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AIBU?

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Original poster

Is this offensive?

178 replies

cherryolives · 13/02/2021 13:21

For a white person who is British but born in Kashmir to describe themselves as Kashmiri?

OP posts:
C0RAL · 13/02/2021 15:20

@passtheorange

What possible difference does it make what colour you are? Your birthplace is your birthplace.
This.

I was born in England and I live there so I say I am English. I’m not claiming to have any particular ethnicity or saying that I have taken part in every possible type of English culture, mixed with every other ethnicity that lives here and that I speak every Language that’s used here.

There’s more than one way to be English / Russian /Kashmiri.

Some people on this thread are trying to police other people’s identity and decide who is the correct colour.

SilverBirchWithout · 13/02/2021 15:21

I suppose it’s not dissimilar to a child born in an embassy overseas or in an occupied country.

So a child born during the war to German parents living in France, and then moving back to Germany whilst still a baby - would still be German.
Or a child born in the British Embassy compound in Nigeria and moving back to the UK would still be British.

randomer · 13/02/2021 15:27

Only if the person orders an Indian takeaway.

SilverBirchWithout · 13/02/2021 15:29

@randomer

Only if the person orders an Indian takeaway.
Yes some interesting posts this week...
Leakyradiator · 13/02/2021 15:31

No. They were born there. Usually a person would identify with the nationality of the country they were born in I would imagine. Or am I missing something here? I don’t think it’s offensive. How is it offensive?

Blindstupid · 13/02/2021 15:32

OP why didn’t you just say from the off that this was about JL, instead of being all cloak and dagger about it? Confused Hmm

LunaHeather · 13/02/2021 15:32

Your friend sounds like he'd argue with me for saying I'm British when I'm not white. That gives me the rage.

I think it's complicated if you spent your life in different places. Born and raised is different than born and then moved a lot.

m0therofdragons · 13/02/2021 15:36

Place of birth is where you’re from otherwise many British black people (born here) would call themselves African which is seen as offensive as they were born here.

Justcallmebebes · 13/02/2021 15:36

I am white British but born in Hong Kong. I've never described myself as Chinese but consider Hong Kong home

TillyTopper · 13/02/2021 15:39

Personally I wouldn't find offensive, but I don't think it's technically correct. Just because you are born in the Kashmir region I don't believe it makes you Kashmiri. Kashmiris are part of an Indo-European ethno-linguistic group from Jammu and Kashmir state in northern India. From what you say you are not part of the Indo-European ethic group.

BlackAmericanoNoSugar · 13/02/2021 15:40

I think a lot of where you feel you come from has to do with your parents' background (and her parents do have some background in the region) and where you grew up. She didn't actually grow up in Kashmir, her childhood was Hong Kong and Malaysia. She does clearly feel some cultural disconnect with Britishness. If she was born in Kashmir I don't think it's a lie to say that she's from Kashmir, and if it's the truth then how is it offensive?

I have dual nationality British and Irish, but would never mention being British if someone asked my nationality or where I'm from, even though I was born in Britain and lived there for most of my adult life. My formative years were not in Britain and so I do not consider myself to be British. It's not exactly the same because I look like either nationality and so nobody could call me out on it without doing a deep background check (well one person did, but I have ignored his opinion).

HaveringWavering · 13/02/2021 15:41

@Justcallmebebes

I am white British but born in Hong Kong. I've never described myself as Chinese but consider Hong Kong home
So if you were chatting to a lady who was making dim sum, might you have said “oh I’m a Hong Konger, that is my food!”

(Not a trick question- I was not born in HK but did live there for many years and could imagine myself saying “oh, I used to live in HK, I love Dim Sum” but that’s subtly different I guess)

Leila001 · 13/02/2021 15:43

@Annoy

There are many British born with Asian ethnicity who would describe themselves as British... quite rightly so.

I don’t see how your situation is any different

Exactly this! I have lots of Asian friends who always say I am from London or Birmingham etc?

If that isn't offensive then the other way around shouldn't be too.

lockdownalli · 13/02/2021 15:43

Not remotely offensive.

Haffiana · 13/02/2021 15:48

My friend (who is Indian, by birth and by family) finds it offensive that a white British person describes themselves as Kashmiri. He thinks she should say she was born in Kashmir but not claim to be Kashmiri.

But your friend who is now British and lives in the UK, can call themselves 'Indian' rather than 'Indian born'?

There is race, and there is nationality. They are different. Most intelligent people can understand the difference.

But, fuck anyone who gets offended by this sort of thing. Just fuck off the small-minded lot of you.

Haffiana · 13/02/2021 15:49

Just like that idiot on another thread who was getting offended and in a froth about calling a take-away an 'Indian'

littlepattilou · 13/02/2021 15:59

@cherryolives Of COURSE it's not offensive. Hmm

Reminds me of a (white) woman I knew who was born in the UK, and moved to Jamaica with her parents when she was 2.

Subsequently she had a strong Jamaican accent.

She and her parents moved back to the UK when she was 19, and she got SO much hate and vitriol for her Jamaican accent. People accused her of racism, and 'cultural appropriation,' and 'mocking the Caribbean accent,' and all sorts of shit.

She went through an awful time. She called herself Jamaican as she had lived there all her life (well, since she was 2,) and couldn't remember the UK at all!

I last saw her and her parents around five years ago, and don't know what came of her.

Hilariously, it was largely white people who slated her.

Just like the eejit on the 'Is saying I am going out for an Indian offensive;' anyone who is offended by this young woman (AND what the OP is on about,) is a PC 'woke,' obtuse twit.

TonTonMacoute · 13/02/2021 15:59

It is bonkers and inaccurate.

My mum was born in China to British parents - she was British not Chinese.

billycat321 · 13/02/2021 16:01

If our nationality depended on where we were born then Spike Milligan and Cliff Richard would be Indian

georgarina · 13/02/2021 16:02

Not offensive but also not accurate, if you were only born there. I have a friend who was born in the Middle East because their dad was in the army but they do not describe themselves as Middle Eastern.

gottakeeponmovin · 13/02/2021 16:06

My parents are German - I have never lived in Germany but if asked my nationality I say I am dual which I am. Is that offensive to Germans? The German government classify me as a German as I have a passport. This is the equivalent of saying someone of Parents born in India can't describe themselves as British.

BiBabbles · 13/02/2021 16:10

I can see how this might hit a sensitive spot for some with what happened and still is happening.

Personally, in the context given in this thread of just a joke about spinach, I wouldn't see any malice in it. To me, someone making a remark like that because of where they were born is like when people with certain distant ancestry but no experiences to an area or group make a remark or joke about it when it comes up - not trying to speak for anyone or act like they're defining that group which would I think be crossing a line into more questionable territory for me, what JL said might be questionable to someone else.

It is possible to discuss these different things well, how complicated these kinds of things can be - I think JL could possibly do so from what little I've seen of her.

Adancewithdragons · 13/02/2021 16:13

I was born in Ireland (English parents) and was brought up in England. I can imagine if I described myself as Irish that might raise some eyebrows

PatsyStone39 · 13/02/2021 16:15

It's not remotely offensive. You could apply the same logic to Sandi Toksvig who say's she is Danish but hasn't lived there exclusively since she was a young child. But is that okay because it's another caucasian country and she's white?

For the record, Joanna's father and her father's parents were in Asia for decades before Joanna was born, due to their involvement in the Army. And they continued to live there when Joanna and her sister were sent back to England for boarding school.

yeOldeTrout · 13/02/2021 16:21

In the context of talking about commonalities with spinach, what JL said was not offensive.

I don't care what ethnicity people claim. As long as they are honest how/why they make their claim.