Putting an upright piano on top floor flat

[Khtchkn]

Preparing for a diploma hopefully end of this year. Grew up with a Yamaha grand piano, stopped for 10 years now back again but using a digital piano as no space for a grand in our flat. It’s really not working I think (piano teacher agrees). I’m wanting to hire an upright piano until my exam at the end of this year. I knocked on my neighbours door below me to ask but no answer, will pop a note through tomorrow. I told the neighbour I’d play for 1hr/2hr daily anytime between 9am-7pm as I have my 2 year old asleep. Also I won’t be playing twinkle twinkle little star or fur Elise constantly. I have done my grade 8 and preparing for a diploma recital! I will pop a letter to my neighbour downstairs but wanted to hear other ppls opinions . Hopefully they won’t care and will agree to it, as you’re allowed do whatever is your normal routine during the hours that aren’t too early or late. Just thought I’d be a decent neighbour and ask before

The logistics of getting an upright piano into a top floor flat. Not impossible obviously but it will be expensive.

And it’s also incredibly selfish. Your requirements do not suit your practical situation. And your necessary practice will be disturbed by annoyed neighbours interrupting you.

I think you need to book a place to play away from your flat. It's not fair on your neighbours. Imagine trying to work or settle a child to nap with that noise ? As accomplished as you probably are it's just not fair

I forgot to say, I do have a good carpet underneath my instrument (not a piano but similar sound and size), and I did not place it against a shared wall. Definitely check your rental agreement as yes, some specify about instruments.

Jeeeez calling me “selfish” etc. Did you not understand? I obviously wouldn’t hire an upright piano if my neighbour would say no. Hence me checking with them. Hardly “selfish” to kindly check with them beforehand. And FYI to people saying neighbours would “loath me” and how “terrible” it is, my mother had a grand piano in her top floor flat for 30 years, no complaints! Some very negative people here
At diploma level digital is not good enough to practice on. in the actual exam you would be playing on an acoustic

I would absolutely hate it if I could hear my neighbours playing a piano. It would really really irritate me.

It sounds like you are telling your neighbours and not asking them?

I would like it. Much better than hearing a child jumping off the sofa or from a doorframe like on another thread!

Personally I would love to hear someone practising a well played classical instrument. But I think that you might be better at looking at something like renting a storage space/ container space, and practising there. More expense but more neighbour friendly, easier to get a piano in etc.
Good luck with practice

At diploma level digital is not good enough to practice on. in the actual exam you would be playing on an acoustic

And yes, 100%. I have a student who also plays piano, at diploma level. They have a small digital keyboard (not even a piano) and it’s really holding them back. You need weighted keys and to regularly work with the acoustics of the actual instrument, which is unachievable unless you practise on a real piano.

Or even rent a small office space. ?

It entirely depends on your neighbours. This wouldn’t bother me at all.

@BrightYellowDaffodil

you’re allowed do whatever is your normal routine during the hours that aren’t too early or late

Not quite true. Noise has to be reasonable and - depending on how well soundproofed the flats are or aren’t - piano playing in what is effectively a shared buildingmight be classed as an unreasonable disturbance. Think about how sound travels, particularly as a piano sits on the floor rather than, say, a woodwind or string instrument. Even putting down the pedals could be an endless clunk-clunk-clunk for whoever is downstairs so for the sake of not being That Neighbour I’d stick to a digital one (with headphones).

You could check with the council but I don't think playing a piano would count as unreasonable noise, I'm not saying your neighbours will like it...

I have to say if it's 2 hours a day I don't think it's especially unreasonable, if your downstairs neighbours are in they can stick in earplugs.

Mumsnet won't like this although there's no law to prevent it.
However have you considered a Silent Series piano. I have one. Standard acoustic piano with sensor technology to enable use with headphones.

YABVU. You absolutely cannot inflict this upon anyone.

If Elton John was my neighbour I still wouldn't want to hear him playing the piano every day through my wall/ceiling.
While I appreciate pianos are important to some people many people (like me) don't share the same view. It's a big ask to expect people to put up with that no matter how well its played.
And I imagine agreeing to it and living with it are two different things.

www.yamahamusiclondon.com/?keywords=Silent+pianos

This is completely normal, though maybe the hours could be more sociable eg 9-7pm instead. Checking people don’t work shifts is very considerate too. We have a property in Amsterdam, and to get a piano to the third floor had to hire a company who removed the window and got it in by crane. The neighbours didn’t bat an eyelid, it’s so normal.

Im sorry OP, but this is selfish.

As is this Most musicians have also had to WFH this year, we can’t just stop practising indefinitely in case it annoys the neighbours.

In this case, you need to arrange another practice venue. People are entitled to not be disturbed by loud noise in their home.

I’m a stone carver, is it ok for me to bring my work into a flat and sod everyone else? Of course not.

Is there anywhere near you where you can practice? Churches and community halls often have pianos.
I completely understand - digital pianos aren’t up to the job for preparing for a diploma.

Well I don't know about downstairs, but our next door neighbour has a piano in his living room (which is at the same level as our bedrooms), and it sounds like it's in our house, and is very annoying.

But then he often plays for a lot more than 2 hours per day, sometimes at antisocial times, and always badly. Your usage would not bother me in comparison.

IMO anything over grade 8 piano is a serious commitment. The amount of practice needed has an effect on your life and, if you live in a flat, those around you.
DS had both a keyboard (for unsociable hours) and an upright at that level. We lived in a top floor flat, kept the piano in a bookcase with sound insulation and on a wooden platform. It still vibrated through the fibre of the building.
He now has an upright with a digital add-on which detaches the hammer mechanism, making it into a silent piano. It can be used with headphones or loudspeakers, has extra voices and a recording facility. It cost about €300 to install on an existing piano, which still needs tuning, unfortunately!

Piano removers use a sort of crawler tractor to climb stairs which is fascinating to watch!

I wouldn't mind a neighbour having a piano, but 2 hours a day in a flat would bother me. It's not just the act of piano playing, but the fact that practising an instrument will mean the same bars over and over and over. The poor neighbour would have the equivalent of 1-2 working days a week subjected to hearing bars from the same pieces.

My mother had a grand piano in her top floor flat for 30 years, no complaints!

Yes and maybe her neighbours were non confrontational people who sat there bothered by it every day but didn’t complain to keep the peace, or for any other number of reasons.

Do you have a floor weight limit? When I lived in second floor new build, there were weight limits. A metal framed piano would have been out of the question with all the other crap appliances I had. Might be worth checking.

@partyatthepalace I believe it depends on how much it impacts on the neighbour ie how much sound is transmitted.

In this case, you need to arrange another practice venue.

And what would these venues be, during a lockdown? I don’t play the piano, which can be found relatively easily in churches, halls, schools... I play an instrument that’s 90lbs, 2m high and very hard to transport. I also don’t own a car.

This is a complete non-issue for me, as I have no problems practising in my flat. But others need to take this into account when trying to find an alternative venue. It’s not as easy as showing up at the Barbican and asking for a practice room