What is it that makes men change once you have DC?

[Hillsandthrills]

Once me and my exDH had DC he completely changed - became argumentative, tight with money, moody, avoided helping with DC, everything became my fault, struggled to get him to come out on day trips blah blah blah. I see this a lot of times on MN and in real life - what is it that makes men change? Is it lack of attention from their wives/partner after the DC are born? Not liking the new responsibilities?

It’s only on mumsnet I see this. I don’t know any men in real life like This. Most men I know are committed and kind husband and fathers.

On MN, they are usually twats beforehand too it's just amplified once you have children.

I know a couple of women in real life that have changed significantly since having children and not for the better.

I agree with PPs that the men haven’t changed - they were always shits, but managed to hide it better before. Or it was less obvious.
Abusers often ramp up the abuse once their wife has a child and is more vulnerable.
Decent men don’t “change” when the baby arrives. My own wonderful DH took 2 weeks leave from work and changed every single nappy - saying that as I had to do the feeds, he’d deal with the other end! He regularly got up at night and walked the floor with the babies when they were teething, always did their bath when he got home from work, did half the cooking and chores.
He died of a brain haemorrhage when the youngest was 11 months, and I still grieve him now, nearly 30 years later.

I actually think it’s often the women that change and the men don’t like it. That’s what happened in my own situation. I’d been with dh for 5 years when we had Dd and basically because I didn’t have a baby to worry about I accepted a lot of his behaviours that annoyed me and took up the lions share of house stuff because I had the time to do it and basically just accepted it. Once we had dd I thought why the fuck am I putting up with this shit and 6 months later after many arguments and him refusing to compromise I left him. I had changed and he wouldn’t.

@FTEngineerM

two adults in the house, there was significantly less to do and vastly more time in which to do it

This is completely true. All of it. But I still find it difficult to understand why if someone didn’t clean their piss from around the toilet/seat, cook themselves tea, wash their dishes, clean their clothes, put their clothes away before children you’d in any way logical assume as soon as they have a child they would start doing their own AND someone else’s (yours/the child’s). It’s just not going to happen is it.

I think they often assume that it's not that he is too lazy or selfish, it's that he 'doesn't see the dirt' or 'bless him, he just can't cook!' - they think his (clearly deliberate) incompetence only extends to these tasks and that they'll do plenty of the grunt work of parenting. Whereas actually he's selfish and believes these things to be women's work, so of course he won't pick up any of the new work of a child.

FTE probably because dynamics change. I understand entirely what you are saying but just doing what they were doing before is not enough. I think often one person changed to accommodate the fact they are now a parent and the other doesn't, this is where resentment builds up. Just look at how many threads there are on husbands hobbies. The reverse is not often seen where a mother thinks it's fine to leave the house at 10 am every Saturday and swan back in at 4pm after leaving her husband with young children/babies. Then going away on several girls weekends throughout the year.

*In many cases, the red flags were already there but it gets amplified when the children arrive.

A man who does no housework, doesn’t share money, is selfish is unlikely to start doing the opposite when the babies arrive.*

Totally agree with this. The men I know who are lazy dickheads were lazy dickheads before their children arrived. It was just amplified once the babies came. My dh did equal work in the house to me before the children. Some people choose to ignore or just don’t see the red flags in their partners long before children.

I’m in the camp that it’s not always change.

My XH was lazy. I knew this, really.

But - it didn’t impact me much. Because I didn’t pick up the slack for him much. We were 2 people, responsible for 1 person each. So his laziness didn’t affect me that much.

Then along comes baby, and I’m now responsible for 2 people - one of whom is more tired than they’ve ever been in their life, the other is very demanding and very incapable!

So now it matters that he never gets up to give me a rest in the morning after feeding 8x in the night. It matters that he saunters out to the car without a thought for a changing bag. It matters that the occasional thing I did because of his laziness in the past that I barely noticed because massively magnified because my plate is FULL. And because I’m now resentful, whereas before his laziness was a simple eye roll occasionally.

I was never a woman that ran around after her husband before the baby. He was always lazy and selfish.

If I sound like a complete idiot for ignoring the signs and still having a baby with him... all his family told me how amazing he was with his nephews when they were younger. I thought that he loved doing things with kids I expected him to be just as lazy about housework etc as he’d ever been - but genuinely thought he’d be Modern Dad 🙄

Mines a lovely man, kind and generous and loving ...

But, there is a fundamental difference there. Yesterday he left me holding a crying baby for hours while he faffed around with his bike. I had to ask for help so I could eat (hot soup.) he held ds but made it clear it was with reluctance so I had to bolt my dinner down.

He’s booked to go away in September. It wouldn’t occur to me to just book a girls weekend without ds but he has this luxury.

He sleeps every night and has ds for an hour between 7 and 8.

His life hasn’t changed much I guess, and mine has.

@Mylovelyhorsee

It’s only on mumsnet I see this. I don’t know any men in real life like This. Most men I know are committed and kind husband and fathers.

Agreed.

@Mylovelyhorsee

It’s only on mumsnet I see this. I don’t know any men in real life like This. Most men I know are committed and kind husband and fathers.

Well that’s obviously not true is it. People are more honest when they write anonymously so you’re going to hear things online that you don’t hear in real life.

@daffodilsandprimroses your DH doesn’t sound very kind, generous and loving

He is, but thoughtless. He tends to focus on one thing and tunes everything else out, and it can be frustrating.

Do you not think it's just the stress and responsibility that comes with having a child? We've both definitely changed ... I used to be cool now I'm forever tired and a nag (he says the same about himself )

I think both can change and not always for the better. Some men don’t step up and some women step down from previous responsibilities.

Personally I think it’s just magnified more in some men from what Ives seen as they didn’t actually want a child but were pressured into it by a partner.

Everyone changes after having kids - it would be weird if you didn't tbh.

I think a lot of men really don't give it nearly enough thought beforehand and then, when the reality sets in, they realise they don't like the things that come with it - the added responsibility, the fact that there is competition for attention and they no longer come first, the tiredness and extra work, the minimum 18yr (but realistically lifelong) commitment.

Can't blame them to be honest - it's hard! How they deal with it though depends on whether they are actually the deep down decent human beings you presumably assumed they were when you decided to have kids with them or arseholes who had successfully hidden it up until now.

I don't think they change, they stay the same and that's the problem. Even if you kind of know your partner is a bit lazy, you know YOU are going to step up when you have a baby and expect them to do the same. And then they don't.

I remember my BiL saying he didn’t think life as a father would be that much of a change when my sister was pregnant and the rest of us laughing at him. He just couldn’t see how much difference it would make “they’re so tiny, how hard can it be?”

Sad thing is that in reality although his life changed a bit, my sisters changed out of all recognition, so he was sort of right.

I also think PP point about the responsibility that comes with being a parent being seen as a “punishment” is true. Some men do behave as if their partner is being a big meanie by saying that they can’t spend 6 hours playing football of a weekend becatse they have an 8 week old baby that needs looking after & she’s had 8 hours sleep in 4 days.

‘God I mean I gave you a baby didn’t I? You said you wanted one! And now you’re complaining you’re tired & I need to help more. It’s so unfair!!’

Good post James I don't think all these Insta mums help either. It's hardly representative showing a young women with full make up, hair extensions, fat fake porn star heavily glossed lips, wearing size 8 light coloured, figure hugging clothing, swanning around her immaculate show house, tapping on the granite work tops with extra long, manicured nails. Crowing about how great life is with Jaxxson and Liberty-Mai.
You don't see a greasy haired, dressing gown clad haggered , pissed off women asking her partner to bring in more super large sanitary pads as she is losing blood at an alarming rate. That's the reality for a lot of parents

@FTEngineerM

Yikes, Suddenly the men are required to pull their weight.

So the partner was ok with them not pulling their weight before?

There wasn't as much weight to pull so it wasn't as noticeable.

I do however struggle to sympathise with women ( or men) who have a baby with someone who already has a child and they have made no effort at all to see that child. Then they wonder why their partner doesn't want to be involved in their child's life.

Re male jealousy of dcs, I once read in an American magazine that a woman shouldn’t breast feed if it makes her husband jealous.
This would have been in the 70s, and I still wonder how on earth anyone who presumably calls himself a man, can be jealous of a baby getting its proper food.

Sometimes the signs that a man will be a poor partner/father are v clear well before DC. and unfortunately ignored.

And some men change for the better, engage adult parenting mode with full dedication and a new sense of responsibility and purpose. Same as some women.