To think WFH permanently is a game changer?

[MiaMarshmallows]

For working parents as it saves on childcare costs as well as commuting etc?
DP been told he can wfh indefinitely and it's going to improve his lifestyle so much more. For everyone saying he will be outsourced, not a chance. He is very specialised in what he does and earns a very good wage for it.
One good thing to come out of all this at least.

For a couple of years pre-COVID I was expected to provide my own office base at home (public sector job, budget cuts meant less office space and only a communal 'hot desk', a ratio of one desk for every twenty employees). I worked at home between meetings in schools.

COVID has meant no meetings and all WFH.

It is so hard, the pace is frenetic, without time to think, eat, go to the toilet.
Access to shared diaries mean meetings are booked in and an invite sent without any consideration for even a five minute break, never mind lunchtime. One meeting ends, the next starts, the space between each just the click of the mouse.
It is isolating and exhausting. Utterly awful.

It’d be great for us if we had more space, but we live in a 2 bed flat and DH’s desk is next to our bed. Talk about a passion killer.

The other side of that coin is that the money we saved from him not commuting has been spent on childcare that enabled me to go back to college and retrain so I can start a totally new career. Wouldn’t have been able to do that if he weren’t WFH.

When you say saving on childcare do you mean the commute times to collect them and drop them off?

Part of wfh isn't having your kids there. You wouldn't have them at work in the office with you, so you shouldn't have them there in the day during working hours?

Would it kill people to read at least some posts on a thread before jumping in? It has been addressed MULTIPLE times now that it's the reduced commute leading to reduced wraparound that makes the saving. Two hours saved per child (my 50 minutes x2 commute) would save me £350 a month and my childcare is one of the cheapest in the country.

Incidentally £350 is my food bill, plus my £250 diesel bill would also reduce so I may even be able to manage a holiday!

Friend wants to get lodgers, and thinks pandemic is a game changer, she'll get so many more & better candidate lodgers because of WFH. I can't convince her "WFH locked in a small bedroom" actually sucks (!!)

As for non-covid WFH, the people I know who did this with an ordinary size laptop were App developer & statistician. I've never had a laptop that was good enough to WFH full time using my software or using my data in large spreadsheets that are supposed to be kept confidential. Must not risk sharing on public networks or being visible over my shoulder by randos. I imagine failing to see things clearly on someone's shared screen during telecon on a small (laptop) screen. I imagine my software licenses failing to load & work properly if wifi is sketchy. I imagine unable to chat away about what you're seeing or deciding (may be confidential)... er, no. Not in a public place. not a small screen in a smelly bedroom. Please no no no no.

I really wish people would stop suggesting that we can socialise and work in coffee shops if we miss the office. Many jobs, mine included, are confidential and cannot be done where you can be overheard. Meaning you remain isolated at home with no colleagues around to have a 2min steam blow off about stuff that we aren't really supposed to even talk to partners about

*mellicauli

If your work isn’t a social club, you’re doing it all wrong..

why, because I work?
We work with very challenging cases. However having a great team spirit and friendship group helps us through the tough times.
We are not working flT out every single second. The day ebbs and flows so we can have a brew ( and cake) and some banter. Then when needed, it's all hands to the deck and everyone has everyone's back.

and because I found that the change in dynamics within a team don't really do much in term of "friendship". It's not so "friendly" when suddenly someone gets promoted over the others and keeps going.
Theres never been an issue in the years I've been kn this team. I guess its down to a good manager. I also think it depends on the job you are doing. Ours is not in a competitive field.

Surprise surprise, workplaces are all different and can vary massively, from their social dynamics to their collaborative spirit. There’s clearly no one response to this...

I always WFH more than DH but he will likely continue whereas I won't.
He's quite close to retirement. I have a lot of interaction with the public which has tanked of course, and that needs to come back. But also we can't both WFH indefinitely as there isn't space really but also if one DC or both is at home after school it can be chaos. So I might get some peace and quiet in the office.

Yes DP will save on childcare as he won't need to use it at all during term time. As I said, his child is 10 and able to be in the house with him without needing extra supervision. He works just as well with her there.
In the holidays he will use an activity camp but term time he will not need to which is a huge saving.

@ImAllOut

Would it kill people to read at least some posts on a thread before jumping in? It has been addressed MULTIPLE times now that it's the reduced commute leading to reduced wraparound that makes the saving. Two hours saved per child (my 50 minutes x2 commute) would save me £350 a month and my childcare is one of the cheapest in the country.

You wouldn’t save a penny here as (as far as I know) all nurseries and wraparound care charges per session, not per hour.

Same here - I can pick DD up at 4 or 6. I don't commute far but I can't get there before I leave the office so even though the 4 pm pickup is earlier I can't use that cheaper option. DS we pay per session. Same for holiday clubs, though there is also one that has 4 pm or 5.30 options.

Maybe places are different but when my kids were young and we used any type of care it was a flat fee irrespective of time for both daycare and school care. Same cost whether we used it for 3 mins, 3 hrs or 8 hrs.

I don't like it. Well, maybe once or twice a week. Bring at home alone for a couple of days is very pleasant. Not so keen when both ds's here, with their live lessons. But any more than that I don't like. I miss the human interaction. I actually like going into the office once a week at least.

@HoppingPavlova

Maybe places are different but when my kids were young and we used any type of care it was a flat fee irrespective of time for both daycare and school care. Same cost whether we used it for 3 mins, 3 hrs or 8 hrs.

@WrongKindOfFace also - there are plenty of places where wraparound is by the hour, certainly is where we live. There are also people like me who pay an after-school nanny because with 2+ kids it can start to be a similar price, or because not all wraparound care has space or is appropriate for children with additional.needs.

WFH it's also easier to flex.hours so parents can cover childcare between them. For example, we have friends where the man has a 1.5 hour commute, but during lockdown he was starting at 7am and finishing at 3pm - he plans on continuing it a couple of days a week, as it means that he can pick up the DCs and have them after school while his wife does the morning and then can work without having to stress about collection.

Can't help thinking the fact that some MN'ers posting here would like to work from home and some wouldn't is indicative of the fact that many employers could make this work to a great extent as they would just reduce the on site workspace required to accommodate lower numbers based there.

Perhaps it could be treated like requests to work part time on return from Mat Leave or condensed hours requests. The employee making a formal request demonstrating that there would be no associated drop in efficiency. Maybe a trial period and a 2 year fixed term permission period with review of effectiveness before the permission is renewed or revoked. Pre-pandemic the cost of infrastructure to facilitate wfh would have been a barrier but so many employers have already invested that money now.

It could improve quality of life for a lot of people with no pay rise needed. Less crowded public transport at commuting times could make life more pleasant for others not working from home. Less traffic congestion from less vehicles on the road commuting. fewer cars competing for parking spaces, less pollution, improved quality of life for a lot of people so perhaps less stress related illness. Reduced spread of cold and flu viruses during winter months so less chance of people ending up needing treatment for potential follow on complications such as chest infections.

It's not good to think of this opportunity being trampled on by those insisting things return to the way they were pre-pandemic because of their own vested commercial interests.

My OH is WFH..it's not a great time.
We don't have office space. What I need to do in the day comes second to his job.
It's driving me mad. He is in my space as are his colleagues and projects.

Less crowded public transport at commuting times could make life more pleasant for others not working from home.

That's ideal but they will just cut services & increase prices.

I'm impressed at other apps kids being able to entertain themselves for 2 hours, and do homework. Until very recently my year 6 would be extremely unlikely to do any homework unless I was present and nagging

In September I loved wfh with proper childcare in place. I hate trying to do it with children and am missing some of the social stuff now so would like a bit of office time. I can’t imagine commuting every day but I’m too sedentary at the moment and just a bit flat.

I think my work are planning on a half and half approach when it happens. Halving office space and hot desking. I've appreciated being able to work from home and have an office but have also missed seeing actual people so it's perfect IMO. Not sure how it cuts down on childcare costs though 🤔

I work from home and have done for the last 4yrs and I do love it but my dd goes to the childminder as there's no way I can work when I have her..

@Dustyhedge

In September I loved wfh with proper childcare in place. I hate trying to do it with children and am missing some of the social stuff now so would like a bit of office time. I can’t imagine commuting every day but I’m too sedentary at the moment and just a bit flat.

We would need both DCs in full time wraparound childcare to prevent disturbance though - which is not fair on the DCs, and doesn't lead to a happy home life especially with DC1 who has SEN.

How to people save money on childcare whilst WFH?

As explained in the thread:

• primary aged kids may not need wraparound care at all if they can be picked up and can sort themselves out after school - many kids can. Most will also not need breakfast Club as parent will drop them off at school more easily as no commute.

Some school (mine included) provide a free after school activity which means school ends around 430pm and only if I need Care after that would I pay the flat fee required by the aftershock club.

• nursery aged kids - whilst many nurseries (most) have day fees in place, some will charge a small premium for early pick up/drop off say drop off before 8am or pick up after 5pm. That can be avoided whilst WFH.

• kids of all ages whilst using a nanny - a nanny is employer based on hours worked so it's pretty self evident that the ability for one parent to WFH will save money there. Of course it means having a big enough house to accommodate WFH whilst the nanny is around so it may not be for everybody but it can definitely happen.

In some cases WFH means time to do school/nursery packed lunches and therefore not paying for the meals on top.

Its pretty obvious how some parents can save quite a lot of money on childcare by WFH.

For the holidays it also allows to access a lot of the cheaper holiday clubs which do short ish days. We have a sports club nearby which is only 11quids a day per kid but starts after 9am I think and finishes around 4pm.
In some cases kids can be home during the day whilst on holiday with a parent working (usually older children, for me it works fine with my 6 and 9yrs old and worked well all of last year and part of the year before that but every kid is different).
Again depending on the age of the kid WFH means not having to take time off / as much time off if the kid is sick. If my 9yrs old is under the weather but nothing serious I can keep an eye on her and do my work whilst she rests/watches TV etc for the day.