Inheritance issues causing a massive tension in the family.

[ThornAmongstRoses]

My DH and his sister have no relationship with each other. It’s not that they actively dislike each other, it’s more that there’s just nothing there, just total indifference. They may see each other yearly at a family get together or something but there’s no contact in between those times, not even a text message here and there.

My FIL lives relatively close to us so is very involved in our lives (no problem at all, he’s a lovely man) and since he lost his wife (DH’s mum) just over 4 years ago we’ve taken him even more into our fold to ensure he doesn’t get lonely.

We live near the Midlands and DH’s sister and family live near Skegness. His sister comes down about once a year to see her dad and will stay for about a week with her partner and their children. FIL doesn’t go and stay with them though as with their two young children, and the fact the house is quite small, there’s isn’t really any room to accommodate FIL for any period of time.

Anyway, FIL has always said that when he passes away he would want his property sold and split 50:50 between DH and SIL.

However, last week he dropped a bombshell that he’s sold his house and is moving up to Skegness and will be having a Granny Annexe type Cabin built in SIL’s garden for him to live in.

We have seen the brochure for the Cabins and they are beautiful and cost about £100k to £130k depending on size and style.

We asked how on earth he would fit one in SIL’s garden as they only have a small garden and FIL told us that SIL is going to sell her house, and then he (FIL) is going to give SIL £90k from the sale of his own house and his contribution will allow for a mortgage big enough to her to buy a larger house with a big enough garden for his Cabin to be built in.

FIL’s house has already been sold for £250k and has said he will give £25k to my DH. The remainder will be used to give £90k to SIL (so she can buy a bigger house) and then the cost of building the Cabin.

SIL is waiting to start a new job which will enable them to pay the increased mortgage payments on whichever house they buy, compared to the payments they have for their current house.

My DH is quite upset as not only is SIL being given £90k, she will then also have a much larger house to show for it, and after FIL’s passing, a nice £120k accommodation in the back garden which will no doubt add a lot of value to her property.

DH is more upset as the 50% inheritance that was earmarked for him was mainly going to be for our children as we were going to put it into a university fund for them to use when they’re older.

FIL has also asked if he can come and live with us whilst everything “at the other end” gets sorted, which we have already said yes to.

FIL has got to leave his house at the end of April and has told us he’ll probably only be with us for a few months, but SIL hasn’t even started looking for a house yet, never mind the two months it takes to build the Cabin when the house has been bought.

It’s all such a mess.

There’s underlying tension brewing and I’m worried it’s going to cause a huge fracture in DH’s and FIL’s relationship and also that DH’s and SIL’s relationship will go from one of apathy to one of rivalry.

Are inheritance discrepancies a typical cause of family feuds? Is DH right to be feeling a bit irked by it?

Rather than the £125k that was supposed to be his fair share, he’s now getting £25k out of the whole £250k and everything else, in effect, is going to SIL.

Why doesn't FIL just buy a flat or bungalow in Skegness, that way he's close to SIL and maintains his own asset? The cabin in the garden and a big house for SIL just smacks of grabbiness IMO.

@Musicaldilemma

Your FIL needs to make sure he gets a legal right in that Annex. The mortgaging bank might need to be involved. Your focus should be on protecting him. If your SIL is going to let him live there for the rest of his life, that needs to be a legal right. They also need to be careful re potential care home fees if he ends up not being able to live there anymore, eg severe dementia. So it all sounds quite complicated.

This.

What happens if SIL sells up for whatever reason before he dies. Then what? What if she is not in a fit state to look after him in old age....

Also your FIL to have sold the house without even telling your husband, his son, that it was up for sale - that seems very quick and hasty. Was there even a sign up on the house? Could he have got more for it?

He went with the valuation that the Estate Agent gave and didn’t ask for valuations from any other Agents.

He had it valued on a Saturday and it was sold by the Wednesday, and yes for a price that was far lower than other similar houses his estate.

The speed in which it has happened also has us concerned. Why the rush if SIL hasn’t even started her new job yet? They aren’t even at the point of looking for a house so why did FIL want such a quick sale.

The whole thing has left me and DH totally baffled.

Me and DH just feel reluctant to talk to him about it all because we don’t want to upset him

That's all very well OP, but he could end up a darned sight more upset if this goes wrong, and potentially less able to deal with the fallout as he ages. Better, surely, to "blame" the legal processes and risk a small upset now than to see a much bigger one later

I also like a PP's suggestion of him renting a small place near to SIL while this supposedly goes through, to "see if he likes the area". Strange that SIL hadn't encouraged that herself ... or is it?

Me and DH just feel reluctant to talk to him about it all because we don’t want to upset him.

He has no such concerns about landing himself on you. Which will probably be the case again in a few years once all this falls apart.

Do himself and you guys a favour and look into this fully now while there is still time for it to be reversed. It sounds like your SIL and her partner want a bigger house and they've presented this wonderful plan to your FIL who doesn't realize how vulnerable it will leave him. that they won't have him in the bigger house he'll be paying into until his cabin is installed says a lot. If it's all about his money, they could lose interest in him and his care once he's there. Plus is he defined as living with them, or could they potentially say that he's homeless and foist him onto care services in a decade?

If your SIL's priority is having her DF near, she should be just as happy that he's in a sea view flat nearby. But it doesn't seem like that's her motivation.

You're husband needs to be pleased that his father is doing what he wants in his life.

The rest is nasty tbh.

Adding in that he's particularly upset because it was going to the children just sounds manipulative and that you are trying to get people on side.

From what I've read, FIL moves in with you. He gifts £90k to SIL to buy a bigger house. He puts £120k in an account for her to buy a cabin. Then he continues to live with you until the mythical cabin is built...

She gets a bigger house, never builds the cabin, and FIL lives with you forever.

I wouldn't do it!!! If their family is so honest and open that he already discussed the will / inheritance with his children, why cannot the openness continue with your DH saying "Look it won't work because..."

I haven’t RTWT because, predictably, it’s full of frothing about you being ‘grabby.’

I think this whole set up is very odd. I also can’t understand why he’s effectively signing over the vast majority of his assets to your SIL, who has a partner that doesn’t like him.

I can understand why you’ve posted, I’m sorry you are getting a hard time, I’d have the same concerns.

As the log cabin will be used as separate self contained accomodation to SIL's main house it will require planning permission. I can see SIL buying a perfect house, using FIL's £90K and then not getting the planning permission so it will be a case of sorry, you'll have to stay with ThornAmongstRoses and by then FIL will not have the funds to buy anywhere of his own. I think he needs legal advise to safeguard his £90k so that if things do not work out as planned SIL has to pay it back.

@ThornAmongstRoses I live 5 miles outside of Skegness. I love it and as I've grown up here I know no different, however I do know that people that relocate here struggle with the lack of amenities, locality of NHS treatment if needed beyond a GP surgery, the extremely stretched surgery capacity etc. I wouldn't want to try to put off anyone wanting to move here but although being on the coast etc is a wonderful draw to living here these things might be worth mentioning to your FIL. It is hard to even go shopping in the Summer months due to the influx of visitors and vehicles on a woefully inadequate infrastructure then the flipside is in the Winter months many places are closed and public transport consists of a bus every hour. Like I say these things are the norm to me but speaking to people that have relocated they've become lonely and isolated etc because of these factors.

If you have a good relationship with FIL can you speak to him? It might be easier than your DH because there's fewer emotions around his DSis etc.?

I think you could have a concerned but frank cards on the table sort of talk. He needs to know (or find out):

• when does DSis's new job start? Does it have a probation period? Will she need 3 months' payslips from new job for a mortgage application?
• have they started looking at houses? Will FIL be invited to look around these houses too? Does he drive? Will the new house be near GP / whatever hobbies or leisure activities he'd like to do?
• how long does cabin take to build?
• what is the arrangement for paying for gas/electricity/water/council tax once he's in?
• is there an expectation for childcare?
• where will he be eating most nights (with the family or in his cabin?)
• what will happen if DSis needs to move house again (e.g. for children's schools)
• will he be coming back regularly to see your family, or will you be visiting Skegness more?
• how does the finance work if he wants to move after 10 years, if he needs residential care, etc.
• at 65, it's not impossible that he might need someone else - at least someone he would like to stay over. (You might not want to raise this one with him, but it's a consideration.)

He could easily be with you for a year, so I would suggest he rents a little place in Skegness now - he'll be on the spot to help with the house-hunting, start making friends, etc.

@CheeseCakeSunflowers

As the log cabin will be used as separate self contained accomodation to SIL's main house it will require planning permission. I can see SIL buying a perfect house, using FIL's £90K and then not getting the planning permission so it will be a case of sorry, you'll have to stay with ThornAmongstRoses and by then FIL will not have the funds to buy anywhere of his own. I think he needs legal advise to safeguard his £90k so that if things do not work out as planned SIL has to pay it back.

Well said. Some comments here seems to be harsh towards OP, but she’ll be this nasty DIL , who wants to throw old man on the street.

Is he suffering from depression and still grieving from (what I presume was) his wife’s premature death? All the more reason to suspect manipulation.

He was absolutely distraught by his wife’s death, especially because of his unpredictable it was. She felt ill one day, went to the GP who referred her to A&E, she was admitted and had died within a week. He’s never really gotten over it. He was so bereft after her death which is why we have taken him under our wing so much. We don’t mind, obviously, like. I said we all have a really good relationship with him. This is another reason why it hurts my DH, we were there every day to support FIL when his wife died whereas SIL continued with her once yearly visits.

The whole thing has left me and DH totally baffled.

And that's why you need to sit him down and talk to him.

He at least his his money right now. Don't just sit back passively and see what happens. My concern would be less about the inheritance, and more about what his plan is if he doesn't like the new living arrangements. Because his only way out of that cabin will be your spare room.

He is spending HIS money on what he wants, his choice, his happiness.
I hate all this entitlement to parents money, me and my sister would have preferred our parents enjoying their savings and property, rather than being Ill quite young and dying 8 years apart but unable to enjoy life.
People can be so damn grabby, its bloody disgusting, it ain't yours and he ain't dead ffs.

I would strongly suggest your FIL gets reputable independent legal advice. And really advise him not to hand over any money until he is moving in.
The danger is he hands over money - there is never anywhere suitable for him to move into and SIL's partner ends up with all the money - not even SIL If they are unmarried it could be hard for her to get all of her money out if they split.

Look at the legalities now before he gives away money. It could all go very wrong very quickly. Also might need to consider risk of deprivation of assets if he does need to go into care (having given away £90k).

Have they even got planning permission? A stand-alone cabin that is actually a house isn’t necessarily going to be straightforward re permissions.

@PinkiOcelot

My mam’s house had to be sold for care home fees. No inheritance here.

An inheritance is not guaranteed these days. £25k is a nice amount.

Exactly. That £250k of which you’d already earmarked £125k could easily have been eaten up in care fees. As it is, hopefully this won’t happen as your SIL is close by to care for your FIL. So you should be grateful to be getting £25k. As it is, it’s very distasteful to even be discussing this when your FIL is still alive and kicking, and his money is his to do as he wishes.

65 is no age. I am not far off that and have teenage dc still living at home.

If your father wants to live by the coast can’t you take him house shopping for a place of his own. Even if it isn’t in Skegness.

Given your updates I think he needs to be careful as he is so young. He could be there for 30 + years (The way you write I thought he was in his late 70s/80s)
If he doesn’t get on with his son inlaw and only sees his dd once per year I think it is a big commitment to say you are going to live next door to and have your facilities and even your home governed by the mood of one person you don’t like and one person who if he wasn’t splashing the cash would have zero interest in him.

What would happen if SIL and BIL divorced. He could end up on the streets and half of the proceeds from his house given to the son in law and his dd who is quite apathetic towards him walking away with the rest.
I think he really needs to take legal advice.

This isn’t about inheritances but keeping a roof over his head and some sort of control whilst he is still alive.

Also, he needs it set out legally what happens if SIL dies before him. Who "owns" his cabin then and do they have to let him stay?

Well presumably he will not buy the cabin until the new house is bought and planning permission is obtained. So worst case, he will still have 120K to buy another place somewhere. He's not going to be with the OP forever. And he can adjust his will to account for already giving SIL 90K.

OP you need to talk to him about the legalities and make sure he doesn't buy the cabin until everything is sorted.

It sounds like you have rejected his 25K which must already upset him, so not sure why you wouldn't risk upsetting him to safeguard his future.

I can see both sides, I can see why you’d be upset but also it’s your fils money and his life.

Forget about inheritance at all. Suggest to FIL that before such a huge step, and rather than giving you 25k, he rents somewhere near his DD to be sure that the area and close proximity suit them all. Disengage completely other than that.

Those telling op that she is being grabby for earmarking a 50% share of a house. What do you call the sil who is taking 90% of the “inheritance” before her father is even dead?

He is spending HIS money on what he wants, his choice, his happiness.

And once it's spent he has nothing left and is entirely reliant on his DD and her family. If anything goes wrong and he has to leave, he has nothing. You're not concerned about that aspect of his happiness? Any responsible child should be.

I agree that they shouldn't be concerned about the inheritance. They should be concerned that he'll fall out with his son in law in five years and come to them to live in their spare room for the next twenty years because he gave away all his security.