To think bad dog owners don't realise that they are bad dog owners?

[WayTooSoon]

Kind of a thread about lots of threads...

Every so often, threads appear on here saying someone's dog ran up to them/their child/their dog and how the owners respond with "it's ok, he's friendly" or similar. What usually follows is a load of posters saying "bad owners give us good owners a bad name". So is mumsnet entirely populated by "good owners" or are people oblivious to their own shortcomings as pet owners? Aibu to think that if someone is a bad owner, it seems likely that they have no idea that other people see them as a bad owner?

Are you now or have you ever been a "bad owner"?

@berryfull you will find the majority of people are kind and patient, especially with a pup in training.

But I would be the kind of person to continue walking if your dog was coming at mine, because if I didn't my dog would want to get at yours.

I had this situation not too long ago with someone telling me their dog was fine (not a pup) and I had told them mine does not like dogs in their space. She made no effort to get her dog, so I continued walking trying to keep mine focused on me. I got quite a way away before she realised that calling her dogs name was having no effect and she actually had to move. Probably annoyed at me, but the other option was me focusing on getting her dog back to her, which would put my dogs focus on hers. I'm sure she wouldn't have liked that.

berryfull
Having been there with a puppy, your best bet is a long line whilst you're training unless you have access to somewhere without other dogs /somewhere you can go at a time where you are highly unlikely to see other dogs.

Your puppy not returning first time mid play is the sort of thing that most owners understand. Most of us have been there and there has to be a first time off lead around distractions, but ideally you'd do long line work first to get the basics secured.

Someone getting annoyed that your dog is following them is reasonable to be honest. I find it frustrating if dogs and I acquire someone else's dog and it becomes clear they expect us to stop our walk for as long as it takes for them to is effectively retrieve their dog.

If your dog is in heat then you should really avoid walking them in places where there's likely to be other dogs.

It's easy to say 'be kind' and 'be patient', but that goes both ways and someone with a poorly trained dog (even if they're in the middle of training) needs to be aware that expecting others to accept their poorly trained dog isn't actually showing kindness or courtesy to others.

In my pre illness life I was a dog trainer and regularly saw how often very lovely dog owners were virtually brought to their knees by their difficult dogs.

It was heartbreaking because they were doing everything exactly by the doggie 'rule book' and then the only way to see if the repeated and repeated lessons were learned was to risk them out in the general public again.

Then we would go back to basics and work through it all for however long.

I think the problem often is that if you are a dog owner and love dogs and find a lot of natural ebullient dog behaviour (sniffing, exploring, jumping up, barking etc) very endearing, it can de-sensitise you to the fact that many people don't love dogs and don't find natural dog behaviour very endearing at all.

For example I have several friends who have dogs who jump up, they genuinely see this as their dog being friendly and loving and enthusiastic. They can't understand that some people find this off putting and/or scary, because they don't personally find it scary, and they love dogs so much that they don't really see why people wouldn't love to say hi to a dog. And in their minds, part of saying hi is to have the dog's paws on their thighs and to be fussing them enthusiastically.

So they greet any dog jumping up at them with a smile and encouragement because they see this as a positive, friendly dog behaviour, they would see it as the dog being affectionate etc etc. And they would see anyone shying away from a jumping up dog as being 'a bit uptight'.

They are not bad people, just people who struggle to understand that not everyone loves dogs like they do.

There are different types of dog owners. One type think jumping up at you , agressive behaviour towards you when at their home & similar behaviour when off lead too, towards others, is ok & normal. The other type don't.

It's very clear from the number of posts on this thread where people are saying 'Oh I'm a good owner, I just get it wrong sometimes' and admit their dogs only have 80% - 90% recall / are puppies so are still being trained / dogs are unpredictable and it's not their fault blah blah blah that a lot of dog owners don't realise they are bad owners.

To those saying dogs are unpredictable that's my point. Dogs are unpredictable and should be on leads in public spaces. I'd prefer muzzled as well but accept I'm probably not going to win that argument. I've been bitten by an owner who assured me their stupid darling was 'just being friendly'. I'm sick of taking my nephews out for a walk and seeing them freeze in fear because a dog the same size as them comes running up. I'm sick of treading in dog poo. I'm sick of not being able to sit down with a picnic in a public place without a dog running over to steal food.

Some of the bigger breads shouldn't be allowed either. There's no way a lot of people could stop some of the dogs I see being walked from taking off if they so choose.

What we really need is separate spaces and then for these to be enforced. I don't understand why we can't we split parks so that dogs are in one half and the other is a dog free zone!

I think I saw a post earlier on recall? First off, get a whistle. Any whistle.

If it's a puppy or even a shy older dog on familiar grounds try to get ahead or wait until it is blanking you and then hide.

Sooner or later your dog will lose interest in whatever and then have a proper panic because they have lost you too.

Your whistle will help your dog remember and find you.

@Confusedcabbage with high value treats and lots of training in secure areas. The dog should want to come back or stay close to you and if you train young it can work!

I think i'm a responsible dog owner.
He is a rescued tiny ball of fluff, he is kept clean and worm/flea free.
I always clean up after rare accidents, but he is mainly trained to go in a corner of our garden, morning and night.
He has great recall but I only really let him off in the fields at the back of our home and along the river when its quiet.
This is not because I have any concern about his behaviour, its because he was badly attacked by a staffie (and I love staffies) a few years back and I have no wish to see him attacked again.
He was on a lead at the time, the other dog was running wild.

To those saying in real life they don't come across these opinions and people are most understanding - I think what you will find here is that on Mumsnet it's anonymous and people are more likely to tell you what they really feel.

In real life all I want to do is get away from the situation as quickly as I can, not try and educate you on how selfish you're being. I suspect a lot of other people who are scared / allergic / just don't want to be near the animal you've just proven you have very limited control over are the same.

YANBU

I'm probably what some on here would consider an irresponsible dog owner. I let my girl off lead where it's quiet and her recall is maybe 70% good. She will jump up as she is friendly and wants to say hi. I combat this by calling her back to leash her when we see someone or I will get her to walk to heel by using treats but it's not 100%. I don't like calling her back if the other person also has an off lead dog as it's nice to let them socialise and you find that other dog owners are generally more tolerant. We do pick up the poo though, even in the forest, and will carry it for miles until we get to a bin. I find other dog owners are happy to leave their dogs mess if it's off the path or in the woods which I don't like. Ultimately I think we all need to share this world and that includes being tolerant of each other. Dogs as companion animals aren't going anywhere anytime soon.

Dogs as companion animals aren't going anywhere anytime soon.

^This is how I feel. I haven't faced badly trained dogs when in parks. I'm saying this despite my DH being allergic and my DDs previously having been afraid of dogs. I eventually found that they learned not to be afraid when getting to know their cousins' dog and also their friends' dog. (I made a point of petting the dog so that they would see that there was nothing to be afraid of.

I do think that dog haters with DC should think about how you will handle it if one of your DC has a close friend who has a dog? It would be a shame if they couldn't go to their friend's house because they can't cope with dogs.

If you can't recognise why people might be afraid of dogs then yes you're a bad owner

Exactly. Lifelong fear of dogs as a result of being bitten by them! Once when just sitting as a child getting my picture taken. Dog came from behind. Never got over that fear, only to be bitten as an adult by a 'it's a friendly dog, he meant no harm, it's just a nip' type of dog with inane owner.

I don't want dogs jumping up onto my clothes, being allowed by owners with those stretchy leads to come up to sniff around me, or to tread in their shit. Not unreasonable to ask.

The good owners keep their dogs on leads, stop them yapping and barking, pick up their crap and above all recognise they have chosen to have a dog as a companion and that random strangers won't share their love or affection for their pet, so don't want to be jumped on, licked or sniffed at by said dog.

@Inpersuitofhappiness you are not a bad dog owner, you just have a dog that was moulded into behaviours from a bad start in life and well done to you for taking him on and managing it. Rescue dogs are a brave thing to take on because you never know what life they lived.

No male dog at least will ever have 100% recall.

To me the bad owners are the ones who let their dogs sleep in 'human' beds with their kids or worst still their babies, just as an example. The dog is never ever shown its place in the pack and this behaviour reverberates in all its external behaviours. It shows a complete ignorance of animals, humanising a dog and not giving respect to what they are, what they need. Like toddlers, safety and security and good behaviour starts with knowing and understanding your place in the world.

@tenbananasaday

I'm probably what some on here would consider an irresponsible dog owner. I let my girl off lead where it's quiet and her recall is maybe 70% good. She will jump up as she is friendly and wants to say hi. I combat this by calling her back to leash her when we see someone or I will get her to walk to heel by using treats but it's not 100%. I don't like calling her back if the other person also has an off lead dog as it's nice to let them socialise and you find that other dog owners are generally more tolerant. We do pick up the poo though, even in the forest, and will carry it for miles until we get to a bin. I find other dog owners are happy to leave their dogs mess if it's off the path or in the woods which I don't like. Ultimately I think we all need to share this world and that includes being tolerant of each other. Dogs as companion animals aren't going anywhere anytime soon.

Yes. You are a bad owner - there's no 'probably' about it.

'she will jump up as she is friendly and wants to say hi' - I don't care if you think your dog is friendly. They shouldn't be jumping up on people who haven't signed up to engage with your animal.

Huge thanks to the actual decent dog owners on here who don't think it's acceptable to have your dog out of control almost a third of the time.

@greatpurplepolkadots
We are doing our best to train her out if it but it's just so hard when she loves people so much. Nobody is perfect. No dog has perfect recall either. We just do our best.

I think good dog owners actually bother to socialise their dogs. So many poor dogs never get the opportunity to be let off the lead and run about and play with other dogs.

This is not aimed at dogs who have had a bad start in life and are not safe to be off the lead for whatever reason.

I have recently moved to a city in Canada, we brought the dog, the big difference here is you have to keep your dog on lead at all times except in a dog park.
It’s so different here, no dogs running up to strangers or knocking over children. Other dog owners are very polite and ask if their dog can say hello. Lots of dogs running on lead with owners.
You can’t miss a poo, because you have them on lead so if you don’t pick it up it’s because you are irresponsible.
We are finding it ok but our dog is 9 so not as energetic as he was. We sometimes let him off lead at night and he has a zoom around but we risk a $300 fine.
I’m surprised I feel like it’s ok as in the uk I had my dog off lead a lot of the time, but I can certainly see that my dog does not have a negative impact on other people or dogs as he’s in my control all of the time.

Forgot to say they can go off lead in dog parks (fenced off areas just for dogs) they can socialise with other dogs off lead and have a run around.
We currently have a nighttime curfew so the only people out are dog walkers, that’s why we let him off at night.

Never mind bad dog owners. Twice this week I've had people hold out their hand to my dog. I've asked them not to and said she isn't good with strangers, they've continued and she's snapped and they take offense. What's the crack with that?

Shed happily stand there while I chatted with someone, but actively doesn't like people holding their hands out...only outside the house curiously, inside she's fine with everyone.

I also got told the other day that I should train to her not to lag behind on the lead smelling everything. A)she's a basset hound, that's what they are built to do. Its actually good for them to have a sniff. B) she's old. I'm not going to drag her along to stop her sniffing. C) I'm the one freezing my butt off what difference does it make to them?

I pick poo up, she's never off the lead, and doesn't try to chase joggers or cyclists or kids, and doesn't jump up (more a breed thing than training though :)) That does me. Don't know whether I'm good or bad really. She's happy and doesn't cause distress to anyone. It's a win.

How about a similair threads on cats. No it's all in a cat's nature they cant help it....

@thechip surely it's in the use of them though? I use one for my dog and it's brill. She's on a short lead on the roadside, and then on rural paths and tracks she's on a long lead but I pull her in when walkers or runners etc pass. I appreciate in a city/town if people are leaving them on a long lead that's just plain stupid, but that's the person not the lead. I think they're fab, used wisely.

@housemdwaswrong as far as I’m concerned the dog walk is my dogs time, it’s for sniffing and smelling, he can stop as much as he likes, I find those ‘to heel’ dog owners a bit much, I want him to enjoy his walk and enjoyment for him is smelling and weeing on top of other dogs wee 🤣

Well my dog is a puppy and generally her recall is great. However sometimes she does have selective hearing and will try and play with other dogs and I will grab her and put her on the lead. But it's very difficult as she's happier off lead the on 😔