 gets £1000, and dc2 gets £500, give dc2 £500.

If you live in England, student debt is pretty much irrelevant, it doesn't affect your credit score, you don't have bailiffs at your door, you can never pay it back and no one bats an eyelid so I don't think it factors in at all.

@memberofthewedding

I can answer this from my experience of being the "less favoured" child that I grew up angry and bitter and that sense of being second best, no matter what I achieved, never left me.

When I was same age as your DC2 (18ish) I wanted to take the internal qualifications of my chosen career. I would have got a full maintenance grant to pay my fees and general upkeep. However I had been working for 2 years and my parents had got used to a certain amount of money being tipped up for my "keep". They did not value education and my wish to qualify was seen as "faffing about being a student". They would only consent to the full time study if I was able to continue handing over the same amount for my "keep" as if I was working. That was impossible. I cannot tell you how angry and bitter I felt towards my parents, particularly as every pound I handed over seemed to go onto my sister's back to provide her with nice clothes.

Eventually I did manage to qualify but it took me three years of part time study where periods of employment alternated with study. As soon as I qualified I left home and I know my parents missed the money I had been earning.

I would urge you to treat the two DCs equally in the sense that they both have the same amount of money available.

Although a sad experience I’m not sure how this relates to the OP’s dilemma. And what the solution would be based on your experience.

Then no, you have been supporting DC1 with a house and food etc for three years, and this ultimately is what the top up loan will be used for. If you further top up dc1 then you would then be being unfair to dc2

@teerocks

Good point CocoMarine - DC2's halls are more than DC1.

So DC 1 will get full loan of £8900ish and pay halls of £5700

DC2 will get minimum loan of £4700ish and halls are £7000

Even more reason DC1 doesn't need extra support. Also bare in mind that DC1 got practical support when they were DC2s age but DC2 is moving out earlier, things like washing, cooking, financial planning and just the normal support you get from your parents while at home DC1 has benefitted from more than DC2.

For me I think it’s about equal opportunity rather than completely equal monetary amounts.

You are supporting both children’s life choices in the same way, by ensuring they can both go to uni, and you have supported your DC1 in their previous choices too.

As long as you continue in that vein I think it’s fine to top up DC2 but not DC1.

And if it was me I would hope that my children were decent enough human beings to understand that.

Me and my sister were in a similar but not identical position one of us chose to go to uni in an expensive town and one a cheaper town. My parents paid both of our rents, even though one was double the cost of the other. I can’t remember it ever being an issue. My brother never went to uni but my parents paid for his professional qualification expenses instead even though it was nowhere near the cost the 2 of us going uni but they gave us all equal opportunity and support to choose our own paths.

If you can afford it give them both the same or suggest DC1 takes less out in loans, or give them their share to pay off loans earlier.

No you should offer them the same amount to be fair.

Would it be fair for ds1 to have a 40k debt and for ds2 to have a 20k debt in three years time?