Woman 80s, Savaged to Death by Dogs, Birmingham

[Flaxmeadow]

A woman in her 80s has been savaged to death by neighbours dogs
Am I being unreasonable to want much stricter controls on keeping dogs as pets

People can absolutely report dogs that they have REASON to believe could be a threat. Them existing off lead isn’t a reason

Off lead is a threat, if the dog (who only the owner knows/believe they know) is capable of overpowering someone and especially overpowering a child

If I was sat with my family in a park and a small dog approached us off lead, even a dog known by statistics to be more likely bite, then I would probably not report it. Because I know I or the owner could overpower it, if it growled at, bared its teeth at, or went to bite me or my family.

It is a very different scenario if it's a large and powerful dog, with large jaws, large neck muscle, heavy etc. I would automatically "worry", and so be well within my rights to report it. That is the law

People can absolutely report dogs that they have REASON to believe could be a threat. Them existing off lead isn’t a reason

Also to add to this
Your comment seems to imply that only the owner of a dog knows or perceives the threat, the "worry". That only the owner has "reason"

People read about in local papers, or hear about from neighbours and friends, dog attacks all the time.

You don't have to own a dog to understand the shocking statistics on how many people are hospitalized every single day by dog bite injuries.

In this country. On average, over 20 people - many of them children, many with life changing injuries- are admitted onto hospital wards EVERY SINGLE DAY, with dog bit injuries. Every day doctors and surgeons have to piece back together skin, muscle and bone injuries due to "dog bite injuries" and the number is increasing. This has to change

@Flaxmeadow

People can absolutely report dogs that they have REASON to believe could be a threat. Them existing off lead isn’t a reason

Off lead is a threat, if the dog (who only the owner knows/believe they know) is capable of overpowering someone and especially overpowering a child

If I was sat with my family in a park and a small dog approached us off lead, even a dog known by statistics to be more likely bite, then I would probably not report it. Because I know I or the owner could overpower it, if it growled at, bared its teeth at, or went to bite me or my family.

It is a very different scenario if it's a large and powerful dog, with large jaws, large neck muscle, heavy etc. I would automatically "worry", and so be well within my rights to report it. That is the law

You've not answered. If a dog comes up to you it isnt under control. So you should report. Say it was no where near you minding its own business?

@justkeepswimming0

Why do people insist it isn't about breeds? Of course it is. My King Charles cavalier isn't going to kill someone. He's got the patience of a saint with kids (and my toddler really pushes it with him sometimes). He's basically a teddy bear and we are a busy family, apart from a couple of puppy classes and us teaching him to 'high five' he is this way because that is the temperament of his breed.

I don't care how much of a 'softie' your German Shepherd / insert other breed here is - they have proven capable of doing serious damage, size alone they are a risk. One came bounding up, off lead to my cavalier on a walk and nearly killed him, threw him around like a rag doll. Then his owner called me a cunt!

Too many potentially aggressive breeds have become common household pets.

Why do you let your toddler test your dogs patience? This is so unfair.

I would agree with stricter controls. I think dogs should have to be registered to their owners in some way, much like cars.
People should have to have vet insurance and dogs should only be allowed to be sold through registered sellers.
Fed up with hearing about dangerous diseases, but also irresponsible dog owener who don’t clear up after their dog or keep their dog in good health.

@AIMD

I would agree with stricter controls. I think dogs should have to be registered to their owners in some way, much like cars. People should have to have vet insurance and dogs should only be allowed to be sold through registered sellers. Fed up with hearing about dangerous diseases, but also irresponsible dog owener who don’t clear up after their dog or keep their dog in good health.

Dogs are registered to their owners, that’s why microchipping is mandatory. I agree with you that insurance should be too.

You've not answered. If a dog comes up to you it isnt under control. So you should report. Say it was no where near you minding its own business

If it was a powerful looking dog off lead that I believe could cause physical injury and that could outrun me or a child, then I probably would yes. Especially in a park, on a beach or other similar public place

@Alsohuman
I didn’t realise that. I assumed microchipping was voluntary. I think like many thing restrictions or rules are only any use if they’re going to be enforced and I can’t imagine there being sufficient fund to enforce this type of registering/restrictions that would make a difference.

It would be interesting to know what other countries do.

Too many potentially aggressive breeds have become common household pets

Yes, and another worrying thing is, the numbers are increasing

Anyone know what happen if you report a potentially banned breed of dog or dangerous dog. What steps would the police take.

Local to us there was a dog reported several times for being aggressive and then it eventually escaped and bit a child. The child was ok, but it took and actual bite for anything to be done.

Just wondered if there were specific services that deal with banned or dangerous dogs.

@Flaxmeadow

You've not answered. If a dog comes up to you it isnt under control. So you should report. Say it was no where near you minding its own business

If it was a powerful looking dog off lead that I believe could cause physical injury and that could outrun me or a child, then I probably would yes. Especially in a park, on a beach or other similar public place

You can report anything - that's why 101 exists. However your definition of 'out of control' is subjective. The law is not.

Under section 3 of the Dangerous Dogs Act an owner, or a person in charge of a dog, commits an offence if the dog causes reasonable apprehension to a person that they will be injured

The key phrase is 'reasonable apprehension'

could outrun me or a child is the vast majority of dogs.

I can well believe you would report though. I have a dog that is a breed that many consider "dangerous" and for that reason he is always on a lead around other people and dogs - to protect ourselves. I hardly ever encounter anyone whilst out with him anyway but, when I lived elsewhere, have been reported once to the police for owning a pitbull whilst in a park. I walked down a path to find a police car parked across the road and two officers who approached me saying that I matched the description of someone who had been reported for owning a banned breed of dog. He doesn't even slightly resemble a bull breed, so luckily that was that but the officers were initially fairly aggressive in their approach and I was completely confused - I had just been walking around the periphery of a large, quiet park with my well behaved dog on a lead!!

@AIMD

Anyone know what happen if you report a potentially banned breed of dog or dangerous dog. What steps would the police take.

Local to us there was a dog reported several times for being aggressive and then it eventually escaped and bit a child. The child was ok, but it took and actual bite for anything to be done.

Just wondered if there were specific services that deal with banned or dangerous dogs.

www.gov.uk/control-dog-public

could outrun me or a child is the vast majority of dogs

Yes and this is one of the reasons why I would like to see laws brought in that all dogs must be on leads in public places

Another reason is that time and time again, and it isn't just me noticing this, I will be in a park, on a footpath etc and a dog owner will call a dog but the dog has no recall. The dog is off lead, with no recall and so is out of control. This is a VERY common occurrence and a big problem where I live and it's especially worrying as there are many bull type dogs and large dogs

@Flaxmeadow

could outrun me or a child is the vast majority of dogs

Yes and this is one of the reasons why I would like to see laws brought in that all dogs must be on leads in public places

Another reason is that time and time again, and it isn't just me noticing this, I will be in a park, on a footpath etc and a dog owner will call a dog but the dog has no recall. The dog is off lead, with no recall and so is out of control. This is a VERY common occurrence and a big problem where I live and it's especially worrying as there are many bull type dogs and large dogs

The physiology that enables dogs to run faster than you doesn't make them inherently dangerous

Let's face it - you've started this thread using the tragic death of a poor woman to push your personal agenda that all dogs should be on leads and consistently refused to explain exactly how that approach would significantly reduce dog attacks (the majority of which are in the home towards children known to the dog)

You aren't genuinely interested in improving public safety. Only on ignoring all the inconvenient facts to push your own agenda.

Veterinari

Could you please stop repeatedly making unfounded allegations and ad hominem attacks against me and against other posters.

You have singled out at least 3 posters on this thread with this, and I'm asking you again to please keep the thread civil and polite

@Flaxmeadow

Veterinari

Could you please stop repeatedly making unfounded allegations and ad hominem attacks against me and against other posters.

You have singled out at least 3 posters on this thread with this, and I'm asking you again to please keep the thread civil and polite

Where have I been impolite? You could just answer my question if you genuinely want me to stop asking it

@Flaxmeadow

You've not answered. If a dog comes up to you it isnt under control. So you should report. Say it was no where near you minding its own business

If it was a powerful looking dog off lead that I believe could cause physical injury and that could outrun me or a child, then I probably would yes. Especially in a park, on a beach or other similar public place

The police would laugh at you.

Best of luck with that.

Veterinari is being perfectly civil. I can only guess that you are objecting someone being rational. You’re clearly not.

I guess we're at an impasse. You want me to stop pointing out the flaws in your 'logic' but refuse to offer any explanation of your reasoning (beliefs don't count)

I'd like you to stop accusing me of being uncivil or impolite. That seems to just be a translation of 'asking questions a don't want to answer'

Veterinari

To the best of my ability, I have tried to answer your questions, over and over again.

Do you have anymore questions?

@Flaxmeadow

Veterinari

Could you please stop repeatedly making unfounded allegations and ad hominem attacks against me and against other posters.

You have singled out at least 3 posters on this thread with this, and I'm asking you again to please keep the thread civil and polite

Feel free to use the report button then. That’s what it’s for.

@Flaxmeadow

Veterinari

To the best of my ability, I have tried to answer your questions, over and over again.

Do you have anymore questions?

Where? Please do copy/paste or quote the post

Where? Please do copy/paste or quote the post

I don't have time to trawl through a 35 page thread right now

Do you have anymore questions?