To feel extremely depressed about how Brexit is limiting the lives we once knew.

[Persiantrio]

Presumably now, if you want to go shopping in Paris on the Eurostar, you will have to declare, queue and pay customs on any clothes / goods over a given amount at the border. How crap and inconvenient is that?

Same with any holiday purchases from anywhere in the EU? Not worth it.

Also if you order anything online that happens to come from the EU and costs over over £135, you get hit with massive customs charges of about 40%. Companies like Etsy etc are taking a massive hit as a result.

How is this “taking back control?” Its so depressing and backward. The only reason nobody is kicking off about this yet is because nobody could go anywhere anyway. People don’t realise the freedoms they had and that are now gone. What a shit and insular place to live this will be.

And I don’t wait to hear any predictable ‘vaccine nationalism’ waffle either (because that has nothing whatsoever to do with what I’m asking in this instance and we could have done exactly the same within the EU anyway).

@tangerinelollipop I don’t think the OP is asking for sympathy. They are expressing frustration. You might think that is obscene but just because someone is starving in Africa doesn’t mean that you don’t feel your stomach grumble when you miss your lunch.

All these issues are complex. Turning people against each other and criticising and stupid sound bites are simple. You don’t need to fall for it.

I agree OP. Yes most of the problems are upper/middle class ‘first world problems’ but it’s perfectly ok to get upset about these if they affect you. I think it’s sad that we can’t easily go and live,work,study in Europe without having all the fuss of permits/visas. This was a great thing culturally and meeting Europeans through work and study and living abroad has enriched my life. High university fees and stupid admin will put off Europeans from coming to the UK which is a real shame and I can’t think of a single benefit. There will be labour shortages in many industries such as nursing and veterinary medicine (a huge proportion of uk vets are European and we don’t have enough uk vet schools to meet demand with uk vets). Uk citizens just aren’t willing to move to rural areas and do jobs which are usually done by Europeans-pig farming, slaughterhouses etc.

If you wish to go shopping for some nice things in Paris, just fill your bags up,and drop them off on the way back,and take the stuff to a migrant camp. and then you will be a hero , for making some needy people happy. And then nobody on here will mind if you go to shop in Paris.

Just because your life is apparently shitter and you only live in a box in the street and eat 2 spoons of hot gravel for breakfast doesn’t mean we don’t get to lament real freedoms lost.

I voted remain, but people like you have pushed me to think if leave inconveniences people like you, well - maybe it was worth it. For one thing, it's over and bloody done with now, get over it. If farmers can't get people to pick their products then they aren't paying enough or their conditions are very poor. Shame the farmers would rather let their produce go to waste rather than pay a proper wage for someone to pick it.

If you get on the eurostar in London and go right on past through to Paris, spare a thought that you're traveling very close to some of the most deprived communities in the uk. They voted leave, because they have very large populations of Eastern Europeans and their families who are willing to work for a pittance, driving down wages and there are very very few employment opportunities. Many of the europeans don't speak much English, if at all, and have little interest in doing so. They're not integrated. They've formed their own communities which don't mesh with the native communities. Added to that illegal immigration with boatloads of people appearing every single day, and being housed in these deprived communities and it's not hard to see why the native people were desperate to see change. There might be an element of racism to it, but over the past 20 years they've seen their community descend into a them vs us and their own prospects have gone down the pan. A lot of people there would never have had the chance to live and work in the EU. So why should they care about upper class children having to study in the uk instead of Italy or wherever? Why should they vote to make middle class people's lives better and not their own? Ok so they were taken in by propaganda. It doesn't mean they were wrong to vote the way they felt was right.

I don't necessarily agree with them, but in communities like Dover, all the majority of people there see is no opportunities, no jobs and no prospects. Why not pop down there and whine about your customs forms and your diamonds and see what response you get?

@Persiantrio

It was easier to get to Paris from London than to get to Liverpool by train, for instance. This is because I live nearer to Waterloo than Euston. Sometimes it could cost hundreds for myself and three kids to buy a return to Liverpool. Ridiculous.

Haven't RTFT but the Eurostar moved to St Pancras 14 years ago so "the life you once knew" was over well before Brexit. For me the greatest regret is having lost to right to live and work abroad. It was always my dream (and a realistic one) to relocate and now it's just not possible.

I live in Leeds. Hopping on Eurostar to Paris is not something I consider.

One day I may order something and one day it may affect me but right now- no!

I totally agree op. I can’t stand living in the Uk. I’d love to move to Europe.

@OhamIreally I think that's the main thing, isn't it - the wealthy will still be able to do that. Extra costs to take their pet, long-stay visas and demonstrating a certain level of financial independence etc will make it more difficult or completely out of reach for many which is a great shame. There are a lot more hurdles to jump.

I wasn't upper middle class when I got an Erasmus grant to study overseas. Also got almost a full grant for university in England, they were being phased out but still existed. I am from a working class background, first to go to university and parents were low earners.

@Persiantrio

It was easier to get to Paris from London than to get to Liverpool by train, for instance. This is because I live nearer to Waterloo than Euston. Sometimes it could cost hundreds for myself and three kids to buy a return to Liverpool. Ridiculous.

Eurostar hasn’t departed from Waterloo for years.

@MadMadMadamMim

To you, presumably. I don't know anyone that's ever been shopping to Paris on the Eurostar. Not all of the UK revolves around your type of lifestyle.

Get over yourself.

Not Eurpstar, but I live not far from a channel port and we used to go shopping in France every couple of months.

It was great, nice lunch in a harbourside restaurant, stroll round the town, buy a few treats (lovely shoe shops and an M&S type chain that did great underwear) load the car up at Auchan be back indoors by about 9pm.

It used to save a fortune, not just on booze, but quite basic things like coffee beans, parmesan, olive oil etc, even soap powder and dog food were much cheaper. I even took my optical prescription and got a pair of glasses once, they were less than half the price of a similar style in the UK.

Then they reduced the number of crossings and it became a bit impractical due to timings, and I doubt if there'd be the same sort of savings to be made now, not even last year pre-Brexit, because of currency changes.

@DoubleTweenQueen yes that's right - it will still be possible for high net worth individuals.
I do think however that some people who voted leave were from communities that felt so cut off and disenfranchised that far from "allowing themselves to be manipulated" considered that their vote would give a bloody nose to the political elites who ignored them.

If the shopping doesn't wash how about studying. My son is taking an English language engineering degree in an EU country with zero fees. He started his course last year. It's not an available option any more.

Well, it’s made life more complicated for a couple of million British people living in Europe. But who cares about us eh?

@Persiantrio

It was easier to get to Paris from London than to get to Liverpool by train, for instance. This is because I live nearer to Waterloo than Euston. Sometimes it could cost hundreds for myself and three kids to buy a return to Liverpool. Ridiculous.

Surely if you were in the habit of popping over to Paris on the Eurostar you would know that for many years now it has departed from St Pancras rather than Waterloo?

I don't disagree that Brexit has made life more complicated but this post makes me rather suspicious of the OP...

I am not sure that whining about some extra admin and having to pay due taxes on purchases, is really the way to win people to your argument OP. But then I tend to get my diamonds bought for me from Hatton Gardens, so what do I know...

Euro chick, the Eurostar moving from Waterloo was really the start of the shopping problems. If I'd been able to keep going from Waterloo, maybe I would have gone to Amsterdam for my diamonds (much prettier view than from the tube).

@Coconut2010
But don’t worry everything will be fine we will be replaced by immigrants from third world countries
Couldn’t be bothered to comment on the thread until I saw this - why the hell would immigrants from developing countries be any less valuable than EU citizens. They have universities in these countries too and, in fact, many of the HCPs who work (and sadly have died in the past year) in the UK come from developing countries. p.s. My DH is from an EU country, I voted Remain AND ‘third world’ is an outdated and offensive term.

Not Eurpstar, but I live not far from a channel port and we used to go shopping in France every couple of months.

Most people don't live near a channel port or London. That means that for a large proportion of people living "up North", day trips for shopping abroad weren't ever practical as you'd have a very short day in France once you factor in several hours of travel to get to the port or Eurostar station. Hence why they're not remotely interested when a minority can't do their duty free booze cruises any more!

For me the greatest regret is having lost to right to live and work abroad. It was always my dream (and a realistic one) to relocate and now it's just not possible.

Didn't somebody upthread confirm that it was possible and that they had actually done it?

@Mamamia456

Lemon Roses - You're moaning that your dog doesn't have freedom of movement? 😂😂😂

I know several people that regularly take their dogs on holiday to France. A couple of them are well off and have houses there, but most of them camp, caravan or tour in motorhomes.

I also have friends who live in France, who bring their dogs when they visit friends and family in the UK.

The confusion around the pet passport will make it very difficult for them to do that in future.

Why is it not possible to live and work abroad now?

Maybe, if you have no useful skills, you will struggle, but then maybe you should.

If you have any skills that are in demand, the world will always be your oyster (assuming no pandemic).

If the bus was leaver ‘fake news’, the idea that brexiting stops U.K. citizens working in the EU or EU citizens living and working in the U.K. is remainer ‘fake news’.

Diamonds and expensive glassware is a bit of a red herring here I think.

There are many ordinary families that are half British, half EU either living in the EU or the UK that have been affected by this in lots of small ways (and big ways in some circumstances) that add up to it being a massive headache. For example, grandparents can’t just send presents to grandchildren between EU and UK without extra import costs (plus admin costs), which maybe not everyone can afford.

Tuition fees is another example. In some EU countries, universities have free tuition for their degrees (taught in English) for EU citizens. Another door closed to British students who aren’t rolling in it.

Obviously these aren’t life or death situations (so yes, grandparents don’t need to send birthday or Christmas presents to grandchildren and people don’t have to have a university degree), but both examples show how Brexit does affect normal people and families and not just the swanky rich swanning off to buy diamonds or expensive glassware.

I'm a staunch Remainer but I have to say I (like 99% of people) haven't noticed the impacts you're particularly concerned about.

They don't rate on my list of concerns at all TBH.

The only people I know that make £££ purchases on holiday (my parents and PILs) do so all over the world. So if they were happy to make such purchases in countries outside of the EU, I don't expect they'll notice any difference IYSWIM.

Everyone else I know (including a fair few in the top 5-10% earners) don't purchase anything of enough value for it to make a difference.

Well I never went to Paris for a shopping trip or bought diamonds in Amsterdam so I don’t want anyone else to either.
I used to be a staunch Remainer but now I have totally changed my mind.
I dont care about small businesses who are paying so much more to export or average people who face job losses in the car industry or similar, screw them all as long as I no longer have to feel jealous of people who are richer than me.