How do women square holidaying in Dubai with the lived reality of UAE women?

[Bouncealot]

Never understood a friend raving about the luxury, lack of crime, cleanliness, attentiveness of hotel and retail staff, when I had watched documentaries on slave labour, especially Philippine and Pakistani people denied passports, sleeping on kitchen floors and UAEs refusal to give stats on FGM to WHO. Just listened to Woman’s Hour discussion on the Princess Latifa case. It seems not a subject for discussion when people are planning ‘sunshine breaks’.
IABU judge other women’s holiday choices and experiences?

@JamesMiddletonsMarshmallows

1. Ignorance is bliss

1. Why is it down to women when men are doing the oppressing of UAR women? Surely your question should be how do MEN square it when they're part of the class the oppresses those women.

PSA: It is not up to women to undo the damage of men

The laws work to the advantage of men. Why would they want to change it? It's often those exploited who seek change, not the exploiters.

My partner has worked in Dubai and Saudi (which is now pushing its tourism offerings!) and has said that he wouldn't holiday in either.
He's seen the way workers are treated. It's basically slavery, but as the slaves aren't black, no-one seems to give a shit about it.
Perhaps if more people realised the truth, they wouldn't go. And it's not cheap either!

Western men take advantage of it. You think that we are so progressive but we're not. The only thing protecting us from the same scenario is the law. I was living in Asia and western men were exploiting women in poverty.

I have seen this time and time again too. 'Western women want too much... they've lost the ability to be a woman'

so if you only want to holiday in countries with good governments that respect human rights [...] that’s .... kind of sad

What?

I don’t hold many strong opinions in the world but this is one I have very strong feelings about! The west women are treated is awful

@saffire but your husband was happy to take their money.

That might be fine Pineapplepower, if it weren't for the fact that holiday tourists go out there and actively join in the exploitation of other humans. Lapping up their 'luxuries' and turning a blind eye to how they are being provided

I had this exact same conversation with DH and the adult DSs recently. I was shocked that they were shocked when I said I wouldn't go there!

The Chinese state is currently committing genocide.

Genocide of Muslims is always less important here. They're happy to continue to use Chinese goods but moan about Dubai.

Dubai is basically a business opportunity. It is pure business for all apart from the local women.

You only go there to spend money and have a materialistic time. It's a safe haven for money and home of many in exile even including some international former leaders (Thai) and royalty (Spanish?). It operates with tax efficiencies and attracts certain crowds as a safe place to spend and enjoy loot as many drive luxury vehicles as everyday drivers etc. There is corresponding high end sex tourism crowd with girls imported too. It's basically a place where men can indulge and international women can make easy money. It is a service centre in many literal understandings. Everything and all services are available discretely at the right price. This is very peculiar in an otherwise strict religious state!

You may think of it as Las Vegas without gambling but all the man made glitz and glamor open to all except original locals especially the women and girls who follow a traditional strict religious lifestyle. What happens in Dubai stays in Dubai! And that is despite it being the current go to insta hot spot. However I think the party is temporary closed due to Covid super spreading and hence strict travel limitations finally imposed.

I don’t. I wouldn’t go there (for any purpose) for that very reason.

Our culture is better than a society which permits slavery. Really. Modern slavery is a crime in the UK. So too is trafficking, as are cannabis farms. The criminal gangs that create these problems are not tacitly endorsed by the state or the government, and they are prosecuted. Britain is not perfect but do not compare it to somewhere where organisationally it is permitted.

What was said on Women's hour about Princess Latifa? I watched the Panorama documentary last night and I found it terrifying that this could happen and the world does nothing. It's particularly appalling that the Indian government cooperated in her kidnap.
What's interesting about Dubai is when westerners use the backward local laws to their own advantage. A woman, originally from our area, had her sons removed from her by her English husband who was taking advantage of the laws their regarding custody. As they'd split up, she had to leave Dubai and she was distraught because she couldn't take the dcs. I can't remember if it was resolved.

It's basically slavery, but as the slaves aren't black, no-one seems to give a shit about it.

Do you think if the slaves were black people would start giving a shit @saffire?

I have an ex friend who does exactly as she pleases with no thought for anybody else. She holidays, parties, eats out ,throughout the pandemic.
She showed me pictures of herself with drugged wild animals in Thailand ( vile). She told me about observing poor immigrant women being herded into a shed to be raped in the ME.
What@AnyFucker said.

@AllDoneIn

I will never holiday there for the reasons you raised. I've talked to a few Dubai fans in the past and to be blunt they're generally in the bling / hard of thinking camp.

I was going to say something similar and risk the condemnation. I do think it attracts a certain type of person and I would hate it apart from all the issues described. I know I sound like a snob, sorry.

Missing the point entirely but I've never got what the attraction is anyway - there are shops and restaurants and theme parks, right? But it's ridiculously hot, there's a dress code and no booze. I don't get why it's better than a nice resort in Spain. And it's such a long way to go. Never felt the slightest temptation to go there.

But YANBU OP!

@Tekoa

I don't go to Dubai, but there is always a whiff of Islamophobia about these threads.

Report it then. This is about a country's practice of trampling on women's rights to the point where they don't really have any. The race of people living there doesn't come into it and I can't see it anywhere on this thread.

I'm more irked by the posters using whatabouttery and deflection to explain why they need to be there. There's no excuse good enough but, this country (at least) is one where you're free to make your plans as you see fit (covid restrictions apply).

What on earth is a 'whiff' anyway? It either is or it isn't, surely?

I have an extremely love hate relationship with my home country India. Sometimes, after yet another horrible rape, it deteriorates into a hate hate relationship and I have been known to tell foreign women not to visit. Though their money goes to people who really need it. I am often torn.

I watched panorama last night and have to admit that, although I watch and listen to the news, I had not really connected the story about the middle eastern princess who was kidnapped by her family with Dubai. I dont know why - perhaps there were other news stories that were taking my interest. So maybe some of the people going just have not put things together. I wasnt particularly interested in going there before and now I definitely would not. Same with Saudi Arabia which has really upped its advertising lately.

@Tekoa

The Chinese state is currently committing genocide.

Genocide of Muslims is always less important here. They're happy to continue to use Chinese goods but moan about Dubai.

We're perfectly happy to use cheap goods from China where they have no labour laws and use children. We're hardly going to worry about the genocide of an ethnic minority. We can talk as much as we want about being somehow better because we have better laws, yet our economy is based upon the exploitation of those who don't have the same laws. We are exploiting by proxy.

I think we need to have a good long look at ourselves before pointing the finger. To be completely honest, our culture is not a great deal better. Particularly as far as the treatment of non-white/non- British women and children go.

If we all took this approach South Africa would likely still have apartheid.

@Tekoa

The Chinese state is currently committing genocide.

Genocide of Muslims is always less important here. They're happy to continue to use Chinese goods but moan about Dubai.

No, many of us are NOT happy to be using goods from China. I would ideally like to have nothing to do with them but we have a 'government' with an entirely different perspective who is fully aligned with allowing the import of Chinese products whilst not allowing consumers real choice, ie. you can have this product, or that one (both from China).

Drifting off the point a bit but it was the same with the recent news report about meat not being allowed to be labelled with country of origin any longer so as to take away people's choice not to eat meat imported from the USA.

I don't disagree with you on your point but, where do we start? We're hamstrung with a terrible government and the 'waiting in the wings' people don't seem to do any better, they're terrible in power too, just a different shitty flavour.

The laws work to the advantage of men. Why would they want to change it?well they won't but why is it up to Western women to sort the problem?

@Frequentflier

I have an extremely love hate relationship with my home country India. Sometimes, after yet another horrible rape, it deteriorates into a hate hate relationship and I have been known to tell foreign women not to visit. Though their money goes to people who really need it. I am often torn.

I can't imagine how mind-bendingly awful that must be; what are you to do? :(