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AIBU?

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Original poster

To ask you not to judge all Muslims by the actions of the men outside the school

240 replies

flashbac · 27/03/2021 09:23

Hi

It shouldn't need saying but...

Please don't judge us all by the actions of a vocal few.

Some have already acknowledged the protesters were mostly if not all angry young men with seemingly nothing better to do. They don't represent all Muslims.

As Batley's late former MP said:
"We are far more united and have far more in common than that which divides us.”

OP posts:
Wendywoodd · 27/03/2021 10:50

This reply has been deleted

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Tehmina23 · 27/03/2021 10:50

@flashbac Personally I never judge anyone of any religion or ethnicity by the actions of a few.

I actually think that the teacher was very wrong & stupid to show a cartoon of Mohammad to a majority Muslim class of children when he must've known they would be offended.

ViciousJackdaw · 27/03/2021 10:51

@HeckyPeck

Having read about it, why on earth would a teacher use a deliberately insulting cartoon in a lesson?!
I wondered about this too. Many of us know that images of the Prophet are forbidden after Charlie Hebdo and I would have expected a teacher to know as well.
Tehmina23 · 27/03/2021 10:53

@Wendywoodd you're post is so islamophobic & offensive

NEVERQUIT3331 · 27/03/2021 10:54

You are right but knowing previous events, Muslims always get judged when something happens. People think you know what goes through the head of terrorists, why did he do this etc...

The protests outside of the school are problematic in the sense that no one should be stopped from learning and it could have been done in a better way. But I also agree if the teacher was a RE teacher he surely knew that pictures of Prophets and Allah are forbidden in the religion. No to sacking him I am sure it was a mistake but definitely better awareness is required. The comparisons to Islam and Christianity is not really fair. In Christianity, it is common to have pictures of Jesus, the Virgin Media in your homes. In Islam, it is not permitted. Also, if any other religion like Christianity/Judaism etc were showed similar cartoons the teacher should ensure it is not shown. How does a racist stereotypical photo of a Arab man with a bomb in his head really help in RE?

BrumBoo · 27/03/2021 10:54

Many of us know that images of the Prophet are forbidden after Charlie Hebdo and I would have expected a teacher to know as well.

It is not forbidden. There are no laws against it. It is a religious rule, no one outside of that religion has to respect it in any way what so ever. Others may not like that, but not liking or agreeing with something doesn't make it illegal or should cause a person to lose their job.

NEVERQUIT3331 · 27/03/2021 10:57

@BrumBoo

Many of us know that images of the Prophet are forbidden after Charlie Hebdo and I would have expected a teacher to know as well.

It is not forbidden. There are no laws against it. It is a religious rule, no one outside of that religion has to respect it in any way what so ever. Others may not like that, but not liking or agreeing with something doesn't make it illegal or should cause a person to lose their job.

Well then making a photo clearly makes no sense. What do people want to achieve by drawing photos of the Prophet? It might not be forbidden but it does not mean it is right to draw someone that will never be accurately represented.
RiojaRose · 27/03/2021 10:58

Wendywoodd Racist stereotypes are not a suitable response in this discussion.

OppsUpsSide · 27/03/2021 10:58

He was neither stupid nor wrong, he was doing his job.
Only the supremely stupid would let this incident taint their perception of all Muslims.
I don’t like Islam though, I don’t like any religion, they are all systems of coercive control and abuse.

BrumBoo · 27/03/2021 11:01

Well then making a photo clearly makes no sense. What do people want to achieve by drawing photos of the Prophet? It might not be forbidden but it does not mean it is right to draw someone that will never be accurately represented.

So making Jesus white for centuries is a-ok, but making an image of Muhammad is very bad not ok? There's a very good reason why these people cannot be 'accurately represented', more to the point, they're just pictures. Ones that people pick and choose their moments to have a hissy fit over. No one gave a shiny shit 10-15 odd years ago when South Park drew the Prophet in one of their episodes. It wasn't banned at the time.

murbblurb · 27/03/2021 11:02

I don't judge all Muslims by these thugs, any more than I judge all Jews by the reckless actions of the north London community during covid. (or the many other bad things about all religions)

we do not know what this picture was. As far as I am aware there is no blasphemy law in the UK. If the teacher was not a practicing and declared Muslim then he is not bound by Muslim law and can show what pictures he likes as long as they don't breach UK law.

demanding action because you are 'offended' - it doesn't work like that in the UK.

FTMF30 · 27/03/2021 11:06

Of course YANBU.

I'm also wondering what purpose there was for the teacher showing a knowingly controversial image to his students. I would love more detail on the context of that.

NEVERQUIT3331 · 27/03/2021 11:07

@BrumBoo

Well then making a photo clearly makes no sense. What do people want to achieve by drawing photos of the Prophet? It might not be forbidden but it does not mean it is right to draw someone that will never be accurately represented.

So making Jesus white for centuries is a-ok, but making an image of Muhammad is very bad not ok? There's a very good reason why these people cannot be 'accurately represented', more to the point, they're just pictures. Ones that people pick and choose their moments to have a hissy fit over. No one gave a shiny shit 10-15 odd years ago when South Park drew the Prophet in one of their episodes. It wasn't banned at the time.

It is never okay. Jesus was not WHITE. And people have complained about this saying it white washes history. Like I said previously, Islam and Christianity are different. Christianity ALLOWS pictures Islam DOES NOT. And having a white Jesus is offensive to many because it is not accurate Jesus was not white and that is a fact. So you can understand why followers aren't happy with this representation.

Just because South Park drew it and it was not banned does not mean it was right. In many cartoons 10-15 years ago you had shows where racism was endorsed e.g. black characters being evil all the time. Just because it was done before does not mean it is right now.

ImAlrightThanx · 27/03/2021 11:12

It was only "OK" for centuries to portray Jesus as a white man because those in power in the Church- and in most Christian countries- were all white European men. That was the default.

On a semi-related note, for those who do not know, Jesus is also a revered prophet in Islam.

Original poster
flashbac · 27/03/2021 11:15

Let's not debate the rights and wrongs of the incident here. There are already a few threads on it.
I started this thread became I'm worried that these actions serve to create culture wars, division and unrest. That is what some people want but I don't. Let's not give them the satisfaction.

OP posts:
Miljea · 27/03/2021 11:15

@murbblurb

I don't judge all Muslims by these thugs, any more than I judge all Jews by the reckless actions of the north London community during covid. (or the many other bad things about all religions)

we do not know what this picture was. As far as I am aware there is no blasphemy law in the UK. If the teacher was not a practicing and declared Muslim then he is not bound by Muslim law and can show what pictures he likes as long as they don't breach UK law.

demanding action because you are 'offended' - it doesn't work like that in the UK.

I agree.

OppsUpsSide · 27/03/2021 11:17

Is there a culture war/division/unrest within the Muslim community would you say?

Original poster
flashbac · 27/03/2021 11:21

@Oppsupsside
I meant division between Muslims and non-muslims.
I fear this school will become more segregated now as non Muslims (mostly white parents) will not send their children there or will pull them out.
It's a sorry state of affairs.

OP posts:
OppsUpsSide · 27/03/2021 11:23

Yes I thought you did, I just wondered if there was any kick back within the Muslim community of if the protests are generally supported.

SmashedAvocado · 27/03/2021 11:27

Apparently the students were forewarned these images would be shown so anyone who might be offended could opt out. Also the content of this lesson had been taught in previous years.

Seems lockdown and not much to do has brought out the drama llamas spoiling for a fight. They should have been immediately dispersed like the protesters at the Sarah Everard vigil especially as there were safety concerns for pupils so that the school was closed. It just added fuel that the protestors were treated with kid gloves and got away with it.

I don’t judge all Muslims on the actions of people like these but I do think more could be done by the majority to show that their actions will not be tolerated. Obviously the police were pussyfooting around them. Why didn’t community leaders get involved in telling them to leave?

womaninatightspot · 27/03/2021 11:33

I don't blame individual Muslims for this.

It does feel like the way society is going, don't like something whip up mob, physical or social media based, and try and force you're ideals onto others.

Not a big fan of religion in general but am happy to respect other's beliefs.

Original poster
flashbac · 27/03/2021 11:34

"Why didn’t community leaders get involved in telling them to leave?"

They flipping did. I'm getting annoyed at people thinking there was no response appealing for calm. Just because the media didn't show you it doesn't mean it didn't happen.

OP posts:
OppsUpsSide · 27/03/2021 11:38

I'm getting annoyed at people thinking there was no response appealing for calm.

That’s what I was asking OP and you didn’t really answer.

Susie477 · 27/03/2021 11:39

Of course I don’t judge all Muslims by the actions of these men. That would be ridiculous.

I only judge the ones who want to censor free speech and reintroduce blasphemy laws into this country by means of malicious, spurious allegations of racism (Islam isn’t a race), intimidation and threats of violence.

CloudFormations · 27/03/2021 11:51

#notallmuslims

Please don’t set up a false equivalence with the hugely problematic #notallmen.

In the case of sexual violence against women, the problem is an overwhelming one which almost all women have experienced at some time or another. There is a massive issue with the way men as a category behave towards women.

This is not remotely the case with Muslims. The overwhelming majority of Muslims are not aggressive, violent or dangerous. And the overwhelming majority of non-Muslims in this country have never faced any kind of persecution by Muslims. When it comes to Muslims, it is right to distinguish the actions of those who are violent and dangerous from the majority, because the vast majority are neither of those things.