To think that the EU have done more to endorse Brexit in the last 2 weeks than the UK managed in nearly 5 years

[Butterflyfluff]

I’ll start by saying I’ve never thought Brexit was in the long term interest of the UK and still don’t

But dear God, the EU’s behaviour over vaccinations and, in particular, the blatant prejudice around the Astra Zeneca vaccine has done more to endorse the UK leaving than anything that has been said in the UK before, during and after the vote

@Itsalonghaul

There is a great deal of real bitterness and jealousy on this thread. I am surprised by the hostility.

It is making me feel grateful that Boris is cancelling our holidays to Europe, if this is how it is going to be I am not sure I ever want to visit again. The world is a big place and I would rather not be surrounded by such bile.

Are you in the UK? Then you're already in Europe.

@OuiOuiKitty aren't most posters on here talking about how the it looks in the uk as opposed to the eu which is what the post is about

Yanbu, the EU is looking hugely incompetent and like a club of bullies. Meanwhile I'm amazed how well the vaccine roll out has been organised in the UK

It’s not about individual Europeans. It’s a growing dislike of the EU as an institution.

Is Brexit a good thing or a success. Different thing. Trade is down. Less money. The EU can be deeply flawed and so can British politicians. The vaccine program is a good decision, but it’s the work that has gone into getting there, because everyone in Europe is going to need vaccines. It’s a bloody great thing. Our death rate is tragic. Morally we can’t watch our friends and family die if we have the capacity to address it.

It’s not too much to think some leaders under pressure are not good. VdL is that. Boris Johnson is that too. In the end because of this mess in the EU, there may be much more death. I hope there is no export ban by the EU. It seems like lose lose for everyone.

As I understand it, the Dutch factory has capacity problems similar to those in factories in Britain and we could help them with that, increasing capacity for the EU. It’s in their interest and ours.

Our death rate is tragic. Morally we can’t watch our friends and family die if we have the capacity to address it

In the end because of this mess in the EU, there may be much more death. I hope there is no export ban by the EU. It seems like lose lose for everyone

Do you not see the contradiction in those two statements?

There is a shortage of vaccine, the UK has lowed its death rate to that which we had in early autumn, yet still we insist on vaccinating all adults, regardless of risk..... meanwhile the EU is approving the export of vaccine to the UK, whilst their own peoples are dying in their 1000s.

To keep our vaccine in the UK and to ensure foreign made reaches UK, we wrote up contracts that specify a UK first delivery schedule - no export ban required but it's there in all but name.

As I understand it, the Dutch factory has capacity problems similar to those in factories in Britain and we could help them with that, increasing capacity for the EU

Surely the manufacturer is addressing this?
.... given our contract, its just more vaccine to be sent to the UK, not the EU.

The AZ vaccine is a gift from the UK government and scientists and people to the world.

Here we have a super effective, safe, easy to handle, affordable and incredibly quickly produced vaccine THAT HAS BEEN MANUFACTURED AT COST AND NOT FOR PROFIT.

On top of that the UK has contributed to the Covax program to provide vaccines for poorer nations.

This contribution to the world pandemic cannot be denied or minimised, it is simply the most important contribution any country has made.

Thank you and well done for saving the lives of so many of our citizens is the appropriate response from VDL and Macron and the rest of the world.

The AZ vaccine is a gift from the UK government and scientists and people to the world

I though Johnson has said its down to capitalism and greed? and its a 50% owned and funded Swedish company.... with scientists and trials that took place from around the world.......but feel free to belittle the european/international component with your nationalistic rant.

On top of that the UK has contributed to the Covax program to provide vaccines for poorer nations

Not given a single vaccine, money yes, vaccine no.

YANBU. If they weren't harming their own citizens by decreasing uptake in the AZ vaccine, then I'd say I was glad that the EU is showing their true colours for the wold to see.

As it is, Macron is denying a safe vaccine to his under-55s and they're all giving ammunition to their anti-vaxxers.

@jasjas1973 no other country has insisted on a not for profit vaccine, this was insisted upon by Oxford scientists and agreed by AZ.

@Itsalonghaul

I simply said that the commission used Ireland and played the country as a pawn in brexit, which is acknowledged in Ireland as much as it is here. I don't think it was kind of VDL to threaten all of us in the way she did, without at least warning Ireland, it was disrespectful.

VDL does remind me very much of a dictator, the fact she is also German is very unfortunate. I feel very sorry for all countries in the bloc with such an incompetent at the helm, but she has great hair I will give her that.

Her incompetence, which is becoming dangerous, has become more and more apparent.

She's done damage to the EU's reputation and image around the world, whatever we here in the UK think.

if this is how it is going to be I am not sure I ever want to visit again

Gosh. You’ll be terribly missed.

The AZ vaccine is a gift from the UK government and scientists and people to the world

It's this kind of nonsense that makes the rest of the world roll it's eyes at the UK!

I think the developers of all the Covid vaccines are to be much lauded and much appreciated. Not sure how this can be extended to randoms who just happen to exist in the same countries.

And the medicines (and healthcare products) regulators.

The not for profit element of AZ is slightly more complex. The Oxford researchers insisted on that bit. Not the gov't. Pharmaceutical manufacturers fully expect to make profits at some stage, so the no profit element won't be very longterm.

Seeming there was a memo of understanding that it only lasts while there is a global pandemic. AZ can declare when the pandemic is over. This article suggests that this could be as early as July 2021, but the pandemic period might be extended if AstraZeneca determines it’s not over, the memo said.

I hope that AZ has supplied the poorer nations before they declare the pandemic is over and it becomes more expensive. Although they did state it would be 'in perpetuity' at cost to them.

I don't know if this is a huge issue in the wealthier nations. Don't forget the US hasn't even authorizated AZ yet, so cost is moot. Other vaccines will be coming on stream soon (fingers crossed).

www.fiercepharma.com/pharma/astrazeneca-puts-a-time-limit-its-covid-19-no-profit-pledge-report

However, as early as October last year, it became clear that AstraZeneca’s no-profit pledge came with riders. In an agreement with the Brazilian public research body Fiocruz, AstraZeneca walked back on its promise when the company said it has “right under contract to declare pandemic over by July 2021”, the Financial Times reported. This is despite Brazil being one of the countries where AstraZeneca conducted the phase-3 trials.

www.thehindu.com/sci-tech/science/reneging-on-the-no-profit-pledge-to-supply-oxford-vaccine/article33705151.ece

Then you have to bear in mind that getting a Covid vaccine might not just be a once off vaccination. We may have to get repeats.

On reflection, maybe the lower cost has made it a no brainer for wealthy countries like the US to stock pile a vaccine they haven't even given the green light for. Because it is cheap as chips.

While acknowledging it was with the best of intentions, there may be unintended consequences. It might have been better if the 'at cost' had been ring fenced for poor countries. Maybe the AZ vaccine stock pile in the US, which they will not allow to be used, may have been put to better use in poorer countries.

And while we bicker and argue about the vaccines, China and Russia are going to take full advantage.

Seriously we need to sharpen up and focus on the real dangers that are growing by the day.

Yes the vaccine situation is upsetting for all of us for different reasons, by whilst we are distracted like small children fighting over the sweeties - there are bigger things going on behind the scenes. Quite frankly we need to sort it out, snap out of it and focus on security.
Not that anyone could give a damn about the poor Uyghurs on here. What do we suppose their chances of a vaccine are whilst they are stuck in a concentration camp? But the escalation in tensions over this between the EU/UK and China is now very serious:

www.ft.com/content/6b236a71-512e-4561-a73c-b1d69b7f486b

A balanced view from El Pais newspaper today:

“It’s going to be make-or-break for the European Commission during the four weeks of April,” warns Nicolás González Casares, a Member of the European Parliament (MEP) with the Group of the Progressive Alliance of Socialists and Democrats who also sits on the parliament’s Industry, Research and Energy Committee monitoring the vaccination strategy.

“If the dose distribution speed does not pick up at the beginning of the second quarter, the EU Commission will face an explosive political situation, with a rising wave of infections, a population that is increasingly weary of restrictions and governments that will blame Brussels for the mess,” he predicts.

The tension can be felt in Brussels, and the first cracks in the common strategy are already apparent. Austria, which had originally favored AstraZeneca and bought very few vaccines from Pfizer-BioNTech, is now leading a request by several central and Eastern European countries to “correct” alleged inequalities in the distribution of doses among the 27 member states. Other members are rejecting the idea.

The clash over fair vaccine distribution could sour a European summit due to take place on Thursday and Friday of this week. The formal goal of the gathering is to rethink the EU’s geostrategic future, particularly with regard to Russia and Turkey. But diplomatic sources admit that it could instead turn into a crisis meeting to try to save national vaccination campaigns.

You can see from this, that the cracks are indeed very large indeed. Because not only do we have the issue of contractual supply to EU countries, but there also appears to be many claims that the vaccines that are arriving are not being distributed fairly.

Things are far worse than they appear, and that is why VDL is applying the thumb screws to her nearest neighbours and 'allies'. They are in full crisis mode now.

english.elpais.com/society/2021-03-22/astrazeneca-fiasco-undermines-eu-strategy-to-beat-coronavirus-health-and-economic-crisis.html

Calm down there Kofi Annan

Why thank you! Kofi is one of my all time heroes, what a compliment! Thanks Jelly.

@Itsalonghaul Not that anyone could give a damn about the poor Uyghurs on here. And you know this how?

Do you give a damn? If so, what are you doing about it that others aren't? Maybe the halo one puts over oneself doesn't signify much, apart from self-aggrandisement and vanity of competitive virtue signalling.

Don't you get bored spouting this nonsense. We are campaigning and have been for years about this, and supporting the following charity if you are interested in actually helping, rather than posting endless soundbites:

pennyappeal.org/

Why thank you! Kofi is one of my all time heroes, what a compliment! Thanks Jelly

I doubt he'd say the same. Pretty sure he'd be disgusted at some of your comments.

Just out of interest, the EU are setting up a new agency called HERA (health emergency preparedness and response agency) to deal with future threats of things like Covid. Maybe to try and respond more quickly to threats like this, which may become more common. The HERA incubator will set the foundations for the new agency.

ec.europa.eu/info/live-work-travel-eu/coronavirus-response/safe-covid-19-vaccines-europeans/questions-and-answers-covid-19-vaccination-eu_en#hera-incubator

But you're on here, @Itsalonghaul. And you maintained that nobody on here could give a damn about the Uyghurs.

Ain't me doing the sound bites and baseless accusations.