To say to daughter staying overnight with grandparents

[SidSparrow]

My Dad and his wife want DD1 to stay overnight and I don't want her to. We have a bit of a troubled relationship which I'll get to in a bit. We have 2 children - DD2 has just turned a year and is a bit of a lockdown baby so has never really left my side so there would be major drama on her part if she was stay with them. DD1 is very comfortable with her grandparents and could stay no bother. They asked me last week if she could come stay and I said no, that she's a sibling (they share a room together) and you can't really take one and not the other and said that when DD2 is a bit older they can both stay.

Now they have come back to me saying they don't understand my logic. So, here's the background. Firstly I feel that they treat DD1 and DD2 differently. I think they blame it on DD2 being a baby and not seeing her much due to lockdown so they haven't got to know her as much. But when we are all together they are so enraptured by DD1 that DD2 doesn't get as much attention. When DD1 was a baby they were all over her but DD2 is left to get on with it. Even things like food, they give DD1 food then ask about DD2 like she's an afterthought. Letting DD1 stay over would just cement this different treatment. Also, DD1 is nearly 3 now and I wonder what it would say to her that only she goes to gran and grandads and not her sister. It very much feels like DD1 is a grandchild and DD2 is by default.

I don't have a great relationship with them myself. We get on but this is due to considerable effort on my part in keeping the peace - I don't let rip. I feel as though my Dad only tolerates me in order to keep seeing his grandaughter. He often falls out with me, he doesn't say so, he just ignores me for a few days then messages again. He's only finished ignoring me because he reccommended a movie - I said if it included children being hurt then I'm out because I can't watch things like that anymore - I wasn't rude or cheeky and only said it because the last time he recommended a movie it had children dying in a house fire. So he took the huff ane ignored me for about a week. He came back saying he hadn't been in touch because he was hurt?!?! It was ridiculous that anyone could be offended!! Then he was in touch to ask if DD1 can stay. In terms of a supportive loving father - he helps me now and again with money which I am very appreciative of, but that's all I get. He can barely have a conversation with me and I find talking to him extremely difficult as he is so judgemental. I am reluctant to allow DD1 and DD2 get so close as I don't know how he'll be with them when they get older. If it's like how he is with me then I'd rather they never saw him.

I find the whole thing awkward - I don't know what to say to them. Am I right that they should only go as a pair? Is there anyway I can back up this angle to keep him at bay? Any advice on what to say back?

(We're in scotland and they are in our extended household)

@Mypathtriedtokillme

If you you don’t feel comfortable with your DD going stay, then she doesn’t. End of discussion, no excuses. “No Dad that doesn’t work for us” if he gets in a gets in a huff about it then that’s his issue.

Your Dd is 3 and won’t actually care and would likely rather be at home with you.

This.

They are your children and you need to do what you think is best with the knowledge you have of them.

If you have reservations about your father I can't imagine why he would have unsupervised care of your child.

Yanbu if it makes you feel uncomfortable. I don't understand how they've a close relationship with DD1 if they were bad parents and potential bad grandparents.
If you don't want DD1 to go it is fine but don't blame DD2 if you think they're already resentful of DD2.
Not that anyone should resent a baby.
There is nothing wrong with DC staying overnight with grandparents normally it is a great relationship when it is good.

OP indifference is neglect, extremely hurtful and damaging.

OP the fact you let them have a relationship with your child doesn’t mean they get to dictate the terms and it doesn’t mean you can’t shut the door again if you do t think it’s the best thing for you and your girls.

If you prefer to keep them in your DD’s lives you can but on your terms.
Only visit as a family, put in boundaries and do what is best for you and your children.

Your father and step mother can deal with their own emotions. You can’t control them so stop letting them control you.

@Mypathtriedtokillme

If you you don’t feel comfortable with your DD going stay, then she doesn’t. End of discussion, no excuses. “No Dad that doesn’t work for us” if he gets in a gets in a huff about it then that’s his issue.

Your Dd is 3 and won’t actually care and would likely rather be at home with you.

agree with this. you are making too much of all this, OP, and maybe projecting your difficulties with your parents onto your children. but no need to agonise or seek to justify. you are their parent, you decide where they go what do. that's that. better not to discuss the issue. you are making a rod for your own back. you can look up precis / reviews of films, so you make an informed choice what to watch. it's not your father's responsibility. that sounds a bit childish, giving him too much power/influence. just be your own person. read up on assertive communication. good luck.

If you don't want to send DD1, don't. But the reasons you came up with are weak.

I hate this, why do gp suddenly need to have dc staying over night!!

We've also been pushed and pushed... I hate it.

Op just say, sorry but that is nt going to work for us right now.

That's it.
Say they don't need to understand your logic, everyone has different logic and you also cannot understand theirs but right now, no.

I will make it absolutely clear to my dc that I am happy to have dc whenever they want me to including over night.

I will not push, I will not kit out rooms with baby equipment.... I will not repeat.
I hope we have a good enough relationship to chat honestly.

If he isnt nice to you and wasn't nice to you as a child why should he be rewarded with a relationship with his granddaughter? Tell him to jog on and you don't need a sulky, manipulative person to mind her for you.

Plenty of DC never stay overnight with DGP mine never did. Honestly don't feel guilty over it.
The DC are little make a blanket rule no sleepovers full stop, they had the time with their DC.
I mistakenly thought DD1 had stayed and wanted to stay again you don't owe them anything.

None of what you’ve described sounds like emotional abuse. Some people have real problems

On reading your latest post I would keep even supervised visits to these people to a minimum.

I know exactly what you mean about calling kids silly, terrible etc. And saying Oh mummy is leaving you. I too feel that this kind of talk is detrimental to a young child's wellbeing.

It is interesting that you say you now live further away from them, a good half hour you wrote. Half an hour is nothing! I would consider moving right away and keeping these people who neglected you when you were young and will hurt your own children, away from you all.

None of what you’ve described sounds like emotional abuse. Some people have real problems
Did you read the OP how he grinds down with insults, abandoned her as a DC, ignores her for a week if she disagrees with them, he is trying to drive a wedge between little sisters.
OP I'd cut him off problem solved.

'We're not ready for that' and if you're never ready for that, that's ok.

I think you're worried your dad's going to react badly aren't you? You're obviously unpicking your childhood relationship with him (clue: he's a loon, sorry) but the first step to doing that at the same time as having him in your life is learning to sit with his bad reactions. You're not a child any more and his sulk/mood needn't be a huge thing in your life. Sounds easier than it is, I know.

Thing is OP, at nearly 3 your dd is cute and funny and they have no reason to abuse her in the way they did you, she's not old enough to have opinions beyond chocolate for lunch and back to back Peppa Pig.

Once she is older and able to express her opinion that's when the emotional abuse will start. My dd had eow contact with her father from age 2, she was happy to go. Until she got to 9/10 and started questioning his (batshit, borderline neglectful) parenting and then at 11 made the decision to not see him anymore.

Don't let either off dds get to that point, visit, nod and smile then leave. No to overnights, atm both girls are too young. Say no and mean it. If they push tell them it's because of the hangups you have about your childhood. If they fuss, cut them off and carry on with your life.

Ultimately you must put the well-being of your DD1 ahead of you own feelings. If she is happy with them and you have no issues with her safety, then let her go. Life is boring enough as it is and a sleepover with GPs is a great distraction. If as she gets older, you see your dad behaving in ways you found upsetting, then you act on that.

@YoniAndGuy

^Don't let him get away with it. He bows up. You reply - 'I'm not ok with you punishing me by ignoring me, I'm not putting up with it any more. Next time you do this, I'll be deleting your number, because I'm not going to allow my children to see an adult thinking it's ok to behave so atrociously.'
^

Thank you for this, your post was really helpful. I'll be keeping this for next time. I realise I do need to be more direct. I did go back to him and say sorry you don't understand the logic, but I'm not keen on sleepovers and that she's still too young for them. Needless to say I've not had any reply. To be expected.

Thank you all for your help. I realised yesterday that this whole sleepover pressure started with them. I'd made a throwaway comment when she was a baby saying about staying over when she was older. The next time I went there the spare room was all decked out nicely with a cot. I was quite shocked. We have let her stay a couple of times in preparation for when DD2 was arriving. Since then he has kept asking and I have mainly said no. Any time I have agreed it's because I've felt hounded. And that's not right.

@Frouby You've hit the nail on the head. I feel that's where it will end up. And that's what I worry about. They're not any different because I still have a very dysfunctional relationship with them so how could I expect it to be any different for my children with them. The spoil her rotten and not in a good way I'd say. They near idolise her. When we're in their company they barely make conversation with me, they stare at her, they're infatuated by her. And yes she's wonderful, all kids are at that age but she is human and what happens when she talks back? Or worse, disagrees? My Dad is very dogmatic and he takes things very personally. I can't see him being any different.

@Chamomileteaplease Haha yeah a good half hour sounds a bit ridiculous. People round these parts seems to think anything less than a 5 mins walk is far away. They hate driving and have viewed our move as too far out of town. And it's likely we will be moving further away at a later date.

@Zebraaa

None of what you’ve described sounds like emotional abuse. Some people have real problems

How dismissive I've had posters say this to me when I haven't written a 10 page essay about my childhood. Lack of emotional support can leave bad scars mentally just because you don't see it doesn't mean it's not there.

I would say you have to be a very shitty parent to not notice your 14 year old daughter is getting drunk & not attending school which is what the op described. And it is emotionally abusive not to interact with a child to the extreme that she gets drunk and is sent to her grandparents by school.

Glad OP you are getting clarity whilst it's lovely for kids to have strong wider family bonds it's no good if those relationships make them or you uncomfortable and open to emotional abuse.