to believe the Mumsnet High Earners?

[LigPatin]

Every time there's a thread about earnings, there's always multiple posters who claim that most people on the thread must be inflating or plain lying about their salaries.

Whilst I recognise that people lie, especially on anonymous forums, I find it quite sad that people prefer to dismiss these posts as lies rather than take inspiration/education from them (or just not care).

I come from a poor background - we never had enough money to the point that food and electricity use was rationed. We weren't on the streets, but that was a looming possibility. We lived (mostly) within the midlands.

I fell into nannying as a career (having dreamed of being a primary school teacher) and my first job was in Kensington. The housekeeper had been gossiping about the rent on the house we worked in - it was £3k a WEEK. This was 2012-ish. I remember wondering how on Earth anyone could afford paying £200k+ a year on rent alone, when - in my mind - earning just £50k was amazingly rich.

I remember walking through Kensington and Knightsbridge and Chelsea and seeing thousands and thousands and thousands of these houses, all huge and grand and all presumably commanding similar rent or sale value than the one I worked in. They were all clearly lived in and used.

Perhaps it was arrogance, or naivety, but I figured that if there were enough people who could afford to pay £1k, £2k, £5k+ a week on rent (or buy million pound houses), then there must be a lot of money out there to be earned, and I couldn't see any reason as to why I couldn't find a way to get a share of that money.

That's sort of how I feel about these earning threads - hundreds of people are posting about their high salaries and instead of scoffing that they must be sad-sacks who hang out on Mumsnet to lie about their lifestyles - I think it's inspiring and encouraging to see so many women out there making amazing money and securing their futures.

FWIW - I was 21 back in Kensington, amazed at the £3k a week rent. I'm coming up to 30 now and my average yearly income is about £120k. I remind myself every day of how lucky I am, and how 21 year old me would have been incredulous. Though I'm, of course, absolutely nowhere near being able to rent a £3k a week house

I totally believe that it's possible to leap from a low salary to 120k in a few years. Especially as the OP has said she is in recruitment, which is essentially Sales. People in sales that are good at their job can earn wads!

ClarkeGriffin I agree, I don't think people realise how much they give away on FB. I have had several voluntary roles in the past where we have had to recruit people for various things and you pop their name into FB and all sorts comes up. I also do this with prospective tenants ;-). Its all public information that people are sharing.

Part of the issue is people like @littlepattilou believing that there's no way that someone on £100k + has 5 minutes to scroll through active threads on MN. It's the kind of thinking that stops women getting on the early tracks that take you to bigger jobs.

I may be working longer hours than my childhood friends in retail, but my salary pays for a cleaner, for a nanny, so I don't need to scramble for nursery pickup/dropoff/inset, my job is able to work from home so I don't have a commute, and so long as I get the work done there's no need to clock on, clock off, or have my time monitored. It does mean occasional weekend work and emails, but on the flip side, it means never having to make excuses about heading out for a school event.

£100k doesn't put you in the top 1% of earners, that's well over double that. It's not the right path for everyone or achievable for everyone for a ton of reasons, but if our daughters (or sons) want it and they have the basic skills, we shouldn't be teaching them that senior jobs are some kind of 24/7 inaccessible few.

@Ohpulltheotherone I know why you’ve asked this and I’ve always wanted to know about others too as that actually gives you inspiration. I’ve earnt £130k+ since I was 28 (closer to £200k for a number of years pre kids). A bit lower now since I’ve taken maternities and reduced workload but I can turn on the tap and increase it whenever I like. Most of my network earn similar.

The general common factors amongst us all- work for yourself (exception is dentists/doctors we know); have a wide network and be well connected; education level (top degrees at top universities); be confident; and unfortunately have come from a bit of money to start with (doesn’t have to be loads but enough to have a little cushion when starting out eg help with rent/house deposit).

We are directors of our own limited companies which allow you to reduce tax liabilities and invest in a wider variety of ways thereby growing your bank balance by a larger margin annually. I’m a strategy consultant so I freelance and work for various companies helping them to develop their strategies for the future. Once I’ve finished a contract, I normally have the next contract lined up already due to my network. But it’s taken me years to build a network and I have to work hard at maintaining it. It’s not a walk in the park. Most of my network who earn similar, work for larger corporate companies who typically pay higher rates for contracting or senior level work.

Obviously the more you earn, the more you can invest and the higher your returns without even having to go to work anymore. The more risk you can take on investments as you can afford to lose more. It’s true when they say the rich can get rich quicker.

I am have stopped for lunch so I think I can dick around on MN for a few minutes. I am a consultant in financial services in London and I earn very well. I only post about it because I want women to be aware that they have as much right as the men to go for the high earning roles if that is what they want.
I am not morally superior for earning more. I don’t work harder than a nurse on a 12 hr shift in an acute ward. I did benefit from right place at the right time in my career.

I don’t have to clock exact 9-5 hours. What I do need to be able to do is deliver the required output, to a high standard in the required timeframe. People are paying me to hit the ground running and pick up whatever they need me to do with minimal handholding. They pay for my knowledge and experience.

I am a high earner because I work in a well paid sector and because someone without my experience could not do what I am doing as effectively as me.

High earning women are more common in some sectors so in my areas financial services and law in the City we are not so unusual. Undoubtedly, the City is a bubble and doesn’t reflect reality for most people.

@supermoonrising how do you earn six figures in ESL? Just curious, as I previously worked in the industry and loved it but just couldn't live with the poor pay. Even with my Delta and years of experience, all the jobs I could find only offered a pittance and freelance material writing work was hard to come by.

@BListOrMaybeEvenZList

I totally believe that it's possible to leap from a low salary to 120k in a few years. Especially as the OP has said she is in recruitment, which is essentially Sales. People in sales that are good at their job can earn wads!

But the OP has only been in recruitment for a very short period of time by her time line as she said she's been a Nanny for 10 years and she was nannying at 21 and the light bulb moment in her post happened in 2012 and yet she's now nearly 30??

I didn't get the impression the OP was trying to inspire anyone, just making a point about the fake disbelief about high salaries,

and the fact that you don't have to come from Eton to have a high earning job if you want one.

Not meaning to derail the thread into another state/private discussion, but this article I find quite staggering.

“The IOE researchers discovered that the mean average weekly wage of someone who had gone to private school was £557 whereas it was £401 among state school pupils. (at age 25)

Even when socio-economic background was accounted for, the wage difference was 17 per cent in favour of those who were privately educated. When GCSE and A level grades were factored in, as well as their university, the salaries of privately educated adults were still 10 per cent ahead.”

www.ucl.ac.uk/ioe/news/2019/nov/private-school-pupils-earn-more-state-school-pupils-age-25-ioe-research-reveals

Even assuming that gap stays stable and doesn’t increase furthe over a 40/50 year career (v.unlikely) that means a privately educated child makes £300k+ more over their career. Realistically, probably more than £500k+ (not including interest/investment of increased earnings, which could realistically push the average towards £1 million). Certainly seems to pay for itself and then some.

See I love that @gwenneh. It’s really interesting.

I think it's terribly sad that the majority of people on MN these days go straight to disbelieving a post from the off rather than giving advice and support like they used to on here. In the beginning there were v few trolls though.

"My 120k salary puts me in the top 1% of adults by income and if you think positively, you could all be in that 1% too!"

I don't think there's that much room in the top 1% though is there? I'm not being facetious when I say that.

If we all manage to achieve the "dream" of 120k a year jobs, who does the OP envisage driving the taxis and teaching the weans? Or should all the teachers and taxi drivers get 120k too? When the price of a haircut quadruples to cover the hairdressers' payrises, 120k is not going to look all that impressive, is it? What actually buys you something isn't having a high salary in itself, but a high salary in relation to other people, at least when you're buying anything that is labour intensive to make (haircuts, fancy cars) or where you have to compete with other people, like buying property.

Haven’t read all the posts on this thread. There was a similar one the other day too.
It definitely isn’t ‘normal’ to earn a 6 figure salaries or anywhere near that figure in the uk.

www.ifs.org.uk/tools_and_resources/where_do_you_fit_in

Left school after A levels with good grades, despite being severely dyslexic. Began training as a deck officer with a large worldwide petroleum company. Moved into cargo quality inspection and then into working at a refinery. Applied for a similar position with a Canadian oil company who were actively recruiting in the U.K. They assisted with relocation and obtaining permanent residency. Started as a shift supervisor ten years ago. Now a Director. Salary and benefits package worth £300K.

I didn’t post on the other pay thread, but I’m surprised by the assumptions from many posters about high earning women. The assumptions seem to be that higher earners are motivated by money, they don’t value spending time with their family, they work really hard all the time and don’t have time to go on mumsnet in the middle of the day, they are all in law/finance/something super corporate and dull and don’t love their work, that they look down on anyone earning an average or low amount as lazy or not hardworking, that if you don’t see a salary being advertised it doesn’t exist, that they were born with a silver spoon in their mouths, that they aren’t ‘nice’ people.

Most of all, I’m surprised that posters are insistent that they could never earn these sums, that it’s impossible and that even if it were possible life would be horrible if they earned more so they wouldn’t want to anyway.

I think some if these assumptions are really not true. Some people do earn lots of money for doing a job or running a business they enjoy and they do even get to take holidays and tea breaks...

[quote enidblyton33]Haven’t read all the posts on this thread. There was a similar one the other day too.
It definitely isn’t ‘normal’ to earn a 6 figure salaries or anywhere near that figure in the uk.

www.ifs.org.uk/tools_and_resources/where_do_you_fit_in[/quote]
Nobody is suggesting it is normal as in the standard thing that everyone does. The point is that earning 6 figures is something that a “normal” person can aspire to and doesn’t require superhuman qualities or being very very lucky or privileged. That does not mean that every “normal” person can achieve it, but “normal” people should not automatically assume that it is impossible, “not for the likes of me” etc.

I don’t usually comment on salary posts, but there’s a lot of misconceptions on here about what’s realistic:

1. “that people earning over £100k don’t have time to post on MN”. That’s not true, especially whilst many are wfh. I work 9-5, with an hour for lunch, it’s not particularly challenging and I earn significantly more than that. I’m highly specialised though, so when I have a big case/project/issue to resolve, it’s intense for short bursts and I negotiate and save my company a lot of money. Plenty of opportunity to post online, spend hours on Insta, plan our renovations, walk my DC to school in the morning etc.

2. “that nannies don’t earn much”. That’s a misconception too. Our nanny earns £40k with a few years’ experience, but she also has a degree and diploma from Norland College. Her earning potential is high. Other nannies I interviewed (with more experience, but not the formal Norland education) were £50k+. I paid the nanny agency 13% of her annual salary as a finders fee. It’s believable that the OP could earn £120k if she’s managing her own agency. It’s not a high cost business to run, so 1 placement a week could kick off a good turnover.

You have what they call a 'growth mindset', OP. Very few people do, and there's little point in encouraging them to try and change their thinking.

I work in an industry where salaries start low but can grow very quickly if you're good. I've also always been surrounded by ambitious people who would never think 'just because the average salary is x, that's what I should aim for'. It's part luck, part disposition.

@Rozziie
With my partner, we set up our own school in a smallish (cheap) city for four years and grew it to a 100+ students. Then closed the school but simulataneously opened an online but quite specialized course (which included some real-time elements) which I marketed to those students and all their acquaintances. Now have several hundred students.

Total timeline to six figure salary was about ten years though, so hardly an overnight success. First couple of years was just earning about a grand a month. Though total workload has rarely gone over 15 hours a week.

I joined MN many years ago. I read a thread about the inequality in pay between men and women. Some of the the posters pointed out that many women were underselling themselves and as a result were being paid less than men with equivalent and experience. Some posters on the thread gave advice on how to draft a request for a pay rise
The next day , I put in a request for a pay rise and got it.
Rather than criticise and berate high earners, ask them questions about how they achieved such high wages if that is what you aspire to.
No one is saying that those in high powered jobs work harder than others , they are simply saying that one should not limit oneself.
By discrediting or doubting posters who say that they earn well, you are already limiting yourself

@HouseyHouse21

You have what they call a 'growth mindset', OP. Very few people do, and there's little point in encouraging them to try and change their thinking.

I work in an industry where salaries start low but can grow very quickly if you're good. I've also always been surrounded by ambitious people who would never think 'just because the average salary is x, that's what I should aim for'. It's part luck, part disposition.

Agree

I have to say as a lifetime NHS worker I’m finding this very interesting. Is a common thread the ability to spot an opportunity and willingness to move jobs as opportunities arise/ step out of your comfort zone and maybe be willing to relocate geographically ? Too late for me I have been very risk averse and not super money minded. But I’m thinking of my kids!

Cool story bro

I don't all will be liars but some will exaggerate.

What I found more unbelievable is the amount who seem to be on 30k & 3 yrs later earn 120k. Imo that's pretty rare & most of the high earning sectors and roles are still dominated by men & people who already have privilege of some kind.