Would you find this a bit hurtful? Autistic friend

[amibeingharsh]

Mentioning my mate's autism because I can't bring up this niggle I have with her, because she'll get very distressed and upset and say she is still learning because of the autism. I know it would open a whole draining can of worms and I have zero energy for drama right now.

Mate reached out after a few months asking how i was. I'm alright but my mum was diagnosed with stage 4 ovarian cancer, which is obviously hard. My friend just says ah sorry to hear that and then starts banging on about her IBS and the fact she can't find a new cleaner.

I can't quite put my finger on why I find this hurtful, because she did after all acknowledge what I told her so maybe I'm being daft, but I just really feel like distancing myself from her. I have felt that in the past she's never very interested in anything with me - I'm genuinely interested in what she's up to, but it can start to feel one sided? But I could never broach it because she'll get very upset.

She is a lovely person, an old friend and I'm fond of her, but I'm just tired I think. So perhaps am not being fair. AIBU?

@amibeingharsh I have a good friend who is on the spectrum.
There are times when she could totally be supportive and able to listen, the way you think she should have.
There are times when she can’t. She just can’t.

I’ve learnt not to take that sort of answer personally or as a sign she doesn’t care/I can’t rely in her/the relationship is one sided.

I think you are expecting her to behave and react as if she was NT. and to give you the support SOME NT might be able to give you.
You are setting her to fail there.

friend asks if there is anything they can do and asks if you're ok and if you need to talk. They try and find out if there's anything they can do to support you. They don't give a glib response and then bang on about their own petty issues when your mum is so gravely ill; that's why you're upset.

Hmm... I know many NT who will do exactely that.
Because they dint know what to say. They don’t realise what stage 4 cancer means (I’m looking at you DH). They realise that you need support but are very uncomfortable, worried you are going to start crying, they will be uncomfortable and not know what you say or how to react....

The answer along the lines of ‘what can I do to help you?’ and more ‘do you want to talk about it?’ Are unlikely answers Ime.

Another autistic person here. I have very high levels of cognitive and emotional empathy but struggle with compassionate empathy, which, of course, is the type people want you to have. So I can understand on an intellectual level how a situation might be making you feel and if I see someone crying (even on television) I will also cry a lot of the time, which can be an inappropriate response. But I struggle with the compassionate being spontaneously moved to help on an emotional level. Instead I would probably do something practical to assist you or buy you something to make you smile, to show I care. I am sorry about your mum. My parent is also very recently diagnosed with a stage 4 cancer and it is very difficult.

I'm autistic and don't find this thread disablist. OP must be going through hell with this and is entitled to her own feelings too.

You think autistic people should mask to suit society?

Yes, I think we should, in certain circumstances. Serious illness and bereavement are definitely circumstances where it warrants tiring ourselves out a bit.

@MaxNormal

You think autistic people should mask to suit society?

Yes, I think we should, in certain circumstances. Serious illness and bereavement are definitely circumstances where it warrants tiring ourselves out a bit.

I asked that question to someone who said autism is not a 'get out of jail free card' a poster who suggested women over 30 can mask be sue the understand 'that's what caring people in a society do'

There is masking, which I do for myself and there is an expectation that I should change who I am to suit society and that is not ok.

If you think that's acceptable then fair enough, but I am absolutely sick of people misunderstanding autism and suggesting we all need to change our behaviour for the benefit of others.

I think often when we tell someone some bad news about us they don’t know what to say, maybe feel a bit uncomfortable and often all they can say is ah Ok I’m very sorry about that. I don’t think she was being rude I think she just didn’t know what to say and was worried about upsetting you by saying anything. Perhaps she will check in on you in a day or so and ask how your doing and your mum and family.

I had a long standing kind-of friend and a life long best friend.

Life long best friend got stage 4 breast cancer at the age of 31 and when I told kind-of friend, she went
"Oh no.... guess what! Me and DD are going to New York for her 15th!"

She didn't have autism though. She was just a horrible cunt. It was a line of arsehole stuff she did and I took great satisfaction in blocking her from
my life.

OP YANBU. But I'm hoping it was a genuine misreading of the room.

@CornishLover

I take issue with the deaf comment because autism is on a spectrum. Heck, even hearing impairment is on a spectrum and varies. So your analogy is kind of offensive actually. Setting the bar blankly low for autism actually does people with autism a disservice because not all of them are incapable of showing care and consideration.

Autism is not a get out of jail card, though. Many people with autism once over 30s can 'mask', particularly women with autism they develop the skills to 'act' like they care even if they don't fully feel like they care because they grow to understand this is what caring people in a society do.

No one is saying it's a get out of jail card. Fuck you and the ableist horse you road in on.

@Phi1618

What an ableist thread.

For real. I feel bad for OP as her needs have clearly been missed by her friend and she’s allowed her feelings about that. However, you also can’t force an autistic person into a neurotypical mould or be mad at them because they don’t respond how a NT would.

The way to address this is by communicating with the friend. Chances are the autistic friend either didn’t know how to handle the disclosure, or could have misread or mis-assumed what OP needed. In my experience with AS and other neurotypes through work, family and personal experience (I have ADHD) if the person has encountered a situation before and handled it a certain way (or been told to handle it a certain way) then they might apply that to all similar situations. Friend might not realise that different people might need different responses to such a disclosure. She may believe, for example, that it could be too upsetting for OP to talk about and she may make it worse by asking questions, or that it may be too private to ask questions about and she may appear rude by doing so.

TL:DR - you don’t know why friend responded as she did unless you ask her.

I think people are missing the second part of your post about how if you raised it with her she would just get upset. It sounds like she has a tendency for things to always be all about her. I would back off from her for a bit, as she's unlikely to give you the support that you need - whatever the reason. You feel what you feel and it's OK to lean on other friends instead.
Sorry about your mum

Some people are good when you have a personal crisis and some people just aren’t. It doesn't seem to have a correlation with how close they are or how ‘good’ a friend. It’s disappointing but maybe doesn’t mean you need to write her off or that its got anything to do with her autism.

Hope you’ve got support from elsewhere OP.

I'd find it hurtful and being there in a crisis is what differentiates between a true friend and a friendly acquaintance for me.

Yanbu. Your friend probably didn’t mean to be so dismissive, but you are not unreasonable to be hurt. Sometimes it is your driend who needs extra understanding and TLC. But this time it’s you, so give yourself some space from her if it would help. You can tell her that you’re not feeling up to socialising while your mum is so ill. When you feel resilient enough, you can pick up the friendship again.

dd2 has very recently been diagnosed with HFA and clearly masked quite alot and at the age of 13 developed debilitating anxiety and now barely leaves the house.
Expecting a neurodiverse person to behave in a nt way is not on.
Op I am very sorry about your mother but your friend cannot be blamed fir her reaction.
Thinking about it since dd was diagnosed I have started to suspect dh is neurodiverse as he has said some sorctscurly insensitive stuff.

My dd’s friend is only 12. But she’s got oodles of empathy and can be very sweet. Other people with autism don’t show this capacity and can be pretty transactional. It’s not personal, just their physiological make up. The same can be said with people, who are NT.

You know your friend isn’t capable of giving you the support you need. Is there anyone else, who you can lean on?

I don't think every friend is going to meet all your needs for all situations, without bringing autism into it at all.

I have friends who I turn to when I need a laugh and a chat, without things getting too intense.

I have other friends who I know will always respond with extreme empathy and say all the right things when I'm having a crisis.

All we can do is be our best selves and try to be good friends, it's understandable if people aren't saying just the right things when you need, and it's okay to withdraw a bit if they aren't helping in your time of need. I wouldn't bother bringing it up with her, just try to take care of yourself and look for support with other people.

I totally get your feelings and they're completely valid.

Having that said, one of my sisters has autism - she's the sweetest and would never mean to offend anyone but she just doesn't have those social cues. She would probably do something like this because it's a sensitive situation and relies on subtle social perceptions - she wouldn't be able to tell if you wanted to talk about it or not.

So I think YANBU for how you feel, and for distancing yourself for now if you need to for self-care, but I also wouldn't blame your friend as she did reach out and it seems like she tried to be supportive, but she has an impairment she can't help.

@GreenTeaPingPong

I think people are missing the second part of your post about how if you raised it with her she would just get upset. It sounds like she has a tendency for things to always be all about her. I would back off from her for a bit, as she's unlikely to give you the support that you need - whatever the reason. You feel what you feel and it's OK to lean on other friends instead. Sorry about your mum

Again this is ableist. Do you have any idea where it is like to go through life always d see one how misunderstanding? Always getting your social cues wrong, despite really wanting to have reciprocated and enduring friendships. She’s probably upset with issues like this because no matter how hard she tries she isn’t ‘getting it right’, which is actually I would argue proof that she does care.

I think people are missing the second part of your post about how if you raised it with her she would just get upset. It sounds like she has a tendency for things to always be all about her.

Goodness

I didn't miss this part, I just fully understand that raising someone's social differences due to autism in a critical way is a bit cunty. It's not that we want to make things about us, it's that we actual don't know how to do things differently to suit you.

My closest friend had such traits. But I've simply had to learn that he's not the person I can turn to in this kind of situation. He is at a loss and simply doesn't know what to do or say. The best I can hope for is a "sorry to hear that".

I wish things were different and despite not blaming him, it does hurt a bit. But I know he cares and worries for me a lot. He just doesn't have the tools to help me. In other ways he's a great friend. I just have to recognise his limitations and turn to others if I need emotional support.

@Moulesvinrouge1

I kind of disagree. If OP went back to friend and said, "oh, what you did last time didn't work for me and you need to do x if you want to do it correctly" I would get how that's upsetting.

However, if OP sent a text to her friend saying "Hey, I'm upset today about my mum, so I'd like to talk about that with you when you come over if that's ok?" nobody is accusing anyone of anything, they are just clearly spelling out what they need from the interaction today. If friend can't provide that, fair enough, but that's not necessarily because of autism. It could be, but it doesn't have to be. Assuming that friend is unable to provide what OP needs by just saying "well, they're autistic", is to me no better than expecting friend to behave like a neurotypical person.

However, if OP sent a text to her friend saying "Hey, I'm upset today about my mum, so I'd like to talk about that with you when you come over if that's ok?" nobody is accusing anyone of anything, they are just clearly spelling out what they need from the interaction today. If friend can't provide that, fair enough, but that's not necessarily because of autism. It could be, but it doesn't have to be. Assuming that friend is unable to provide what OP needs by just saying "well, they're autistic", is to me no better than expecting friend to behave like a neurotypical person.

Please stop being so dismissive of the difficulties people with autism can face in these situations.

Autism and the person are not separate. Autism isn't something we 'use' sometimes, or switch on and off. If someone with a social and communication disorder has problems in this situation then it's blindingly obvious it's down to that.

One autistic person is one autistic person though. My friend who is autistic is kind and empathetic, she can express empathy. Whereas OP’s friend clearly can’t.

Also I don’t think that it actually 100% matters why the OP’s friend upset her, it still happened, OP’s feelings are still relevant. You can say it was her being autistic that is a mitigation but actually the OP doesn’t have to continue to put herself in a position where she’s going to get even more upset because her friend’s feelings trump hers. They don’t. She is within her rights to withdraw for a bit until the friendship can continue on a level that both parties can engage with.