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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Am i being insensitive or aiding and abetting?

107 replies

Charlielilu · 01/02/2021 13:48

Content warning: abortion, birth defect, mentions still birth.

Am i being a cow? SiL had to have an abortion at 14 weeks because baby had a severe defect (not viable at all). The year since then she still talks about the baby being in the sky with her grandma and visiting my 18 month old to play. Every time my daughter points to something in the distance or looks at the sky its "oh, shes looking at her cousin!". She has made a family whatsapp group with updates she writes from the baby's perspective in heaven. She has an instagram account and a community of mums who are the same (but usually for viable baby loss or stillborn) on instagram. This sunday is a year since she lost the pregnancy and she is sad because she wanted to hold a birthday party for the baby but cant because of covid restrictions.
I honestly feel like im going mad with it all. Me and my husband arent religious and dont believe that the baby is sitting on a cloud waving at our daughter. I dont want to have a birthday party for the day she had to have an abortion, because i just think its a sad occasion. She gets angry if we dont mention the baby and always tells her parents that they shouldnt forget they have 2 grandchildren, not just 1. She gets angry and sad if we dont talk about the baby but what can we say at this point? Am i being an absolute knob? I am there for her and never say anything negative or to the contrary when she talks about the baby in the sky eating grandma's food. But I worry what the end game is here and how to explain it sensitively to my daughter when her auntie is talking to her about a 14 week old fetus playing with her.
My SiL is in therapy and seems to be doing well there, her husband sees no problem with it and even takes her staged photos for instagram (releasing a balloon to commemorate every month). Its making me uneasy now. Would love to know if I'm just being insensitive.

OP posts:
Lifeaintalwaysempty · 01/02/2021 17:56

*so long

DinoGreen · 01/02/2021 17:57

What a difficult situation. I had a TFMR in 2019 at 15 weeks. I’ve also had a “normal” miscarriage and the TFMR was infinitely more traumatic. The fact that you have to choose to terminate your much wanted pregnancy really is very difficult to come to terms with. Even if, like your SIL, the baby is not viable anyway. I remember having the CVS and being told that it carried a 1 in 1000 risk of miscarriage or something and hoping I would in fact be that 1 who would miscarry so that I wouldn’t have to make the decision myself. Sharing my grief is not my style at all and although my close family and a handful of close friends know about what happened, I don’t talk about it with them and I certainly wouldn’t be talking to a 2 year old about it or expecting my parents to act as if they had another grandchild. But after 18 months I can say that the grief is still quite raw and bubbles to the surface sometimes for both me and my DH, particularly as we haven’t gone on to have any subsequent successful pregnancies.

I already had a DS when I had my TFMR, and having him to focus on helps enormously. Your SIL doesn’t currently have that and it will help her too if she does go on to have another pregnancy. In the meantime, tread carefully but I think you are well within your rights to ask her not to mention it to your DD as it’s far too much for a child of her age to understand.

Final point and I am sure you don’t mean to offend by calling it an abortion but for me calling it that amplifies the pain - I prefer TFMR. Mine took place in a normal abortion clinic as I wanted a surgical procedure which the NHS were unable to provide, and it is of course the same procedure, but for fundamentally different reasons to most abortions and it feels insensitive to me to lump it in with “normal” abortions.

BurningRed · 01/02/2021 18:02

Me and my husband arent religious and dont believe that the baby is sitting on a cloud waving at our daughter.

I’m sorry, I giggled...

I completely agree with you @Charlielilu

ChancesWhatChances · 01/02/2021 18:03

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isitsafetocomeoutyet · 01/02/2021 18:04

I don't think you've been unsympathetic at all. Grief is horrific and all encompassing. For me the loss of an unborn child feels worse as its the loss of all the potential and nothing to hold on to.

Having said that no I don't think it's particularly healthy for your daughter. And she has to be your priority.

Can you talk to her husband or your DH talk to him about your concerns? But place it squarely because of your concern for your daughter. You don't want to confuse her etc.

I'm so sorry for her. She clearly needs help through this. Maybe see if she has professional child loss support around her. I would reiterate your support for her. But you have to put your daughter first.

ChancesWhatChances · 01/02/2021 18:08

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Aquamarine1029 · 01/02/2021 18:11

I'm very sympathetic to your SIL's loss, but I don't think she's managing her grief well at all, but that's for her and her husband to work through.

However, her delusional thinking is being thrust upon your child and that's where I would draw the line. Her grieving doesn't give her a pass to indoctrinate your child with woo woo nonsense against your wishes. You'll have to be as gentle as possible, but this needs to stop.

FiveFootTwoEyesOfBlue · 01/02/2021 18:12

It sounds like the facebook support group she's in is not helping her but doing the opposite. Releasing a balloon every month?? It's a good thing she's in therapy, I hope it's a good therapist who has the courage to gently challenge her.

The hard thing for you is that anything you say, however you try to phrase it sensitively, will inevitably upset her.

Daydrambeliever · 01/02/2021 18:12

OP is really not heartless. No one should be forced to perform grief.

bitliketonyhares · 01/02/2021 18:13

There's no wrong way to grieve. You shouldn't be dictating how she gets through her loss. Other than it annoying you - she's not actually hurting you is she? Just smile and nod along. Whether it's viable or not makes no difference - 14 weeks is far enough along in a pregnancy to see it's a baby. She would have had to have that baby removed. It wouldn't be a speck on the toilet paper. Have you ever experienced the exact same thing? It's not a bloody grief competition. Yes you are being insensitive. I cannot believe how many people seem to think this poor lady is in the wrong when she's clearly bloody struggling.

Flapjak · 01/02/2021 18:13

Having had several miscarriages, i feel this is extremely unhealthy and far from normal behaviour and dare i say attention seeking ? I think everyone is entitled to grieve how they need to, but not expect others to grieve along with them. Boundaries need to be put in place regarding your daughter asap, as this may go on for years. No one else needs to remembering an early miscarraige / termination.

Bluntness100 · 01/02/2021 18:16

This is so difficult. I honestly don’t think you can or should say anything it’s simply not your place, especially if her husband and parents are in agreement with her. It will cause a family fall out like no other.

This could be anything from mental health struggles due to grief through to attention seeking, and every hung in between. but it’s very very extreme.

I think uou need to just say nothing, I’m sorry.

saraclara · 01/02/2021 18:17

There's no wrong way to grieve.

@bitliketonyhares I'm afraid you're wrong there. Getting stuck in the grief process is very damaging, and can cause mental health problems for someone for the rest of their life. This is why grief counsellors exist.

The phrase you use is actually very damaging, and causes people not to seek help when they very much need it. And of course they can end up damaging others too, as in the example a pp mentioned of a mother ignoring her 3 live children to mourn her miscarriage 24/7.

Daphnise · 01/02/2021 18:18

It seems she is mentally ill.
I'd keep away from her as much as possible, and never go along with her fantasies which are harmful to your child.

She is not going to change without intensive medical treatment. You can't help her.

RootyT00t · 01/02/2021 18:20

Sounds awful and so sad. But yes absolutely grounds for concern.

OP, some of the things you have written make it sound as if you are....not mocking this, but minimising a bit with the explanations of things?

HopingForOurRainbowBaby · 01/02/2021 18:21

I feel for her I really do and unless you've been through similar then no one has the right to tell her she should stop mentioning her Baby. We've lost 4 our second one we lost on Xmas day 2018 and our 4th one just before Xmas 2019 I remember putting a little post up on Facebook in memory of our Babies and someone replying to it saying I was being silly for doing so. It made me feel really guilty for wanting to even acknowledge my Babies on Christmas Day. Our 4th Baby's 1st birthday is coming up in May and whilst I would love to have a party in memory of them my family also couldn't give a flying fuck. Thankfully my OH is very supportive and we've decided that just the 2 of us will have a day out together and do something in memory. We'll get a little birthday cake and release a balloon as well. One thing that really upsets me is that on Mother's Day because my. Babies aren't with me, most people don't see me as being a Mum and that hurts. Thankfully my OH doesn't see it that way and always wishes me a happy Mother's Day as I always wish him a happy Father's Day. The way we see it Our Babies will also always be included in every part of our lives.

MixedUpFiles · 01/02/2021 18:22

Think for a moment how you would deal with it if she had lost a child as a toddler. Her grief might be easier to understand, but you would still need to set boundaries with your daughter because what your she is doing is not a healthy form of grieving for a child. Occasional mentions of a lost cousin are ok, but not to the point that she feels guilt for having fun.

The way we grieve is so highly personal. I can say that if I were grieving in a manner similar to your SIl, it would not be healthy for me, but she may be a very different person.

diddl · 01/02/2021 18:24

If she can't accept people not wanting to do as she wants without getting angry, I'd honestly have to stay away I think.

Chatterpie · 01/02/2021 18:26

My DM did this all through my childhood- commemorating the lost babies. It was an absolute head fuck for a young child.

OwlBeThere · 01/02/2021 18:26

She is grieving, you seem to imply her loss is ‘less’ because it was only 14 weeks into the pregnancy, but that’s not how grief works. If it’s been a year and she hasn’t conceived again it may feel to her that this is only child she will ever have and that is tough.

strawberriesontheNeva · 01/02/2021 18:27

Awww she's struggling but coping in her own way. I'd just go along with it. She's not harming anybody. Very sad situation. I wouldn't mention your thoughts to her when she's so mentally fragile.

RootyT00t · 01/02/2021 18:28

@OwlBeThere

She is grieving, you seem to imply her loss is ‘less’ because it was only 14 weeks into the pregnancy, but that’s not how grief works. If it’s been a year and she hasn’t conceived again it may feel to her that this is only child she will ever have and that is tough.
Yes that's what I was looking for. Implying it's less.
RootyT00t · 01/02/2021 18:31

@Charlielilu

Thanks all for your perspective. I would never ever be cruel enough to tell her my true feelings on it. But like a few of you said: I am unsure if this is truely doing her any favours. Part of me thinks she's fallen into a rabbit hole with the instagram page and its not actually helping her, she uses it like a stereotypical social media influencer "follow4follow", "who wants to hear about Lia (the baby's name) story in my next post?" Etc. 😩 which I just find.....odd. and sad, to be honest. My brother and his wife had 8 miscarriages before their DD, and I think because they dealt with them all in such a different way I'm a bit taken aback with the best way to support my SiL. But like some of you said, there is no rule book to grief and I know I will never know what she's been through. I just want to firstly make sure it doesn't affect my daughter (simply saying "the baby is in heaven" isn't an option because we arent religious and I want DD to make her own decisions on what to believe in when she's old enough) and also make sure that my SiL is dealing with it in a healthy way. Her husband is 100% in agreement with all she does. So is his family. Her family know if they disagree with her in any way she will blow her top.
Not saying the baby is in heaven because you're not religious is petty.

There's not many ways to word it to a child. On this one I think you need to be more respectful (although I agree about the mentioning and clouds and 2 grandchildren).

One more thing OP - will she blow her top or genuinely struggle to cope? That's the main issue.

MerryDecembermas · 01/02/2021 18:32

That is tragic but she should not be making comments in earshot of a child. I doubt she would be able to receive a gentle request to stop it, and so you must remove your child to ensure nothing is overheard.

bitliketonyhares · 01/02/2021 18:36

@saraclara

There's no wrong way to grieve.

@bitliketonyhares I'm afraid you're wrong there. Getting stuck in the grief process is very damaging, and can cause mental health problems for someone for the rest of their life. This is why grief counsellors exist.

The phrase you use is actually very damaging, and causes people not to seek help when they very much need it. And of course they can end up damaging others too, as in the example a pp mentioned of a mother ignoring her 3 live children to mourn her miscarriage 24/7.

Are you a qualified mental health professional?