My 16yo DS and his girlfriend (Part 2)

[workworkworkugh]

Just opening a new thread as I believe the other one is getting full.
Will try and link the old one

I'd also be keen to message DS regularly to remind him that he is part of your family and very much loved.

Grey rock is fine, but he is yours and that can't be overstated.

The 'roof over head' comment is obviously designed to act as a poking stick to you. Don't react, leave it.

@Brokenpencilsarepointless

I am glad that there are some people that remain a bit more unbiased among the constant blaming of the other parents and the girl. Even reading the first few posts and initial thread’s OP, it was quite clear that OP's son was quite a bit of a brat and rather antagonistic, refusing to accept rules. I keep shaking my head at the sheer irony and actual hypocrisy to accuse the girl's parents of ineffective parenting when OP is just as bad, to the point her son now lives somewhere else and not with the grandparents. Has it ever occurred to OP and anyone else that the son is adding fuel to the fire and somewhat telling porkies too? The victim narrative comes solely from OP who seems to minimise and downplay her son’s part in the drama. It's actually just as likely that he, as so many teenagers, is fuelling the drama just as much as the girl. Yes, the texts the girl sent are appalling. But we really don’t know what precipitated them coming from OP’s own son, plus he’s being utterly disloyal to his mother. Throughout all of this, he has behaved quite appalling himself. Instead of blaming the other parents, focus on parenting your own child!

I wish posters would stop victim blaming OP's son.

He's acting like a normal teenager and also like an abuse victim.

He's not the one sending screaming abusive voice notes, threatening to self harm, saying friends/family must be cut-off or suggesting to kill OP.

Big gap in behaviour there between abuser and victim.

'Alleged victim'...

Big gap in behaviour there between abuser and victim.

Exactly.

Plenty of domestic abuse victims behave in ways that alienate their families and friends. This is often driven by the abuser as part of the coercive control as a strategy to isolate their victim from their support network.

It's important to recognise who is driving the behaviour and the enoumous power wielded by coercive controllers. Blaming victims for their actions when subjected to this control helps ensure that they can't escape.

At what age is he allowed to leave school

Look up the karpman drama triangle. You are all caught up in it and switching roles.

So agree with this. You're all fully immersed in the drama and OP you have until now played victim, rescuer and perpetrator. As have all the other players.

The only way out is to step out of the drama. Don't engage with it. There are good sites advising how to leave the drama triangle. X

.

[quote Thermopylae]@workworkworkugh, I have a teenage son myself, and I feel for you and your whole family caught up in this incredibly difficult situation. Unfortunately I also have personal experience of abusive relationships, coercive control and toxic family dynamics. Please don't think that you should have known instinctively how to handle your DS's situation right from the start. People like your DS's GF and her mother operate according to a completely different set of rules, and unless you've come across people like this before, it's easy to remain unaware that a different rule-book even exists! In many ways it's like dealing with an alien species - all the normal expectations of behaviour and social interaction go out the window.

You've already had excellent advice from other posters to "grey rock" as much as possible. I would strongly suggest that you do not respond at all to the implied accusation that your DS was kicked out of home, however much the injustice of that stings. You can't reason irrational people out of a fantasy they have a vested interest in maintaining. The minute you try to defend yourself, you give the GF and her mother the oxygen of credibility - their accusation and your response become two sides with equal weight in an argument. If you don't respond, their accusation just dangles in the air like the piece of batshit gaslighting it really is.

I agree with previous posters that keeping a line of communication open with your DS is important, but I think any attempt to establish a two-way dialogue with him - even asking innocuous questions like what his plans are for the day - will be misrepresented by his GF as an attempt by you to exert parental control. With this in mind, I suggest you keep your communication one-way - text him mundane bits of news about family or friends every few days, or send him links to Youtube videos etc he might enjoy. In other words, keep the communication channel open without demanding anything in return from him - not because it isn't reasonable for you to expect a response from your own son, but because any expectation will be twisted by GF (and her mother) to appear unreasonable.

You might find the book "Toxic In-Laws" by Susan Forward helpful for providing some insight into your DS's behaviour as well as that of his GF and her parents.

To the posters who are so keen to point the finger at the OP's DS - stop victim-blaming. This is an adolescent caught up in an abusive relationship. You've only got to read the Relationships section of MN to realise that some grown adults take years to finally free themselves, mentally and physically, from abusive relationships like this one (and some never manage it at all). Along the way, plenty of adults in abusive relationships ignore help, don't listen to advice, fall out with family and friends over their abusive partner. Why on earth should we expect someone who isn't even legally an adult yet to handle this situation any better? This young man is acting out with his parents because he's overwhelmed and petrified, and his parents are safe targets - they don't threaten to self-harm if he gets angry or upset or disagrees with them. I can only assume the posters eager to vilify the OP's DS have never been on the receiving end of abusive behaviour themselves - try having some compassion for people who haven't been so fortunate.[/quote]
I agree with all of this too.

And I also agree that the messages to your son shouldn't be daily - too overwhelming - but regular, maybe every 2-3 days, with just "we love you and this happened at home/with your siblings" - no pressure.

I particularly agree that your son is behaving like this because he's under so much pressure from this girl. He doesn't have the maturity to deal with it any better, and doesn't know what to do with himself, so is taking it out on you because he knows you will still love him whatever. EVEN THOUGH he's accusing you of all sorts, he still knows you love him.

Hang on in there - ignore the mother entirely now - and hopefully this will burn itself out and you'll have him home again soon.

It's important to recognise who is driving the behaviour and the enoumous power wielded by coercive controllers. Blaming victims for their actions when subjected to this control helps ensure that they can't escape.

This is important to recognise. The DS is the victim. OP is suffering, not because of her son’s so-called brattish behaviour but because she can see what this girl is putting him through and she wants to protect him.

It is so important to keep communication open to let him know he is loved and can come home any time. I agree not to overwhelm with too many messages - every 2-3 days is fine. I have also been persuaded that there is no point replying to the mother, though I would have been fizzing.

@Yarboosucks - I have mentioned grooming a couple of times. I said that they have evidence showing grooming from when the OP’s DS was underage, and their DD was also. I can’t understand why the police or DOCS (our SS) wouldn’t be interested in this really sick setup.

*The mother of the girlfriend is one step short of pimping for her in a “MUST HAVE BOYFRIEND AT ANY COST” kind of way, as though there is a competition between the mothers above all.

I replied on your last thread OP as I have a nephew who has been going through the exact same thing. In that case, his family took a massive step back and he basically was with her parents 24/7. They were less fawning than in your case as they had major issues of their own playing out. He is now home and broken up from her, after about 3 years of it, basically because once he was there all the time he simply could not keep up with the level of attention she required and the histrionics when she didn't get it. He tried, and it nearly broke him; all the while like all of these personality types she sensed when the feed was waning and started seeking attention elsewhere. So after all that jealousy and control and rage, she cheated on him!

It's a shocker. I only hope her dad steps in but I agree with what you are doing. Keep up bland but loving contact, this is what we are doing, we miss you, the door is always open, our boundaries will always stand but they are made with love. Otherwise let the drama be on him. I sincerely hope it burns out before he screws up his education or she gets pregnant.

I really feel like you have got yourself so wound up over this that you are now trying to control the uncontrollable. I don't think that you should be checking his texts or phone. Going to the police, your drs, talking to the school, confronting her in the presence of her parents, keeping your son off school for a week, considering getting a lawyer etc is all very heavy handed.
What does it matter what a 15 year old girl posts on her social media about you? Anyone worth salt will see it for what it is. It will reflect far more poorly upon her than you. Also, I don't see a huge issue with how your son reacted when you told him that he was welcome to live elsewhere. Of course he will then interpret this as you not caring. He's a teenager and you gave him an answer that he didn't want to hear. I also don't think that it's a big issue if he were to go for relationship counselling with her. He will likely learn /come to realise what is normal in a healthy relationship and how to speak up for himself. I don't think that it will necessarily get them to work on their relationship as much as teach them about respect, listening, boundaries etc. That said though, it seems ott to send teenagers for relationship counselling. I would question whether your husband and you going for counseling is also going to be helpful. It is sending the message to yourself that you are unable to cope with this issue alone. It is causing you to focus more and more on the issue, which in turn, is raising your anxiety levels. The one thing that I have learned about anxiety/worrying over the years is that some problems just can't be resolved by dwelling on them. You need to give yourself time to switch off from them and take a step back. Then when you revisit them they will seem far less problematic. I think that you need to do something fun once a week that will allow you to switch off. You sound like you could do with a good night out with some friends. Take a step back, focus on your other kids too and enjoy your time with them and just try to look after yourself. That is something that you can at least control.

So sorry you’re dealing with this still!!

@Hugoslavia

I'm not sure 'doing something fun once a week' will really cut it for OP.
You seem to be minimising the deep concerns that most parents would feel, given their 16 year old school age child has opted/been coerced into leaving home to live with his very controlling and manipulative girlfriend and very dysfunctional family.

Just wondered - is it worth giving him a codeword that he can text or say to you and you will go and pick him up, no questions asked, if it gets too bad? He probably would resist discussing it right now, but if you just kept telling him it he might use it when/if needed. That way he can call for help without her knowing and you will know that he wants out.

We have used this successfully with our kids.

bertfulks.com/2017/02/23/x-plan-giving-your-kids-a-way-out-xplan/

itwa oh yes, I remember seeing that and think it's fab, but in this case I think the codeword needs to iniate them just coming and getting him..any phone calls of "somethings come up/we need to come and get you" will instigate a meltdown from the GF. OP's son needs a one word alert which has them arriving on the doorstep and not taking no for an answer.

I think a code word is a good idea. Perhaps introduced if you have an in person conversation we love you, you have a home to come to and we will respond and collect if for any reason you want to return. We had a code that could be used if DC wanted out for any reason. "How is Grandma" Grandmother never referred to as Grandma so would normally not use that word. We can then reply "She is really ill we need to come and get you now" no loss of face and a valid reason to collect.

I think jellybeanteaparty's idea is a great one. You could also give him a PAYG mobile phone with some credit in it for him to use if necessary. I watched the documentary referred to on the last thread and recall that one of the things the GF did in that case was to remove all forms of communication from her partner.

How are his sporting activities getting on? I recall from the previous thread that your DS was quite sporty. If he is still involved in anything could you offer to give him a lift?

The code is a good idea if/when we are able to see him next.

@applesandpears33 he hasn't gone to training this week and we already know the Mum/GF is taking him to his game this weekend, it's in town so we will still go and watch as we've never missed a game yet.

He asked to pick up more of his stuff today and when we said he could come in and get it he made every excuse for us to leave it outside and he would pick it up.
He seems to really really not want to see us face to face.

@workworkworkugh

The code is a good idea if/when we are able to see him next.

@applesandpears33 he hasn't gone to training this week and we already know the Mum/GF is taking him to his game this weekend, it's in town so we will still go and watch as we've never missed a game yet.

He asked to pick up more of his stuff today and when we said he could come in and get it he made every excuse for us to leave it outside and he would pick it up.
He seems to really really not want to see us face to face.

Maybe because he knows he'll break down. Or he's projecting his anger onto you guys, rather than the psycho controlling GF.

Reassure him that he needs to come in and get it, as you miss him and would like to see him.

I feel so sad for you.

Sounds like he's under instructions not to set foot over your threshold.

Or else.