To consider ‘birdnesting’ when separating from DP?

[Bluebellwoodland]

Me and DP have a 3 year old DS together. We are separating and are considering the idea of ‘bird nesting’ and wondering if anyone has done similar?

Birdnesting (or nesting, as it is more commonly referred to) in a divorce or separation is where parents take turns staying in the family home. Rather than making the kids traipse back and forth between two homes, the kids stay put and the parents trade off being the "on-duty parent

Also, if the time spent by each parent away from the child's house is staying with family then each parent doesn't have a permanent home and it might not be ideal to be living with family for what could be years and years. If one or both parents gets fed up with that and wants their own personal space then they'd have to be able to afford that as well as the child's main home. If child is only 3 then what happens if and when each parent meets a new partner and they want to move in together? Would the partner want to spend half their time moving to and from the child's house? Would that be acceptable even? Or would the parent and their partner have to accept that they will always have to spend half their time apart. What if the parent & new partner had a child?

I guess what I'm saying is that even if it seems a good idea when child is age 3 and there's no other partners to consider, would it still work when they are aged 7 or 10 or 14, and if not, then the child's home arrangement would likely stop then which could be more upsetting than if they'd always been used to two separate homes from the start.

@Shufflebudge

It’s not a good idea in my opinion as there’s just not much point to it and getting your son used to two homes is far easier at 3 than it is at 8. Just ensure your child has enough stuff at both houses and certainly don’t get them to ‘pack’ for the other house like a poster above had to. And live very close to each other.

My son moves between houses of me and my ex - we get on very well - and he loves having two homes - in fact he said he felt sorry for the children that don’t as they must get bored!

Especially during this awful last year, my children say theyve had it better than most, at least having a change of house/scene/dynamic moving from one parent to the other. It also hasn't been so sufficating with the same people spending all their time together - and before anyone jumps at me, lots of my friends tell me they are by now heartily sick of all this family time.

A poster mentioned packing up to go from one house to the other....it really doesnt and shouldnt have to be like that and any logistical issues should be smoothed over by the parents. Bar maybe a special teddy or the phone for older ones, there shouldn't be any need for mass movement of stuff.

There are also accounts of children being very upset that they don't know where their parent lives when they aren't with them and are never living in their parent's actual home with them. You are thinking what is best for you financially and not thinking of your children at all

What utter offensive rubbish. You might disagree that it is not best, that is your opinion which you are entitled to. But to think you can see inside my mind to know my motivations - that I am not thinking of my children at all - is not only extraordinary arrogance, but extremely offensive. I am entirely thinking of my children, whom I know and their situation and personalities and needs intimately, whereas you know them, nor me, at all.

And I haven't noticed those accounts you mention. Maybe I missed them. All I saw were people imagining that may be the case. Just like you are imagining you can see inside my mind.

It’s completely unrealistic to think that neither of you are ever going to meet a new partner. Many people move on to new long term relationships within a few years of a divorce. You need to separate properly now and each have your own home. It will be easier if you can live fairly near each other to avoid having a long journey but I realise that finances don’t always allow this. Your 3 year old will be fine with spending quality time in each home and will adapt very quickly.

I’ve wondered about this - thinking of the children who never know where their belongings know are, having gone from their dad’s to their mum’s house after divorce.

Sounds good for the kids.
I think when the lawyers get involved around the actual business of divorce with bird-nesting you might find everybody involved in the divorce - you, your ex, the lawyers get demanding. Lawyers in my experience almost have to paint the worst pictures of the spouses to get a settlement. I won’t want to come back from work to find my ex wanting to take me to task (or vice versa) because the lawyers were shit stirring when really we should be talking through childcare issues. Obviously some divorces can be do-it-yourself and quick but if the divorce settlement maybe complicated - no way.
My ex and I are friendly now at our daughter’s wedding and graduation but in those early years of actual divorcing - we’d have both found it tricky to bird-nest. Horrid but you’re encouraged to see yourself as a victim by lawyers.

Rip the plaster off now OP. You say you will do it whilst your DS needs you practically and emotionally...that is for a min of 15 years to come.

A 3 year old is far better equipped to deal with a break up now than a 13 year old, because that's how it will feel to them.

You are stalling and putting off the inevitable.

@whateverhappenstomorrow I guess you cross posted with me sharing my DH/his Ex's negative experience having actually done it? The situation threw up emotional aspects that they couldn't really have foreseen until they'd actually lived it for a few months (and I'm not referring to moving on with new partners which is easily anticipated of course).

FWIW DH bought a house within easy walking distance of his ex's house which worked well to give the DC a sense of stability.

"There are also accounts of children being very upset that they don't know where their parent lives when they aren't with them and are never living in their parent's actual home with them. You are thinking what is best for you financially and not thinking of your children at all."

I think people on this thread have speculated that this is how children might feel, but not sure about anyone saying that is actually what happened (may have missed them obviously).

Having said that, this point has really make me think about the feasibility of doing it long term if a new partner came onto the scene.

"It also meant that to this day they blame their step-parent for the ending of the arrangement, which is very unfair."

But.... still no idea how we could have two houses big enough for DC to swap between as we wouldn't have enough money.

My ex and I get on ok but if we did this there's no way on earth I could manage to not snoop in his 'room' or part of the house. And I was was snooping, guarentee he'd be snooping too.

Your child will need you practically and emotionally for at least 15 years from now and beyond!

Sorry I think it's odd and impractical and agree with the comments about the child being the only 'permanent' family member in the house.

At 3 your child will adapt very quickly to two homes.

Also if it was me I would be wondering where my mum or dad live when not in the 'nest'. I know my 4 year old would he asking me about my other home and asking to go there!

Sounds like a lovely idea- gets DC used to only having one parent at a time before having to uproot them, rather than doing it in one fell swoop.

My sister did this with her exDH for a short amount of time, it was horrible! The ended the arrangement after less than six months (she was ready well before that but needed to sort out the logistical part!).

She was filling the fridge, cleaning the house, washing beddings/towels etc so exDH enjoyed a nice clean house but he wasn't reciprocating.
He would leave the fridge half empty, with his leftovers in greasy plates, food that she didn't know for how long it had been there, milk/butter/jam with a tiny amount left. Same with handsoap, showe gel etc (he would just add water until the end of his week).
Half hearted attempt at cleaning so if she complained he could say it was because her standards were too high.
He never washed the DC's beddings/towels or kitchen towels. Clothes at a stretch if nagged but most of the time he would leave her with a full laundry basket.
He would not change lightbulbs or do minor jobs (claimed he didn't notice what needed doing). He also left the DC's bedroom in a terrible mess - think all toy boxes emptied on the floor. DC's wardrobes were always a mess as well, as if he would unfold items to have a look and put them back without folding again. DC's shoes and coats were left muddy.

Basically, she found that she either had to accept to live in a dirty/messy house, do it all herself, or spend her time nagging her ex.

Then he had a woman spend the night despite him and my sister agreeing that they wouldn't do that. My DSis wasn't too happy to know that this woman was sleeping in her bed.

She is much much happier on her own, even if the house is super small.

@Fourandtwentymilliondoors

I discovered this term recently and I think it’s a brilliant idea.

I’m the child of divorced parents and my childhood was spent moving from one house to the other and I hated it. My friends in similar situations hated it too. It just seemed to me that my parents were giving it “I’m all right jack”, as they lived permanently in their new homes and yet I was the one packing up each week. I never felt I belonged anywhere, I constantly had the wrong things at the wrong house and it was just miserable. I left home at the age of 18 purely to have one place I could bloody live that didn’t involve the constant packing and moving.

Lots of children end up feeling the way I did when my parents divorced so please do the nesting. My childhood would have been so much better if my parents had done it!

This breaks my heart. My and DH separated a while ago, because he commited adultery. I am in our marital home, our DC permanent residence. But they do have to spend nights at their Dad's new place.

The guilt I feel that our DC have to stay at his place in unbelievable. They don't have their own space there, it's a small property compared to our marital home.

I am constantly worried it will damage my kids in some way. Emotionally I am distraught that my kids are now from a broken home purely because their Dad couldn't keep his dick to himself

[quote MyCatHatesEverybody]@whateverhappenstomorrow I guess you cross posted with me sharing my DH/his Ex's negative experience having actually done it? The situation threw up emotional aspects that they couldn't really have foreseen until they'd actually lived it for a few months (and I'm not referring to moving on with new partners which is easily anticipated of course).

FWIW DH bought a house within easy walking distance of his ex's house which worked well to give the DC a sense of stability.[/quote]
No, I did see your post.

I live in another country and a judge decided on this in the divorce of a former colleague because there were three children and two parents and he didn't know why the children should be the ones to have to move and go from one home to the other.
From what I remember, they didn't stick to it though.

I would do this for older children but think that at 3 they can adapt to new normal of having 2 houses.

@LovelyLovelyWarmCoffee

My sister did this with her exDH for a short amount of time, it was horrible! The ended the arrangement after less than six months (she was ready well before that but needed to sort out the logistical part!).

She was filling the fridge, cleaning the house, washing beddings/towels etc so exDH enjoyed a nice clean house but he wasn't reciprocating.
He would leave the fridge half empty, with his leftovers in greasy plates, food that she didn't know for how long it had been there, milk/butter/jam with a tiny amount left. Same with handsoap, showe gel etc (he would just add water until the end of his week).
Half hearted attempt at cleaning so if she complained he could say it was because her standards were too high.
He never washed the DC's beddings/towels or kitchen towels. Clothes at a stretch if nagged but most of the time he would leave her with a full laundry basket.
He would not change lightbulbs or do minor jobs (claimed he didn't notice what needed doing). He also left the DC's bedroom in a terrible mess - think all toy boxes emptied on the floor. DC's wardrobes were always a mess as well, as if he would unfold items to have a look and put them back without folding again. DC's shoes and coats were left muddy.

Basically, she found that she either had to accept to live in a dirty/messy house, do it all herself, or spend her time nagging her ex.

Then he had a woman spend the night despite him and my sister agreeing that they wouldn't do that. My DSis wasn't too happy to know that this woman was sleeping in her bed.

She is much much happier on her own, even if the house is super small.

I agree it couldn't work with a total selfish arse like this.

God no, you'd have no privacy in your own home.
I'd hate my dh if we split to see what I was doing, snooping round etc.
No way.

I have thought that that is what DH and I would do if we split up ... but we have older DC with ASD so transitions are more complicated and bedrooms in different houses would be challenging. We also are fortunate enough to have a large house with an annexe so DH would move into that for his time with the DC.

I don't think it's ideal though... if I had one child, a 3 year old, I would be planning to live near each other but in separate places. Friends who do this find it works well, especially as the DC grow and can walk between.

I think this works in a scenario where kids are older and settled in high school/friendships/exams for the short to medium term.
But your situation where the child is 3 - just go to your new lives straightaway and don't prolong the agony or cause more confusion, because in 1-2 years it will be just as difficult as it is now, if not worse because the kid is older and more aware at 4 or 5...

@Didoofcarthage sounds like you hired terrible solicitors. I’ve never heard of a decent solicitor encouraging disagreements to get a better deal, sounds like they were just angling to rack up their hourly fees.

My divorce was completely amenable and we sorted the money stuff out fine. The number one thing my solicitor said was that in order to protect our overall money we needed to keep it amicable and not end up arguing/ going to court as we’d just spend that money on solicitors fees and have less to split between us.

I am planning to do this and find it interesting that those who are so against it have never tried it, but there are accounts of children preferring it and of children hating the two homes thing.

I believe it’s possible to know whether something wouldn’t work without trying it out first, especially something as crucial as where your child is going to live and with whom.

Most parents make most decisions on that basis because putting a child through various different scenarios just so you can say you’ve tried it isn’t good for a child’s well-being.

I would support the idea if it was for a defined period of time, say to avoid a child moving school, or until exams, but not otherwise.

Living not too far away from each other seems the best option to me.

[quote Shufflebudge]@Didoofcarthage sounds like you hired terrible solicitors. I’ve never heard of a decent solicitor encouraging disagreements to get a better deal, sounds like they were just angling to rack up their hourly fees.

My divorce was completely amenable and we sorted the money stuff out fine. The number one thing my solicitor said was that in order to protect our overall money we needed to keep it amicable and not end up arguing/ going to court as we’d just spend that money on solicitors fees and have less to split between us.[/quote]
I think you must have been particularly fortunate then. My solicitor was a very decent man and considered to be on the very consiliatory end of the spectrum, but even with him, it was me that had to keep bringing it back to compromise, knowing when to give in on certain things. Not least because I knew my ex-husbands solicitor was an attack dog who would have pushed it as far as it would go/make as much money as possible. I refused to play that game. And it is a game for many solicitors, they get to walk away while the couple survey the damage which can be much worse than mere money