To think the way some birth mothers are treat is appalling

[SpringHasSprung20]

A decade ago when I was still in my teens I had a baby removed from me at birth by social services and put up for adoption against my will.

It wasn't me who was the risk, I was being abused by the father and fought so hard to get away, have him prosecuted and keep my baby. I've posted about my story before.

Fast forward to now I'm approaching 30. I have a family and I'm living on the other side of the country with two subsequent children in my care full time with no SS involvement. I have a good life and haven't spoken to the abusive ex since I left him. I'm a different person. A strong person.

SS never allowed to meet the adoptive parents because I was opposing the adoption.

Do you know what contact I have with my son? One letter per year, due every April but it's usually always months late.

All of my letters are inspected by an adoption social work team before they'll be passed on to the adoptive parents/my son. Protocol. Most years they are sent back to me to edit out parts where I've told him I love him or miss him. I'm not allowed to say that, it's too emotional apparently.

I'm not daft, I know it's not in his best interests for me to be emotional in letters so I never am - but I do want him to know he's loved.

They are pedantic beyond comprehension. One year I had a letter telling me he was doing well in school, in my reply I said I was proud and he's such a clever boy. They sent my letter back and made me change "you are so clever" to "you sound clever"

I've had to plead with the adoption team for years to ask the family if I can have a photo, after 8 years of the adoption team saying "we don't let birth parents have photos" a kind contact coordinator finally agreed to ask the family for me.

The family took a while to decide but agreed I could see a photo. I can't keep it though.

I have to liase with an adoption team in my area and ask that the photo be sent to them so I can go into the office and look at it on a computer screen. Once. That won't happen this year because of covid so I have another year to wait before I can even catch a glimpse of my little boy. I have no idea what he looks like other than the sweet 6 month old face I have in a photo album, taken at our "goodbye contact"

I'm not allowed to send birthday cards or presents because it's a pain for the adoption agency to facilitate.

I have a box here that I save his cards in every year but that's not the point really is it? Imagine being a child and never getting a birthday card from your mum.

I'm not allowed to tell him about his siblings in letters. I talk to them about him all of the time but they must be kept secret.

All of the above is wrapped up as being in his best interests of course, but is it really?

I don't think he'll feel that way later on.

If you were adopted wouldn't you want to know that your 'birth' mother loved you? Would you be happy to only hear from her once a year?

I'm not a criminal and I've never hurt a child or been accused of it. I'm a good person and a good mother. I have the backing of SS here completely, after I approached them when I moved here. The senior manager raised her own concerns about how I was treat by that local authority and couldn't believe the way they work.

AIBU to think the way some birth mothers are treat is appalling? I'm not referring to abusive people or people who neglect their children, but people like me and others who were let down terribly.

I cannot move past the injustice of it all.

I’m think OP, for your own well being you need to emotionally distance yourself from this child. You say you can’t change the situation and you know he is being loved and cared for. You need to prioritise yourself and your other children now. I think you need to find away of forgetting about him. That might involve stopping all contact. The status quo as you put it is torturing you and this is no way to live. You should be really proud of yourself for what you have achieved from a bad start.

@Skatastic

I think bio parent's rights should extend to a child being returned to their parent at a later date.

Oh my days how absolutely horrendous. So a child can be taken away from their family and their life and their friends? This is frightening. And rubbishes adoption and the reason that adoption exists which is to keep children safe.

The irony But it’s ok for a child to be taken from their biological family

@Skatastic

Everyone speaking up saying "oh my neighbour was adopted and his experience is...." are making me want to scream. Unless you are an adoptee or an adopted person you can't speak of their experiences, and even when you do it is a personal choice.

I think my birth mum is amazing to have had me at 15 and made the choice that I would be better being raised by someone else. I think my Mum and Dad were incredible and the story of the day they were told I was theirs makes me cry big fat tears every time I think about it. Adoption is complex and full of emotion and nuanced.

Completely agree. I think my previous posts on this may have been deleted - but I cannot think of any other “group” where this would be ok.

I can believe that a child has been removed and not returned because of domestic violence. It happens every week, the vast majority of child protection cases feature domestic violence. It is not unusual for a woman to have more than one child removed because of domestic violence, and not uncommon for it to be a different violent father or boyfriend each child. These cycles do repeat themselves for some people and it would take intensive therapy to overcome that. Some women are unwilling or unable to engage with therapy or leave their partner, even when support to do so is offered. I have known of women lying to SS that they are separated then visiting men who are in prison for injuring them and returning to them on their release. Or do the Freedom Programme twice and still think the bloke who hospitalised them is just misunderstood. They have been told they risk losing their children but they aren't ready or able or willing to separate for many complex reasons. That's not victim shaming it is fact. It happens and SS can't take chances there.

Thankfully OP has broken the cycle and what she is flagging, among other aspects, is the lack of support for women who do want to leave and would accept support.

Pre-removal, child protection plans will recommend parents work with services - Freedom Programme, Anger Management, help with depression - but these are variable quality and success isn't guaranteed. They might try to help with a housing move or go to a refuge, help with applying for benefits, non molestation order and new school places. But the reality is that what's on offer is very limited and patchy. There is not enough support available, the sector is underfunded and reliant on charities.

By the time a child has actually been removed, options are limited further. There are not enough mother and baby placements. A psychological assessment might recommend attending a specific course or embarking on specific therapy. For example, 6 months of CBT, when the court proceedings aren't meant to run beyond 6 months. By the time the pychological assessment is done you might be 2 months into proceedings, then the wait until therapy becomes available... Which, as it's nhs could be months.
So no, parents often can not make or evidence change in the 6 month court timetable. Even a woman who goes into a mother and baby placement faces the difficulty of having nowhere to house their child when they leave, but if the placement assessment is positive the court will be minded to allow extra time for housing to be sorted.

OP has acknowledged that it wouldn't have been safe for her baby to be with her as things stood. Exposure to domestic violence harms children and affects parents' ability to parent properly.
And OP is right that there is not enough support available to victims of domestic violence. There is also not enough that can be done with perpetrators to stop their repeat offending, nor are there enough services to help children who grew up in homes with domestic violence. CAMHS support is often hard to get and, again, variable quality.

Domestic violence is a massive and complex problem and the number of women losing their children because of domestic violence is a huge concern.

[quote itdepends]@Bainne I am not really sure what points you are trying to make - if you are saying that most adoptees don't seek out birth parents, then you cannot, it is impossible to say as there is no objective information available one way or the other.

I was adopted and had contact with birth parents through most of childhood and it has stood me in good stead. Poor mental health is common in adoptees apparently, and I think I have good mental health because of the contact. But I can see other adoptees here with opposing views.

But in relation to what I am saying and in relation to what you are saying about your friends, these are just personal experiences. If you want to understand it better it is worth looking at the bonafide research and enquiries into adoption. My impression is that it is a huge issue with more work to be done in relation to it.[/quote]
Not saying that at all, and I am perfectly well able to distinguish between personal anecdotes and research statistics -- absolutely, adoption and all surrounding issues deserve much more research.

What I am saying is that many posters are (imo irresponsibly) encouraging the OP, in her heartbreak, to count on her son contacting her at eighteen, and for it to be the right thing to do for her to then hand over years of uncensored letters which express her anger and pain, and the documents which 'prove' he was wrongly removed, that he will accept this and be comforted by knowing he was loved by his birth mother.

What I think the OP needs to come to terms with is that her son may not seek her out at eighteen (or at thirty-five, for that matter), even if his adoptive parents are fully supportive of him seeking contact, and that, if he does, he may not feel able to cope with the understandably huge emotions his birth mother still feels about the circumstances of his adoption.

The OP sounds like a strong and together human being, who has reclaimed her life, and is successfully parenting two younger children, so if her son finds her, he won't find himself in the situation that two people I know did, where they found themselves dealing with birth family who were still, twenty something years after their removals as babies, in the throes of addiction, and a chaotic, semi-criminal lifestyle.

But there's still the issue of a potentially asymmetric set of expectations. I think it's irresponsible of posters who, with the best of intentions, are stoking the OP's grief and anger, and her expectation that her son will seek her out when he's able, and his understanding will go some way towards helping her to recover. It's a lot of pressure to put on someone else.

‘Anti SS’

Most here saying ‘actually SS make mistakes’ aren’t ‘anti’ anything save for being ‘anti’ people sticking their fingers in their ears and singing loudly to ignore the OBVIOUS: people, including social workers, are falliable.

And I’m afraid I don’t shut up any longer and listen to the clap trap they they are perfect, do not make mistakes, and in occasions even tamper with evidence or outright lie.

There are finding of such things in family courts, there are funding of such things in complaints to the LGO, there are findings of such things published on BAILII. And sometimes those that make appalling errors or worse actually engineer a situation simply get away with it.

@WasThereAplan are you adopted? I am. Yes it is absolutely right for a child to be taken from their biological family in the right circumstances. Mine were right and I am so grateful.

Thank you @2021namechanger this thread is making me feel so angry. Oh I've seen Long Lost Family so do let me chip in my 5 pence. What the fuck.

you’ll see there are many, many posts explaining that social services have neither the inclination nor power to snatch a baby away without reason. I think in recent pages a few vocal posters

How about the ones from me, I work in the system, I have explained that I have witnessed this happening and explained the reasons why it did? Or does that not count because it doesn't fit the narrative? Bizarre.

[quote Skatastic]@WasThereAplan are you adopted? I am. Yes it is absolutely right for a child to be taken from their biological family in the right circumstances. Mine were right and I am so grateful.[/quote]
No I’m not
Yes you’re absolutely right. ‘In the right circumstances’ though that is the important bit and for a huge majority it will be the right circumstances but mistakes shouldn’t happen

@AlmightyBob you may not have accused her of troll hunting explicitly but you said

HeyDemonsItsYaGirl if you don't think the OP is a troll, then surely you must accept that her account of the facts of her case is a valid one - that doesn't mean it is factually 100% accurate (it may be, it may not), but that it is an honest account of what happened to her from her perspective.

That is not correct. There are not two options: either someone is a troll or they are being completely honest. As I think most people recognise on most threads.

@Skatastic

The vast majority of adoptees on here appear to want to crush any hopes of me ever seeing him again?

You didn't want to know your birth mother because she's just an incubator? Good for you lot.

What a hideous thing to say! I dont want to know mine at the moment because my feelings around it are so complex. You are coming across as so selfish, you need to put your child's needs first.

Someone actually did call a birth mother ‘just an incubator’

Imagine being a child and never getting a birthday card from your mum

I'm sorry, but he has a mum. She is the one who gives him birthday cards.

@Hepsie

you’ll see there are many, many posts explaining that social services have neither the inclination nor power to snatch a baby away without reason. I think in recent pages a few vocal posters

How about the ones from me, I work in the system, I have explained that I have witnessed this happening and explained the reasons why it did? Or does that not count because it doesn't fit the narrative? Bizarre.

I hear you and yes sadly I think your posts will be ignored disregarded or presented as untrue because it’s not what people want to hear or believe 😞

@LaLaLandIsNoFun yes but to direct the comment at adoptees wasn't on.

@Skatastic @2021namechanger
I am sorry that your first-hand experiences as adoptees are being ignored, denigrated and shouted over on this thread.

I have found your posts really moving and informative (and kind).

Although not adopted, I am a member of a different minority group and I am VERY used to the experience of having my personal first-hand lifelong experience dismissed by someone who watched something on Netflix or read a newspaper article about it.

@SheCannaeTakeNoMoreCapt

I think your comment is cruel. That’s just going to hurt the OP

@Skatastic I’ve said it upthread - but for an actual parenting site - there really doesn’t seem to be much child focus in many of these posts.

Nor anyone actually listening to those who are actually adopted. Some of it I find borderline offensive to be honest.

@Hepsie

you’ll see there are many, many posts explaining that social services have neither the inclination nor power to snatch a baby away without reason. I think in recent pages a few vocal posters

How about the ones from me, I work in the system, I have explained that I have witnessed this happening and explained the reasons why it did? Or does that not count because it doesn't fit the narrative? Bizarre.

And me.

The finding against my the LA that acted to appallingly were pretty damning. I’ve said several times. Zero acknowledgment.

People just don’t want to believe that bad things can happen, that SWs aren’t all perfect, ethical and honest. It’s not ok to say it. We’re ‘damaging’ the system to say it.
I’ve even posted a damning judgment on BAILII where finding were made that SWs had fabricated and tampered with evidence...

Tell that to abused women internationally, except you wouldn't need to would you, because forced adoption doesn't happen anywhere else.....If ongoing contact with birth parents is so damaging then why do other countries advocate and facilitate open adoptions....The UK is the only country worldwide that operates this way and it's scary how many people here condone it

OP I think you've been sold a pack of lies by some group or other...none of this is true in the slightest. Obviously it firs your narrative and helps you maintain the fiction that your baby was stolen for no reason, but deep down you know that's not true.

@Hepsie

you’ll see there are many, many posts explaining that social services have neither the inclination nor power to snatch a baby away without reason. I think in recent pages a few vocal posters

How about the ones from me, I work in the system, I have explained that I have witnessed this happening and explained the reasons why it did? Or does that not count because it doesn't fit the narrative? Bizarre.

No one on this thread can judge the merits of the OPs case. She may have one, there may be more to the story, or there may not be. We'll never know.

It may well be the case that for her to gain closure she needs to work through some serious discussions with SS/the LA that was involved in her child's placement. That's her right and her business. This is different from focusing on a relationship with the child as the vehicle for her healing. That won't work for a whole host of reasons and it's that bit that people are telling her she won't get very far with legally. To ensure the best outcome when he's of age if she wants contact, she'd be well advised to find a way to manage it that doesn't include bringing her grief to him.

I'll tell another very self-identifying story here. My birth father claimed that he wasn't told my birth mother was pregnant. I am not sure I believe this but even at the great distance from my adoption, I think he may want to have it out with her. Decades later, nothing would change, etc. All it would do is cause a lot of hurt all around, with no change in the status quo - from my perspective. I'd prefer very strongly he didn't do that, but if he does, that is his choice. He may need to, in order to process what has happened. The trouble is - she may have questions for him too that he won't want to answer. It's a two way street.

The OP has a lot of choices for how to move forward. It would be good if someone could actually suggest some real resources that might help. Unfortunately I am not that informed.

@bainne I am not sure why you are making these points to me, they are your point of view, which is fine, but they aren't relevant to any of my posts. You think some posts are irresponsible - possibly quote these posts and comment directly underneath?

@hepsis I agree with your posts.

I think your comment is cruel. That’s just going to hurt the OP

How is it cruel? It's a fact. She already knows it, I'm not telling her anything new.

@SomersetHamlyn I probably didn't express myself well. What I meant was, if people accept that the OP isn't trolling, then the alternative is (as I tried to explain) that her version of events is true to her, at least. That doesn't mean everyone involved at the time would agree, obviously. That being that case, to continually attack her in this way is straight up cruelty.

I just can't believe the way that people are speaking to, and about, someone in obvious pain. This thread is shameful. It's not about being 'anti SS', or dismissing other people's experiences like Skatastic's - it's just showing the minimum of decency and care to someone who is clearly struggling.