To think there’s nothing wrong with cross breeds?

[sophialagiraffe]

There is nothing wrong whatsoever with cross breeds, whether that’s lurchers or cockerpoos. People are allowed to like what they like.

What DOES matter is where the dog comes from. But all this sneering about “mongrels” is fucking nasty and says more about the poster than the dog.

Most people don’t want a Crufts champion, they want a pet.

Absolutely nothing wrong with mongrels.

What is wrong is people choosing particular combinations to try to make money on because the names make a cutesy portmanteau, rather than thinking about the health of the dam and pups. Backyard Breeding is the issue. And people daft enough to pay thousands for a cutesy name when what they are getting is a mongrel.

Designer bags are not sentient. "Designer" dogs are. They're the ones paying the price so that muppets with more money than sense can brag about their cockerpoo.

Get a cokerspanial or a poodle from a reputable breeder with all the health checks required or better yet go to a rescue and get a none designer poodle cross. If you really want bragging rights give it a stupid name and pretend it cost thousands.

@sophialagiraffe

As I thought hopping, it’s just a way of keeping people in their place, right?

Do you have an issue with comprehension? Nothing in my post said that at all

In my experience it's who's breeding them that makes the difference, not weather the dog is a cross breed or not. Some crossbreed are absolutely lovely, and can live longer than pure breeds.

However my sisters cockapoo is neurotic and aggressive, which both her vet and her behaviourist think is hereditary. The people who bred the dog obviously had nothing in mind other than £££. But then again my sister had no issue with buying a pup that was born in an outhouse with no human interaction, and was only let out to see sunlight for an hour a day. The parents had no health tests etc. She paid £2500 for the pup, and has spent hundreds more on vets and behaviourists (to no avail.) My sister is in a group WhatsApp chat with the other pups owners from the litter. Out of the 5 puppies, 4 of them are really struggling with aggression.

There's nothing wrong with mutts, but there's plenty wrong with intentionally crossbreeding and then charging exorbitant sums of money for the pups just because the "breed" they've come up with has some whimsical name.

I object to the stupid made up names for crossbreeds and the associated, ludicrously inflated prices.

I don't think that mongrel is an insult either.

@ginghamstarfish many if not most pedigrees are bred for money. People deliberately breeding animals are generally doing it for money.

There’s no issue with health problems generally for popular cross breeds like cockapoos. Pedigrees are more likely to have health issues.

Also cross breeds are chosen because they are generally highly suitable as family pets. No reason they are somehow less worthy because they are cross breeds. What difference does it make and why should people pay less for them?

@sophialagiraffe spending on handbags is not the same. It’s not a living creature.
It’s not about the money.
@CayrolBaaaskin unfortunately pet breeders often don’t know what tests to do or just don’t bother. (True of both pedigree and non pedigree pet breeders.)

@nuniabeeswax great minds.

@sophialagiraffe

Some people spend £££ on handbags, or cars, or holidays.

People like what they like. Doesn’t make them ‘fucking stupid.’ Does it?

These are just objects. A handbag won't endure years of pain because it was badly constructed.

I'm with other PPs, mongrel, crossbreed or pedigree really doesn't matter. If you're paying £££ for a puppy with a cute name then a bit of effort and due diligence into its parentage really should be made.
There definitely needs to be a clamp-down made on breeding. Especially when an annual salary can be made from one litter of pups with little effort from the breeder.

I don’t think people sneer at mongrels, rather that they are often bought without any thought to health testing or temperament

Exactly this.

"So why endlessly sneer at them and call them ‘mongrels’?"

Because they ARE mongrels. A mongrel is a mongrel whether it's a Heinz 57 or cockerpoo/goldendoodle/pomsky/whatever. Just because the parents are KC registered (or so the breeder says) doesn't make your crossbreed dog any less of a crossbreed.

@MrsFluffyMuff that could happen with a pedigree breed too. It’s that your sister bought from a low welfare breeder that was the issue there.

People are just worried about welfare.

I no longer think this is really true. Mainly because the way people go about 'debating' the problems with cross breeds is in a manner least likely to actually effect any change at all.

If they cared about dog welfare, they would approach the subject differently because they would be more focussed on changing opnions than on ranting.

Proper debate, with the real pitfalls debated in a reasonable manner will have greater effect. Calling them 'mongrels' in a way intended to make someone think less about their dog will not.

(FWIW I happen to think mongrels are the very pinaccle of dog kind so it is no insult to me, but does seem to be used that way)

Cross breeds do come with extra challanges, because of their nature.

It's hard to find decent breeders who have chosen healthy parents, have higher welfare standards and understand the full spectrum of things they must provide to produce well rounded and healthy dogs. That means, as an owner, you are on the back foot already and should look to take even more care in researching and choosing your puppy.

Cross breeds tend to have a less stable genetic line than pedigrees - so you are taking a bigger gamble on the kind of dog you will end up with. You should be prepared for that and be clear on the very worst aspects of the contributing breeds - and be ready to handle that. If you have stricter/more narrow set of criteria for your dog then find an adult that already shows the right temperament or choose a puppy from a stable line - which, at the moment, tends to mean a pedigree.

F2 cross breeds can be less healthy than their parents - i.e. without proper genetic testing it is easy to breed faults back in again because the parents did not dispaly them. Bringing me to: there are much more health tests required to breed crosses than pedigrees so you need to find a breeder that understands that.

They are a puppy farms wet dream (the crosses chosen are often about litter size, not temperament) - and farmers are crafty as fuck. A first time/novice puppy buyer might do well to find someone more experienced whop can help them sort through the rubbish to find someone decent.

They are not more 'hypoallergenic' than a poodle. If that's a criteria then the more stable bet is for a full poodle (poodles are awesome dogs).

However, this horse has bolted. I really wish the KC would adopt the more common crosses so that they can be extended the (albeit limited) protection that provides and so that the liens can be stabalised to produce gerater consistency in temperament.

All that said, pedigree show breeders have - collectively and over generations - pretty much fucked a large number of breeds. So they do not get a free pass on this

As everyone else says, it’s not crossbreeds per se.

It’s the fact many people see something cute and fluffy, and don’t actually get any further than that.

No understanding of the genetics, that crossbreeds weaken the hypoallergenic coat qualities.
No idea that many are a PITA to groom and keep clean.
No idea that crosses are likely to be BYB or puppy farmed.
No idea that the health tests for parents aren’t just a trip to the vet and declared fit, that the need genetic testing for hereditary conditions.

There are plenty of breeds in existence to suit pretty much everyone. People get portmanteau breeds because they’re the snobby ones- they wouldn’t be seen dead with a poodle, because they have some stupid perception of pompoms. Or they want something “different” so they can be special.

I think it's the welfare as some do come from dodgy backgrounds rather than the actual dog.

We have a 'poo' that could be considered a designer dog breed and he's the actual best dog in the world, fact.

@CayrolBaaaskin Very true! But if the breeders had any decency about them, they would not have let an aggressive dog breed. And they would have had the appropriate health tests done to ensure the pups would be healthy. They couldn't give a shiny shit unfortunately. They just want their 13K.

@NuniaBeeswax I don’t think it’s accurate to call a cross breed a mongrel as they have two pedigree parents. They have been deliberately bred usually from pedigree parents who have been health tested. Not the same as a mongrel.

But it doesn’t really matter- nothing wrong with being a mongrel.

There's absolutely nothing inherently wrong with crossbreeds or mongrels either.

There's everything wrong with fashions in dogs, and dogs being created for a market for profit without due diligence on welfare - in the 'pedigree', in the conditions of the breeding bitches, in the checks on buyers by sellers and vv. There are some respectable breeders but too many puppy farms and dodgy (often illegal and inhumane) imports. Fashionable dogs are a commodity.

The rise in trendy crosses like cockerpoos etc is prone to the same problems as trendy 'pedigree' dogs - there are far too many of some popular types eg French bulldogs, pugs and miniature dachshunds for them to all have been bred and bought responsibly.

I think most people aren't sneery about mongrels. They're sneery about people buying a 'cockerpoo' and calling it a breed, when it isn't.

I never sneer at people who choose to buy cross breeds. But I do find it really distressing the amount of breeders who breed dogs for the sake of it, without health tests. I know of two lab retrievers who are less than a year old who both have bilateral elbow and hip dysplasia. Now both sets of litters have other puppies displaying similar symptoms of musculoskeletal conditions. Both dogs have had bilateral arthroscopy's and had bone fragment, fractures etc. Apparently the joints were just a mess. It is incredibly cruel and irresponsible. I personally wouldn't put a lab and retriever together anyway as both breeds are prone to these conditions, breeding them together isn't a good idea IMO. It should be done responsibly and because the breeds compliment each other, way too many people do it for the £££

@MrsFluffyMuff - totally agree but bad breeders can breed any animal. The reason so many breed cross breeds at the moment is because they are popular. If another breed was popular bad breeders would be breeding aggressive dogs of that breed.

"@NuniaBeeswax I don’t think it’s accurate to call a cross breed a mongrel as they have two pedigree parents. They have been deliberately bred usually from pedigree parents who have been health tested. Not the same as a mongrel.

But it doesn’t really matter- nothing wrong with being a mongrel."

A crossbred dog is a crossbred dog. The only difference is the price.

I agree OP - i would never have a pedigree dog - too much in-breeding for my liking. Im on my second rescue - heinz 57 and a romanian street dig - both wonderful characters and soft as putty.

A good breeder breeds only when there is reason to do so i.e to ensure the continaution of a champion line and not for money.

As deisgner dogs are not breeds and unable to be show dogs or sporting dogs there are no champion lines and therefore precisely zero good breeders. Every single 'poo breeder is in it for the money and only the money.

The person who sparked the trend regrets doing so because of all the health problems associated with "designer" breeds

www.independent.co.uk/life-style/labradoodle-wally-conron-regret-frankensteins-monster-hypoallergenic-a9120971.html