to be utterly shocked and heartbroken at how many intelligent, lovely friends and acquaintances have totally bought in to the radical global conspiracy theories...

[fuschia2000]

Seeing so much conspiracy stuff on Facebook threads, its totally alarming.... the folks can really make a good argument, with pseudo science, lots of data etc but we are looking at radical q'anon right wing conspiracy theories breaking through into the normal discussion groups and online groups.....

@1471565182 can you explain what this means?

"..,and pushing for the efforts that have boosted health sectors this year to be replicated across other sectors to bring about an industrial revolution."

I presume you know as it's from the Reuters article you posted a link to.

It's certainly letting me see which of my friends is more stupid than I realised they were. Quite useful, actually.

Triffid "Asking questions with implied answers isn't good enough. If the question should be asked, then go find an answer and state what you believe the answer to be. With proof to back it up."

No, I am completely open minded to answers MNers might like to give. Hence asking questions.

I am taking the bait..you say "people like me". What does that mean? What do you think I am like?

Clearly they're not intelligent if they're prepared to believe what they read on Facebook.

You said, "I do think it might have been removed because they were avoiding hosting anti lockdown content, but I don't think that makes me a CT."

Now you're saying, "No, I am completely open minded to answers MNers might like to give. Hence asking questions."

"People like you" are people who clearly think there are "bad" things going on, make all kinds of half hearted claims and insinuations, don't bother to back them up and then profess to be just "asking questions" when challenged.

But clearly nothing I say will change your mind. Nothing you say will change mine. So there's really little point in continuing this conversation.

PS, it took one google to find the answer to the question re Talkradio. Here's Youtube's statement:

"On Tuesday evening, the streaming platform broke its silence and reinstated TalkRadio’s account. “TalkRadio’s YouTube channel was briefly suspended, but upon further review, has now been reinstated,” a YouTube spokesperson said. “We quickly remove flagged content that violate our Community Guidelines, including Covid-19 content that explicitly contradict expert consensus from local health authorities or the World Health Organization. We make exceptions for material posted with an educational, documentary, scientific or artistic purpose, as was deemed in this case.” "

So yes, they took it down, briefly, as they thought that it had broken specific community guidelines re relying on expert consensus for Covid. However, on review, Youtube accepted that Talkradio has been debating it as part of acceptable processes and it was reinstated. So, arguably, a mistake was made in which legitimate questions being asked were taken off air and then, just 12 hours later, that decision was accepted as wrong and the whole thing was back on air. It doesn't feel any more nefarious to me than when one middle aged man complains about a sanpro advert using something that looks like blood and the instinctive reaction is to pull the advert and then a few days later everyone realises that middle aged man was being ridiculous. Whoever made the initial decision was acting too hastily and without sufficient thought but it's no more sinister than that.

Triffid

I'm saying both possibilities, in my mind, exist. I like to ask questions to figure it out.

I also think Covid might have killed more or fewer people than we are told.

I don't think "I don't know" makes me a CT.

The Schwab book was around well before Covid. Is there a connection? I doubt it. Open to information.

But if you want to think I'm faux innocence, you think that. A stranger on the internet has even less relevance than a colleague with no power or influence. 🤷🏻‍♀️

And of course I know the official answer re Talk Radio!

"Think". You think things. So go find some actual proof, not nebulous statements. Give reasons why you think something. Back them up. It drives me mad this idea that one person's vague concern that maybe things aren't quite right is given equal validity to actual information.

The official answer and your theory on talk radio are the same! It's just that you see it as something a bit dodgy and weird. That's what's so frustrating.

Triffid1, the Thread and Thought Police.

@TravellingTilbury

Triffid1, the Thread and Thought Police.

I love this. It's a classic. So, because I point that that nebulous "thoughts" about something are not, in fact, proof, I get to be in the category of "thought police". I'm guessing I'm also part of the problem and someone who doesn't know how to think for myself.

Cool.

Triffid you are part of the problem. The truth is no doubt the mainstream opinion or the qanon stuff, yet you always chose the mainstream...

They said "3 weeks to flatten the curve". It turned into 4 months to "Protect the NHS".

They said "Masks are not recommended and do not stop the spread". Then they made us wear them, saying "It's for your own protection".

They said "We need the Anti-body tests to determine who's safe to return to normal life". That was the last we heard about these tests. They didn't want us to know how many people could now be immune. They needed us to remain terrified.

They said "You CANNOT invite your family into your home". Then they told us to meet them in the pub for a cheap meal.

They said "Only essential businesses allowed to stay open". This included Off Licences that primarily sell alcohol yet they banned alcohol in thousands of pubs.
Studies revealed that masks offered no protection against catching the virus.

So they said "You ARE NOT wearing your mask to protect yourself. You are wearing it to protect others from YOU". From that point on you were a walking, talking potential serial killer.

They said "This will all end when we get a vaccine". They lied.
They introduced Track and Trace at a cost of hundreds of millions of £'s. They said "This is the way forward". It's almost completely disappeared. Didn't work. Complete waste of money.

They introduced the tier system as a rebranded lockdown. They said the vaccine was almost here. We just needed the vaccine.

They said 5,000 people would die every day by November. They didn't.

They said their predictions were based on fact. They were based on lies and inaccuracies.

They cancelled 4.4 million cancer screenings.
They cancelled over 2 million essential operations on the over 50's.
And by now the people were beginning to get complacent so they announced a new "Variant" covid had appeared. It was much more dangerous. It spread quicker. It affected more children. We were told "We just need to get this vaccine and things will get better".
And then....
They said "The vaccine is here. Hooray". They also said "But this changes NOTHING. You will still need to wear the masks and follow the rules. For another year".
They started injecting people on the telly.
They said the vaccine doesn't stop you catching the virus. They said the vaccine doesn't stop you passing it on. They said "Nothing has changed".

They allowed us one day for Christmas.

They said "Schools are safe. Return to school". That evening they said "Schools are closed. Keep your children at home".

They introduced another lockdown. They said "It will last 6 weeks". It won't.
The next day a Senior NHS Doctor let slip that not all the thousands of "covid patients" in hospitals were actually being treated for the condition. Many had been admitted for other conditions and had subsequently tested positive despite showing no symptoms. A large percentage had caught it after being admitted.
She said no records are available to determine exactly how many "covid patients" are ACTUALLY being treated for covid.

They have no idea.
So here we are.....
The start of another year.
In lockdown again.
Being told to take a vaccine despite the fact that it does none of the things we were told it would.
Being subjected to a 24 hour bombardment of doom, gloom and falsehoods from the compliant media.
Being forced to accept living like this.
In a never ending, man-made, dehumanising nightmare.
Forced to be grateful to have nearly every life decision made for us.
Being conditioned to accept that living an utterly sterile, joyless existence somehow benefits us all.
The thing is, the more we comply the more restrictions, limitations, regulations and new laws they introduce.
Think it's bad now?

The truth is no doubt the mainstream opinion or the qanon stuff, yet you always chose the mainstream...

Can I be clear. You think the Qanon stuff is the truth? Qanon, rather than the mainstream media?

I was discussing stuff with a conspiracy follower today.
My point was who is they - they are deliberately reducing the population, giving vaccines to control the ?minds of the population, they will take away our freedoms, etc

But who is they? I've never known of a despotic individual/group that isn't interested in becoming very rich and comfortable. So apparently 'they' want power and to control, but unlike Putin, Kim Jong Un, various African leaders, Arab Sheikhs, they just want to control us and the world without the luxury lifestyle, so for what?, fun?
If someone offered me control of the population of Britain I'd say why would I? - all that hassle for ...what?

sorry quoted the wrong post!

@KFB1978

Triffid you are part of the problem. The truth is no doubt the mainstream opinion or the qanon stuff, yet you always chose the mainstream...

They said "3 weeks to flatten the curve". It turned into 4 months to "Protect the NHS".

They said "Masks are not recommended and do not stop the spread". Then they made us wear them, saying "It's for your own protection".

They said "We need the Anti-body tests to determine who's safe to return to normal life". That was the last we heard about these tests. They didn't want us to know how many people could now be immune. They needed us to remain terrified.

They said "You CANNOT invite your family into your home". Then they told us to meet them in the pub for a cheap meal.

They said "Only essential businesses allowed to stay open". This included Off Licences that primarily sell alcohol yet they banned alcohol in thousands of pubs.
Studies revealed that masks offered no protection against catching the virus.

So they said "You ARE NOT wearing your mask to protect yourself. You are wearing it to protect others from YOU". From that point on you were a walking, talking potential serial killer.

They said "This will all end when we get a vaccine". They lied.
They introduced Track and Trace at a cost of hundreds of millions of £'s. They said "This is the way forward". It's almost completely disappeared. Didn't work. Complete waste of money.

They introduced the tier system as a rebranded lockdown. They said the vaccine was almost here. We just needed the vaccine.

They said 5,000 people would die every day by November. They didn't.

They said their predictions were based on fact. They were based on lies and inaccuracies.

They cancelled 4.4 million cancer screenings.
They cancelled over 2 million essential operations on the over 50's.
And by now the people were beginning to get complacent so they announced a new "Variant" covid had appeared. It was much more dangerous. It spread quicker. It affected more children. We were told "We just need to get this vaccine and things will get better".
And then....
They said "The vaccine is here. Hooray". They also said "But this changes NOTHING. You will still need to wear the masks and follow the rules. For another year".
They started injecting people on the telly.
They said the vaccine doesn't stop you catching the virus. They said the vaccine doesn't stop you passing it on. They said "Nothing has changed".

They allowed us one day for Christmas.

They said "Schools are safe. Return to school". That evening they said "Schools are closed. Keep your children at home".

They introduced another lockdown. They said "It will last 6 weeks". It won't.
The next day a Senior NHS Doctor let slip that not all the thousands of "covid patients" in hospitals were actually being treated for the condition. Many had been admitted for other conditions and had subsequently tested positive despite showing no symptoms. A large percentage had caught it after being admitted.
She said no records are available to determine exactly how many "covid patients" are ACTUALLY being treated for covid.

They have no idea.
So here we are.....
The start of another year.
In lockdown again.
Being told to take a vaccine despite the fact that it does none of the things we were told it would.
Being subjected to a 24 hour bombardment of doom, gloom and falsehoods from the compliant media.
Being forced to accept living like this.
In a never ending, man-made, dehumanising nightmare.
Forced to be grateful to have nearly every life decision made for us.
Being conditioned to accept that living an utterly sterile, joyless existence somehow benefits us all.
The thing is, the more we comply the more restrictions, limitations, regulations and new laws they introduce.
Think it's bad now?

What is your point?

@KFB1978

Triffid you are part of the problem. The truth is no doubt the mainstream opinion or the qanon stuff, yet you always chose the mainstream...

They said "3 weeks to flatten the curve". It turned into 4 months to "Protect the NHS".

They said "Masks are not recommended and do not stop the spread". Then they made us wear them, saying "It's for your own protection".

They said "We need the Anti-body tests to determine who's safe to return to normal life". That was the last we heard about these tests. They didn't want us to know how many people could now be immune. They needed us to remain terrified.

They said "You CANNOT invite your family into your home". Then they told us to meet them in the pub for a cheap meal.

They said "Only essential businesses allowed to stay open". This included Off Licences that primarily sell alcohol yet they banned alcohol in thousands of pubs.
Studies revealed that masks offered no protection against catching the virus.

So they said "You ARE NOT wearing your mask to protect yourself. You are wearing it to protect others from YOU". From that point on you were a walking, talking potential serial killer.

They said "This will all end when we get a vaccine". They lied.
They introduced Track and Trace at a cost of hundreds of millions of £'s. They said "This is the way forward". It's almost completely disappeared. Didn't work. Complete waste of money.

They introduced the tier system as a rebranded lockdown. They said the vaccine was almost here. We just needed the vaccine.

They said 5,000 people would die every day by November. They didn't.

They said their predictions were based on fact. They were based on lies and inaccuracies.

They cancelled 4.4 million cancer screenings.
They cancelled over 2 million essential operations on the over 50's.
And by now the people were beginning to get complacent so they announced a new "Variant" covid had appeared. It was much more dangerous. It spread quicker. It affected more children. We were told "We just need to get this vaccine and things will get better".
And then....
They said "The vaccine is here. Hooray". They also said "But this changes NOTHING. You will still need to wear the masks and follow the rules. For another year".
They started injecting people on the telly.
They said the vaccine doesn't stop you catching the virus. They said the vaccine doesn't stop you passing it on. They said "Nothing has changed".

They allowed us one day for Christmas.

They said "Schools are safe. Return to school". That evening they said "Schools are closed. Keep your children at home".

They introduced another lockdown. They said "It will last 6 weeks". It won't.
The next day a Senior NHS Doctor let slip that not all the thousands of "covid patients" in hospitals were actually being treated for the condition. Many had been admitted for other conditions and had subsequently tested positive despite showing no symptoms. A large percentage had caught it after being admitted.
She said no records are available to determine exactly how many "covid patients" are ACTUALLY being treated for covid.

They have no idea.
So here we are.....
The start of another year.
In lockdown again.
Being told to take a vaccine despite the fact that it does none of the things we were told it would.
Being subjected to a 24 hour bombardment of doom, gloom and falsehoods from the compliant media.
Being forced to accept living like this.
In a never ending, man-made, dehumanising nightmare.
Forced to be grateful to have nearly every life decision made for us.
Being conditioned to accept that living an utterly sterile, joyless existence somehow benefits us all.
The thing is, the more we comply the more restrictions, limitations, regulations and new laws they introduce.
Think it's bad now?

I agree with a great deal of this. But I don't understand what your point is? We're talking about conspiracy theories and people who believe in them. So what is the conspiracy here?

Many of these things you mention as issues are ones that I am incandescent about but that doesn't mean I support a theory that Covid is a big hoax? Personally, I think the UK government's incompetence has been breathtaking. The inconsistencies and lack of leadership has been shocking. The blatant willingness (and sense of entitlement) that means one rule for them and another for the rest of us applies on everything from travel to procurement has had me screaming.

But none of that means I think it's all a hoax designed to restrict us?

No knittingaddict, sorry a typo. I mean I neither trust the extreme qanon distraction or the mainstream media narrative. I
The truth is somewhere perhaps in the middle. The latest mainstream laugh. The WHO opinion of where in this came from? When they are bought and paid for by the CCP

What problem? That Covid has destroyed so much in the last year and our government has been singularly unable to cope? How am I part of that problem?

My issue is that so many people see conspiracies everywhere but never seem to be able to say what the conspiracy is aiming to achieve, or, for that matter, what it HAS achieved.

I'm so tired of being told that if I would just do my "research" I'd understand. I've done my bloody research. And it doesn't take a genius to spot the massive holes in so many of these arguments and theories.

As for the rest, I disagree.

The World hasn't had a pandemic like this for some time. At the beginning of 2020 covid was new and nothing was known about it in it's current form. No one could say what the best way to prevent it, treat it or avoid it was. Knowledge grew after time and study and the science moved with it. It would have been much weirder if advice and guidelines hadn't changed.

I'm wasting my breath though, aren't I.

Just because the virus might exist doesn't mean the reaction to it is not benefiting a lot of people right now at the expense of others. I am just stating that the mainstream opinion SHOULD be questioned and not swallowed down because it's on the state propoganda channels.

I should have added, I agree with others that the way the UK government has dealt with this has made it look incredibly chaotic, because it is. But that's incompetence, not design or a secret plan.

@Triffid1

What problem? That Covid has destroyed so much in the last year and our government has been singularly unable to cope? How am I part of that problem?

My issue is that so many people see conspiracies everywhere but never seem to be able to say what the conspiracy is aiming to achieve, or, for that matter, what it HAS achieved.

I'm so tired of being told that if I would just do my "research" I'd understand. I've done my bloody research. And it doesn't take a genius to spot the massive holes in so many of these arguments and theories.

I share your frustration. It doesn't matter who you ask or how often, no one ever answers these questions. It's like candyfloss. Just dissolves into nothingness when challenged.

You are frustrated because the CTs are a false dichotomy. They are put out there as an extreme and ridiculous alternative to the mainstream. So people say those CTs are incredible we will go with the mainstream view. Your government never lie to you do they?

@KFB1978

You are frustrated because the CTs are a false dichotomy. They are put out there as an extreme and ridiculous alternative to the mainstream. So people say those CTs are incredible we will go with the mainstream view. Your government never lie to you do they?

So now you are saying that the CT are put out by the govt and the MSM to get people to believe the govt?? So like a meta CT! Do you have any idea how that sounds?