To think that the EU have done more to endorse Brexit in the last 2 weeks than the UK managed in nearly 5 years

[Butterflyfluff]

I’ll start by saying I’ve never thought Brexit was in the long term interest of the UK and still don’t

But dear God, the EU’s behaviour over vaccinations and, in particular, the blatant prejudice around the Astra Zeneca vaccine has done more to endorse the UK leaving than anything that has been said in the UK before, during and after the vote

I think it was reported in the press at the time the Gov leaned on the MRHA to hurry up. I think it's one of the fee time Gov did things right. Even if there were problems with a vaccine it's highly unlikely they would be as bad as covid

There’s a difference between being fast and cutting corners. Eg they worked through the weekends but the process was the same as any other vaccine. Nothing was left out which is what pp implied.

Obvs not just weekends the whole system had big overlaps and was design extremely well

"in his case IMO it’s been largely out of resentment/pique/wounded French pride, because the French Sanofi vaccine that they were relying on, didn’t work,"

I'm not French and have no skin in the game, but it amuses me that was a GlacoSmithKline/Sanofi vaccine when the UK placed it's early orders and now that it doesn't work it's a French Sanofi vaccine. Of course, had it worked, it would have been a Glaxo Smith Kline British success story vaccine, like the Oxford one!

Also, the EU placed an equal amount of orders for the Ox/AZ and the GSK/Sanofi.

@arethereanyleftatall

Yanbu.

At least now the words 'just give me one reason, one reason, please, why brexit is a good thing' can never again be, sensibly, uttered.

Must be such a relief when every single other piece of real evidence makes you look so very, very wrong.

@QuentinInQuarantino

Shh, you'll upset them with your inconvenient facts.

Even if the UK had still been in the EU it could still have done its own thing over vaccines - after all it managed to keep its own currency and stay out of Schengen and had managed to carve itself its own convenient and exceptional niche while still retaining all the other benefits of membership. It has done well with the vaccine, but that comes hot on the heels of having one of the worst death rates per capita in the world and the final results are not yet in. Covid is a completely separate issue to Brexit, but is being used as a smokescreen for the effects of the latter.

[quote donewithitalltodayandxmas]@OuiOuiKitty hopefully it stays that way so much difference between countries with some larger countries being hit hard but also some smaller ones also being badly hit
Overall eurooe has a whole has been hit badly in general [/quote]
No. Not true. Lots of European nations have done very well. Look to Iceland.
The U.K. has appalling statistics on excess deaths. Far higher mortality than any other country. Too many people have died unnecessarily. Too many grieving families.
That’s not bad luck, that’s poor decision making and ignoring clinical advice.

www.politico.eu/article/threats-but-few-details-as-european-commission-demands-reciprocity-in-vaccine-exports/

Covid is a completely separate issue to Brexit, but is being used as a smokescreen for the effects of the latter. Yes totally - the economic impact of Brexit will be worse than Covid, but will be obscured now (deliberately) by the liars who led the Brexit campaign.

Covid is a completely separate issue to Brexit, but is being used as a smokescreen for the effects of the latter

No to the first half, yes to the second. It's not a completely seperate issue at all, since one has influenced the other and vice versa. They're entangled.

In fact, in all 27 countries, anti eu sentiment is historically low. And Italy and Spain will be the first to benefit from the biggest ever crisis budget.
France with their focus on greatness of French are really similar to many posting here. Hungary is doing own thing and uses Russian Sputnik, France is really waiting for French vaccine and what can we do.

I'm really worried that our whole vaccination plan could be derailed by falling out with Europe tbh. If we were inside the bloc, they would be the same side.

Basically we need internationalism not nationalism right now.

I see that the Dutch compromise is likely to be the solution, not the insane export ban. Let us hope things carry on like this, with the Dutch being much more reasonable interlocutors than the Commission. It should take the heat out of it.

A report out this morning says the UK is heading for ten years of pain to get back to where is was in 2019. Which was not great anyway.
Whereas EU countries (like that "little backwater" mentioned previously) have economies that grew even throughout covid lockdowns and are looking at coming out of this in ok shape.

There's very very little anti-eu sentiment in the EU, and the international papers are not reporting the EU vaccine difficulties like the UK papers are. The UK is trying to paint a picture for their own people, and it's clearly working, but its not shared with the rest of the world, at all. The anti-EU sentiment is mainly in the UK.

@jellybellybanana

A report out this morning says the UK is heading for ten years of pain to get back to where is was in 2019. Which was not great anyway. Whereas EU countries (like that "little backwater" mentioned previously) have economies that grew even throughout covid lockdowns and are looking at coming out of this in ok shape.

There's very very little anti-eu sentiment in the EU, and the international papers are not reporting the EU vaccine difficulties like the UK papers are. The UK is trying to paint a picture for their own people, and it's clearly working, but its not shared with the rest of the world, at all. The anti-EU sentiment is mainly in the UK.

There are many posting willing U.K. to fail. It’s what fifth / sixth biggest economy.

What happens next we’ll see.

I don’t think the COVID decade as people are calling it is just for the UK alone. It will be impacting our neighbours too. Vaccine preparedness is going to be important in that, but the UK needs to revive its public services - and accept much more readily that a certain level of spending is actually necessary to keep the economy afloat.

US now investigating whether AZ provided incomplete data from the trial. awaits posters calling US evil and out to get the British

There are many posting willing U.K. to fail. It’s what fifth / sixth biggest economy

This is the attitude I'm talking about. It's not about "willing you to fail". The report I'm talking about is from UK experts, no-one else. It's about what is actually occurring, the big bad EU isn't putting any kind of spell on you. Drop the paranoia.

I don’t think the COVID decade as people are calling it is just for the UK alone. It will be impacting our neighbours too. Vaccine preparedness is going to be important in that, but the UK needs to revive its public services - and accept much more readily that a certain level of spending is actually necessary to keep the economy afloat

The difference is that the UK was already on the back foot, and then add in Brexit, as well as the mishandling of the entire pandemic (up to the vaccine part)....it's not a good position compared to many EU countries.
This isn't meaness, its just a fact.

@jellybellybanana

There are many posting willing U.K. to fail. It’s what fifth / sixth biggest economy

This is the attitude I'm talking about. It's not about "willing you to fail". The report I'm talking about is from UK experts, no-one else. It's about what is actually occurring, the big bad EU isn't putting any kind of spell on you. Drop the paranoia.

Nah people revel in it. You see it a lot. Someone said we were fucked earlier. Whatever

Hopefully when economic growth starts to happen all that will die down. People can focus on their own recovery

Nah people revel in it. You see it a lot. Someone said we were fucked earlier. Whatever

Well, it's a valid opinion. The Brexit fallout has barely begun yet, it could be pretty bad. Considering the vile anti-EU sentiment here, the bizarre rants, the subtle (and overt) racism, you can't be too surprised if people come back a bit strong. You get back what you give out.

@jellybellybanana

Nah people revel in it. You see it a lot. Someone said we were fucked earlier. Whatever

Well, it's a valid opinion. The Brexit fallout has barely begun yet, it could be pretty bad. Considering the vile anti-EU sentiment here, the bizarre rants, the subtle (and overt) racism, you can't be too surprised if people come back a bit strong. You get back what you give out.

The hostility is extreme. If you think it’s fine go for it but it doesn’t show posters in a good light.

The hostility is extreme. If you think it’s fine go for it but it doesn’t show posters in a good light

From British people against the EU, and some of the people in it? Yes, it is extreme, and it doesn't show posters in a good light.