Had enough of ex's contact schedule for DD

[pop88]

I'm posting here for traffic.

I have a DD8 with my ex. We separated when DD was 2. Me and ex don't have a good relationship due to him being controlling and all contact is done via third party.

Ex works shifts. He gets 8 weeks of shifts at a time, and will then send me the dates he wants DD for those weeks. I usually agree to the dates as it stresses me out trying to negotiate with him.

I've just had the next 8 weeks of dates sent through and they are dreadful. DD will be seeing him for 2 weekends out of 9, the rest being mid week when she is at school. For these particular dates he has 2 weekends off a month, and 2 at work. For the 2 'off' weekends he wants DD for one of them, and the other one to himself (although he has other children living with him).

I have just had enough of being dictated by when ex works. I have always accommodated the fact that he works shifts, but it is getting to the point where I feel like I can't plan anything (appreciate we are currently in a lockdown). I never know when DD is with me beyond 8 weeks. I hate the fact that I don't really have any say in when I have DD and when I don't (he always argues if I say a date doesn't work). He insists on having DD for 10 nights a month so it's not a case of trying to work out a few nights a month.

Is this something that I'm just going to have to suck up until DD is older or does anyone have any suggestions on how I can deal with this better? Thanks

The shared calendar idea is excellent - you put DD's blocked out dates on there (you don't need to say what you're doing if you don't want to, just turn the date red) and also inform the third party of the dates via email to pass on.

"I have blocked out 5th May, and the first week of the summer holidays in July on the calendar, so DD will not be available for contact on those dates. Please do check the calendar when you get your shifts and before you plan your contact days."

Ignore any tantrums or "cross" messages. As long as you are reasonable, no court would expect you to bend entirely to his preferences about when to see his DD.

I was also going to suggest a shared calendar where you put just the plans for you DD. Put them on the Calendar as soon as the plans are made. That way he can see when she isn’t available and pick his 10 days out of what’s left. Tell him he needs to enter them on the calendar otherwise you will assume DD is free to make plans with you or her friends/clubs etc.

why don't you want your DD to see him mid-week? Those ordinary days when you just have dinner & a bed time story are a very important part of parenting - let him do them sometimes. especially it gives you more time at the weekend.

@parietal It's not that I don't want DD to see him during the week, I just know that she prefers to see him at the weekend as they can do things other than the school run.

I guess it really depends weather he’s being difficult or if that’s just the way his shifts fall. If it’s the way his shifts fall has he asked his work for a flexible working agreement? Would a court order help him to secure said flexible working agreement? Can you perhaps go to mediation for a safe space to talk about how you can get a better balance?
I appreciate this is difficult when communication is an issue but if you’re able to do it calmly and communicate it’s for DD best interests perhaps you’ll come to a better arrangement

Shared Callander is also an excellent idea - make your plans and he can also somewhat fit it around you.

Don't go to mediation with someone that tries to control you.

Just do it as a done deal, if he isn't happy he can take it to court. You know he won't be happy with whatever you "suggest" because he wants to be control and this is you taking control back.

If gets any sniff that you will compromise or he can bully you then he will do it just because he can.

This is why it's presented in advance of his schedule as when DD isn't available as in it's not negotiable and his rights to 120 nights per year contact does not trump DDs rights to have a life and plans.

We actually went to mediation last year (virtually). After one session the mediator said that it wasn't suitable due to my ex's loud and angry outbursts over zoom so that was the end of that.

Never ever go to mediation or relationship counselling with an abusive partner.

You have to grey rock him and stick up for yourself. We are all behind you.

Well if you did shift work you would have to find childcare for the times you couldn't care for her, so that's what he needs to do for his times. Or ask his work for flexible working if that's possible.

You aren't the default parent who has to accommodate everything he wants, just because you have her more often, so you need to negotiate set days between you and stick with them if this isn't working for you and her.

E.g. every other weekend and 6 other nights per month, if they need to total 10.

If he doesn't want to negotiate set days, and then you suggest a reasonable schedule and he won't agree to that either, he can go to mediation and then court if necessary.

Oh just seen about mediation. Yes it's not suitable if he's abusive. He can go straight to court then, if he won't agree to set days.

Would he bother doing that, or would he just not take her on days he was working if you set a schedule (despite wanting the 10 nights)?

I think a real problem in these types of cases is that 'contact' is sort of sacred time.. The nrp has to be free, not at work etc otherwise its pointless, BUT the RP is the default parent who works and has the child and all the juggling and childcare costs that go with that. I do get irritated though by posters who hold up his job as this immovable thing. It is actually possible to look for other work that might allow a better schedule but why would the ex do that if the op provides childcare for him. It's not always possible, or easy, but it should be a question at least.. Could he, in theory, seek different work that would allow a regular pattern that suits all parties? WH should the op and her dd be the ones always chopping and changing?

@HugeAckmansWife He once had the opportunity to take up a similar role that was just nights Mon-Thurs and off every weekend but didn't take it up as the way his shifts are now allows for him to do as much over time as he likes.

This is why there is no pattern to his shifts because he is asking for overtime.

Just start living your life with DD and making plans and he can fit DD in around his life if he can be bothered.

I know you are intimated by him etc but the worst he can do is take it to court, which would leave you no worse off than you are now.

He won't compromise because he doesn't want to he wants what he has now - work when he wants, socialise when he wants, fit seeing in DD when he wants, pay as little CMS as possible.

You can't reason with him.

He's not a nice person, he doesn't put DD first so don't worry about her seeing him less just be there for her and empathise that he doesn't see her more etc. Age appropriate truth.

You know what your Ex isn't using his emotional energy stressing about this he just does what he wants.

Learn from him and start doing what you want. You need to detach emotionally from feeling guilt for his shit attitude towards DD. Her sadness now can be great lessons in resilience, listening to herself and believing herself. Knowing that your prioritise her and are reliable.

Yes it's sad for DD that he won't prioritise her best interests but it is unwise to think bending over backwards to accommodate what ever contact he can be bothered with is in her best interests it's not. See the weekends she has with him as a bonus, the weekdays are too as at least he can't Disney Dad.

Stick to the mantra it's 120 nights per YEAR not 10 nights per month for CMS, that DD has the right to have plans in her life and things to look forward too regardless of his shifts he can put her before his social life or working overtime - those choices are on him not you.

If you went to court they would most likely give him EOW and one weekday every week. I’d just do that personally to save this major hassle all of the time.

[quote pop88]@HugeAckmansWife He once had the opportunity to take up a similar role that was just nights Mon-Thurs and off every weekend but didn't take it up as the way his shifts are now allows for him to do as much over time as he likes. [/quote]
Work 4 nights every week, sleeping by day, and then try to reverse that at the weekends? He would be exhausted trying to interact with your DD and would have no normal life. Plus would earn less. Unreasonable to expect him to have done that.

Have an either/or schedule? So he either has her these weekends and these weekdays, or these ones. He's responsible for childcare if he's working, as you would be. You could agree every 8 weeks in advance which option is more convenient.

Work 4 nights every week, sleeping by day, and then try to reverse that at the weekends? He would be exhausted trying to interact with your DD and would have no normal life.

Parents do this all the time. My mum worked nights throughout my childhood.

I don't think there is anything wrong with him having the "pick" of when he has DD to coincide with when he is off work so that DD gets to benefiting from spending time with him. What he doesn't get to do is have you keep all DDs weekends free for him to choose from.

The reality is he has random shifts so it is being flexible letting him choose what works just not at the expense of you and DD making plans.

If DD isn't free he will be forced to use his other non-working days or cancel overtime or see her less those 8 weeks and see more at some other time. It still gives him choice and control - just control that doesn't interfere with your life.

I wouldn't initiate court as it makes you look inflexible and in reality who is going to do the childcare if it's his weekend but he's at work???

If he takes it to court because he isn't happy that DD isn't available when it suits him according to his shifts then what is he going to ask the court for and is it going to be deemed reasonable, mostly likely not - let him waste his money and time doing that.

I don't think courts do award fixed contact when the NRP works variable shifts, they expect the shifts to be accommodated to an extent, just not the extent the are currently.

Presumably he has a lot more than 20 nights (3 weeks) off in 8 weeks so even if DD is particularly unavailable he cannot argue that he doesn't have the opportunity for his contact time allocation.

Using a shared calendar for when DD isn't available means it is again indirect communication and in many cases he will 3+ months notification when DD isn't available so could offer to do overtime then, he can't pretend otherwise.

Agreeing with an earlier point.

I think you need to tell (not advise) which days of the week are suitable for a DD visit, and the suggestion of a given number of days per year seems a good one. Perhaps even for the rest of the year.

I get the impression sadly that whilst he wants to spend time with his DD, his approach is to get at you nothing else.

If he threatens to go back to court, the response should be something like 'thank you for letting me know, what date'.

@UhtredRagnarson

Work 4 nights every week, sleeping by day, and then try to reverse that at the weekends? He would be exhausted trying to interact with your DD and would have no normal life.

Parents do this all the time. My mum worked nights throughout my childhood.

I work nights too. But not 4 nights of every single week. Essentially you lose touch with normal daytime life. If your mum chose to do that when she had children that was up to her but most people wouldn’t choose it.

It was usually 3 nights but 4 occasionally. Which really isn’t abnormal. Like I said, many parents do this and raise their children.

@UhtredRagnarson

It was usually 3 nights but 4 occasionally. Which really isn’t abnormal. Like I said, many parents do this and raise their children.

3 nights isn’t 4. Even 3 must have been very difficult for your mum. Unlike you, I’ve actually done it for a while. It was awful and I couldn’t have raised DCs doing it long term, especially if I was trying to spend time with a DD I saw very little of anyway.

I would imagine it would actually be easier for OPs ex than it was for my mum as he isn’t actually living with his DD so he’s only doing a small portion of the parenting.