AIBU to ask why marriage is so easily dismissed as an option?

[HeidiHaughton]

Why do people not want to get married when to all intents and purposes they're behaving like they are?
I can't help but wonder if some of my mother's seemingly old fashioned pieces of advice about marriage have in the long run turned out to be correct, even if I thought she was behind the times when she dished it out.

Money and assets as pre nups aren’t legal in the UK. Wanting the option to be able to walk away at any point.

This. I own my own home and there's not a chance I'm risking it if the relationship goes tits up, which from experience is very likely.

My friend was advised be her solicitor not to marry her boyfriend. The solicitor spoke sense!

@Invisablewoman

Because I don't want to be a 'wife'. Because I don't like being forced to make public declarations about my private feelings. Because divorce is very common.

Civil partnership much more my thing.

What's the difference?

If you had a heterosexual civil partnership people would refer to you as husband and wife (remember when it was all gay people could do? - they still used those words).

The public declaration you are forced to make is simply that you are prepared to undertake this contract and there are no legal obstacles to doing so. Still have to do that for a civil partnership.

If your partnership breaks down calling it a dissolution rather than a divorce doesn't stop it happening.

I think it depends on life stages. I met DH at university, so neither of us brought pre-existing assets into the relationship. We married before having DC because it made alot of things easier, and provided greater security. If I found myself single now (late 30s), I'd be less likely to marry because it would create a potential power imbalance and risk my DC's financial future (inheriting my money / property)

Exactly as BingPot99 I'm single now with dc and have built up assets - my and my dc's future financial security. I couldn't risk them being frittered away by a new spouse. Especially as xh is never going to provide the dc with anything.

It's a shame as I'm quite traditionally romantic by nature... I'd probably try to have a lovely celebration but without the legal side.

Is marriage that unusual, really? Almost all my friends who are in LTRs are married by now. I can only think of three who aren't: one couple because of their political views (would be pretty shocked if they ever changed their minds), one couple where my friend used to talk a lot about it being "just a piece of paper" and how they'd "proved their commitment to each other by now anyway" but I always suspected she did secretly want to be married (they're now engaged), and one where my friend has said to me in private that she'd quite like to be married but would prefer her partner to propose to her (not because she wants a SM-style great big proposal but because she would want to feel totally sure that it's what he wants too). Out of those, only the first couple have DC.

Finanially marriage would change very little for us but both of us want it to make sure we are each others next of kin. As it stands DP's is his 98 year old grandmother and mine is my mum who I love, but seems to think she knows better than any doctor.

I've been married and subsequently divorced. I love DP very much , if I'm honest more than I ever did exdh, but I've been burned. Marriage was important to me , I believed in my vows and the future I thought we would face together.

Then it went to hell in a hand basket. I will never regret my marriage because it gave me my two DC but I don't honestly know if I could walk down the aisle with that level of certainty anymore. Knowing that even when you are totally sure it can go wrong.

I may change my mind. We certainly live as if we were married , everywhere we work always expresses surprise that we aren't. So I assume that means we behave as if we are.

For me that vow means something. I would only ever make it again if I was absolutely sure. I would only ever make it again to DP because I know he is the love of my life, but it isn't as easy as you make out if you actually take marriage vows seriously.

Iv often wondered if I would have got married if we hadnt been forced into it - moving abroad and needed to be married to stay together, nothing sinister. Dh always wanted to be married and was asking after 6 months of dating

it isn't as easy as you make out if you actually take marriage vows seriously

Absolutely. I don't know if I could do it again - I'd be sure of my own commitment, but I now have the knowledge that the other person can just change their mind and leave at any time. (as happened to me and several of the other weddings I've attended) Feels like a farce to be honest.

But if it was a public declaration of people's current feelings, that could be a lovely thing.

@Lockandtees

Nobody is prying into anybody else’s business *@TeaPiglet*. It’s a perfectly legitimate topic of conversation on a platform that is composed mostly of women. Women tend to be the lower earned and tend to stop working to have children. By having children women lose out on career progression, a salary, pension contributions and a huge amount of freedom. To do this without getting married first is utter madness and unless these conversations are had the situation won’t improve. There are endless threads on mumsnet from women who have been screwed over by having kids without getting married first. They end up completely financially dependent and trapped.

Exactly this. ^

You'd have to have rocks in your head to have children with a man, if you're not married to him. You have NO rights whatsoever, and you can bet he will keep HIS money mostly to himself.

And, as most people have said, it's almost ALWAYS the woman in the relationship who sacrifices her career, and her income... And subsequently, it's the woman who will suffer if/when they split, or he dies...

The 'it's only a piece of paper' brigade are so clueless and obtuse. It's very much NOT only a piece of paper. It's an important legal document that gives you a lot of rights, and a lot of protection.

Any man that wanted me to have children with him, but refused to get married to me, could fuck right off.

I said this on another thread the other day. Watch FINDING ALICE on itv hub. That highlights what a shitstorm is left behind when the man you've shared your life with (and had children with.) dies, and you're not married to him.....

You have no more legal rights than the neighbour's dog.

I think for people in relationships where they have DC from a previous relationship it is an entirely different proposition. If I got divorced now I would not want to marry again. I'm not having any more DC.

It was very important to me to marry before having DC.

If you want to get married, but can't afford a big wedding and are worried about offending family, just don't tell them.

Don’t need a public declaration of commitment - we decided to have children together. To me, that is a lifelong commitment.

Plus, I own our house, I’m the primary wage earner, I’ve got my own pension. Marriage brings absolutely nothing to my life.
But I don’t give two figs about anyone else’s choice. If you want to get married, crack one!

Crack on, not crack one!

If DH dies at work, I'll get a widow (or widowers, if I was male) pension from his employers. If we weren't married, all there would be is the lump sum payment. Marriage makes a lot of sense for us, although I dearly hope he doesn't die at work.

If something was to happen to him, I wouldn't remarry though, at least not until our children were adults.

I made the decision I would be married before getting a house or having children with someone. I wanted that as if someone isn't willing to make a legal commitment to me I didn't want to connect myself to them forever through children.

I've been with my husband coming up on 21 years, married 15 and we have a 6yo daughter. Financially I make 3 times what he does and have more career prospects so envisage that gap widening even more over the next 10 years.

Thankfully there is no reason to think our marriage won't last as we're very happy together, but if it did it would be me paying maintenance not him.

I honestly think because a lot more women have their own wealth/capital/assets now more than ever before. They also have options which many generations before us didn't. One of my friends owns 2 properties, has an excellent career and personal savings not to be sniffed at. In her position you couldn't drag me down the aisle!!!

Don’t need a public declaration of commitment - we decided to have children together. To me, that is a lifelong commitment.

To the children, not to each other. People split up even when they have children.

Marriage isn't an option for me as I'm buying a house this year.

I grew up in unsecure housing, no way will I risk my home for a relationship.

I think a lot of people don't know about the legalities of marriage

I do know the legalities of marriage now I am married. For me I would be better off just living together.

1. Because people in general and women in particular aren't properly educated about what marriage (as opposed to weddings) mean. Marriage is a legal contract designed to protect the financially weakest partner in a relationship. The emphasis has shifted on this: 50 years ago the pressure to get married was based on morality and people did so to avoid social stigma. Attitudes have evolved and people aren't taught any more why it matters. It's about money, pure and simple.

1. Because a lot of blokes know which side their bread is buttered on and realise they will lose out financially by getting married. They therefore string their partners along for years telling them they want to get married when the time is right/when they've saved enough money/when they've chosen a ring, and avoid having to actually step up on it. And women, who have been socialised to believe that having a man is the most important thing in life, settle for this without really interrogating it.

I wasn't fussed about getting married, but he wanted kids, and I was happy to have them, but not without the legal rights that being married would give us.

I wouldn't get married again, there would be nothing driving it now. But it was definitely the right thing to do at the lifestage I was at then.

In part because so many people don't understand what it is. We've already had the posters saying "don't need it to prove our commitment". It's not about proving anything, it's about MAKING a financial commitment. It's definitely not the right choice for all people, I can think of several circumstances in which it would be unwise, but many people who should consider it don't because they still have this idea that it's about "proving love" or it's "just a piece of paper".

Had one infuriating, and really worrying, poster ages ago who had originally wanted to be married but had agreed not to because her partner didn't wish it. Needless to say, she was to give up work when their firstborn arrived and the house was in his name, but he had allowed her to wear a ring and use his surname and as she said, "we don't need a piece of paper to prove our love". There was even a serene little at the end. She thought we were all losing our rags because we were so jealous of her undying love...

A lot of people i know who don't want to get married, actually just don't want the fuss and expense of a wedding. Marriage is about a lot more, and i especially can't get my head around those who will plan to have children together, but won't book an appointment at a registry office.

I was amazed when getting married that although it's a legal contract with huge ramifications, you never see an actual contract - you don't get told what the implications are.

I mean obviously there are other ways of finding out, esp with the internet now.

But normally the UK loves a good leaflet. I got more information when I gave blood!