To ask why religion is declining in Britain

[Jackieweaver2024]

Just that really I would be interested to hear everyone’s opinions?

If my household is anything to judge by, children do get taught about Christianity at school but if it ever goes beyond an academic exercise they've got mummy at home to remind them Jesus may well have been a real person in history but he wasn't magic and to think of the Bible's god as just another character in a book.

Nope. It's not the same thing at all.

You have to agree with one, to disagree with the other.

Atheism is not a belief. It's the absence of belief, is entirely passive and therefore is not, in any way, the same as an active belief.

This is astonishingly simple to grasp.

They weren’t the insults I was referring to.

It was more the ones with built in unkindness and superiority like ‘I don’t believe in fairy stories’ or a ‘giant man fairy’ the ones with the intent to ridicule.

I mean, I won’t lose sleep due to it, they’re random people on the net (much like myself right now) but please don’t suggest such comments were not intended to be insulting and were simply adding to a healthy debate.

@OppsUpsSide

And it’s obviously a very important belief system to you that you feel the need to argue and defend. Now what does that remind me of...

Lol its neither here nor there to me as I’ve got nothing to defend, unlike some who detract and try to take the focus off themselves.

Actually - someone has just hit the nail on the head (with it being midnight I’m not fully functioning)

It’s not that I categorically don’t believe in a god, it’s just the absence of any evidence suggests to me that it doesn’t exist.

If someone presents me with factual evidence then I’d believe.

No atheism is the opposite belief of theism, and requires a belief system of itself. Entirely passive is agnostic. To believe the opposite you need an opposing belief system.

(with it being midnight I’m not fully functioning)

With you on that part!

@Flipflops85

They weren’t the insults I was referring to.

It was more the ones with built in unkindness and superiority like ‘I don’t believe in fairy stories’ or a ‘giant man fairy’ the ones with the intent to ridicule.

I mean, I won’t lose sleep due to it, they’re random people on the net (much like myself right now) but please don’t suggest such comments were not intended to be insulting and were simply adding to a healthy debate.

I’ve not read the full thread so I don’t know what insults people are throwing about. I was giving examples of what other people were getting annoyed with.

I agree with you that there’s no need to be rude

@Flipflops85

They weren’t the insults I was referring to.

It was more the ones with built in unkindness and superiority like ‘I don’t believe in fairy stories’ or a ‘giant man fairy’ the ones with the intent to ridicule.

I mean, I won’t lose sleep due to it, they’re random people on the net (much like myself right now) but please don’t suggest such comments were not intended to be insulting and were simply adding to a healthy debate.

These are the insults I object to as well. I’m agnostic so have no skin in this game but I’m appalled by the rudeness, arrogance and lack of respect.

@OppsUpsSide

No atheism is the opposite belief of theism, and requires a belief system of itself. Entirely passive is agnostic. To believe the opposite you need an opposing belief system.

Well I think I believe I need to go to bed because when I wake up at 6.15am I believe I’ll regret not going to sleep earlier 😭

I think it's fair to say that
"I believe there is no God"
Is a belief. But, as I said in my previous post, it is not a Belief System, as organised religions are.

For someone to go
"I believe there is a God."
But for them to not subscribe to any religion, to not have any ideas as to what that God might want or do or be like (so, I suppose, being a theist but not religious) and therefore for it to make no real difference to their life. Then they would have a belief, but not a belief system.

OppsUpsSide

I feel like you’re getting atheism mixed up with anti-theism.

Anti-theist is the opposing belief that there is no God.

Atheism is, like asocial, amoral, etc is simply the lack of belief

You have summed up pretty much my disappointment at the rudeness and sneery superiority on this thread @VinylDetective. Like you, I veer on the side of agnostic and have no vested interest on either side. I just find the sheer nastiness unpleasant.

I wonder if the same posters would be as rude to Muslims or Jews or Hindus?

@TableFlowerss me too!
@RomeoLikedCapuletGirls as much as I enjoy youse username we will have to disagree on this

Or *your

There is less need in a modern educated society for a religious nucleus like church was to a village. And thank god (literally) lawmaking is secular.

Personally I always think organised religion is full of hypocritical and self righteous behaviours, when beneath all the proclaimed morals and repression theres all the drinking, sins etc

@Ginfordinner

You have summed up pretty much my disappointment at the rudeness and sneery superiority on this thread *@VinylDetective*. Like you, I veer on the side of agnostic and have no vested interest on either side. I just find the sheer nastiness unpleasant.

I wonder if the same posters would be as rude to Muslims or Jews or Hindus?

I’m sure they wouldn’t because they’re all too aware that accusations of racism would rain down on their heads.

People have simply outgrown having imaginary friends that dictate the rules

People have simply outgrown having imaginary friends that dictate the rules

And there we have it! My point proven - thank you I shall be leaving it there.

Because in this day & age people are able to question belief more. Previous generations were brought up to not question the church, it was the centre of their life, each generation was expected to follow the faith of the generation before, anyone who didn't was looked down on. The church was involved in education, welfare, health, it wasn't until World War 2 & the formation of the welfare state afterwards that people started to not need the church in their lives, before the welfare state the church supported people who fell on hard times, the workhouses, orphanages, hospitals & schools were all funded through the church, if you didn't go to church then you starved if you hadn't any work. People now are able to speak freely & question things that were not discussed generations ago.

This is an interesting thread!
'Gone are the days of unquestioning obedience by the masses, now there’s vast amounts of information available to all.'
'Better education and skills in thinking for ourselves.'
Yes - but also lots of evidence of people NOT doing that and believing nonesense told to them by politicians, media, advertising etc - eg manifesto pledges that are blatantly reneged on then people just vote for same again ignoring what is plain to see. Spending shed loads of money on creams to remove our wrinkles when there is no such thing but we fall for the advertising! So i don't think that alone explains it.
I don't have faith but have had a lot of church contact over the years.

I think 1) we have too many other things to do with our time these days and church is often pretty boring 2) the negative elements of some religions (intolerance of diversity, lack of gender equality etc) is now, understandably, a massive turn off for people. 3) Faith in a non visible deity without evidence is just a no go for most people these days. All that being said, along with te negative stuff, the Churches (of many faiths) in this country - or the people in them- DO do a lot of good in our society in terms of helping others. So even though i don't have faith myself, I'm bloody glad and thankful for the people who do who are helping the poor, homeless etc etc in the name of love of their God. Yes, lots of people without faith do good, but i know some really lovely people who I am in awe of, they have spent a lifetime helping others because of their faith. Personally, I think respecting others beliefs/non beliefs is what we aim for providing it is not harming or ill affecting us. Some of the comments on this thread certainly don't do that.

Is believing that vampires don't exist a belief system?

If so, I follow a shit load of belief systems!

@Golightly133

People have simply outgrown having imaginary friends that dictate the rules

Ffs, read the room.

@OppsUpsSide thanks 😊

What I find interesting, being a passionate atheist myself, is that atheist culture can be as misogynistic and sexist as the religious cultures they replace.

Not that this has to do with atheism, which is just a lack of belief, but more that evolutionary psychology is heralded as the explanation for all human behaviour and that can be just as divisive along gender lines.

If someone asserted that there isnt a god, that would be a statement of belief.

However, simply lacking a belief in any particular deity (which is likely the case for most atheists) is not a belief.