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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

to think that the effect on children's mental health is exaggerated?

614 replies

SmudgeButt · 30/01/2021 13:17

Look I have no doubt that lots of kids are missing their friends, school, grandparents. And all of these things will effect their development and mental health. But is it really that bad a situation compared to other things in the past?? Or is it just that we talk about it a whole nauseatingly more?

I'm thinking that the current situation isn't a patch on the effect of living in a country that's at war - thinking back to WW2 and the effect of being suddenly shipped off to strangers in the countryside or even to a different country. Thinking of those children in Europe who suddenly had to fend for themselves in Jewish ghettos or concentration camps.

People that survived (yes a lot didn't as they were murdered) no doubt had lifetime impacts but so many of their children say "dad was always cheerful, never talked about what happened".

AIBU to think that in a few years kids of today will say "wow, that was weird and I'm glad it's over, now let's get one with life" ?

OP posts:
HelloMissus · 31/01/2021 16:11

I saw India Knight banging this drum in the Sunday Times and rolled my eyes.

I mean the woman’s been bankrupt, twenty stone, and is now with a man convicted of downloading indecent images - and she’s lecturing folk on how to deport themselves as parents 😂😂😂😂

SnapCracklesPop · 31/01/2021 16:15

It's telling that children mental health, loss of freedom, loss of rights was never discussed, let alone considered, when people were debating Brexit for example,

Notthis2 · 31/01/2021 16:20

Op you are back peddling and haven't answered the question about whether you have children or not? Massively relevant in a post which is effectively dismissing the many, many chidren and parents that are struggling at the moment. Also to say now that you only wondered this as there been a lot in the news about ww1 and ww2 at the moment .....
It was you who made the comment "maybe some children are more resilient than others " which is totally trying to provoke.

ElliFAntspoo · 31/01/2021 16:41

Yes this country could be an awful lot worse than it is now and I'm sure you have observed such countries. We don't have to accept that our country will become like those.
But you don't get to choose. You can argue all you like but you have no control at all. If you recognise the danger and choose to not take action just in case, that is obviously your choice to make. But better that you recognise that crime could go through the roof on the back off mass unemployment and you may be terrified to leave your home. Better to think about it now when you can make reasonably rational judgements than later if it happens and it come as a complete surprise. Hell, we all want things to be different. But we don't get to choose, and it isn't.

That is not a natural state for any human or one that has existed in any civilised society before. We don't have a blueprint for how to deal with that. It is not about getting other people to solve things for you but it IS about thinking up, offering and accepting help from other people.
Well at least you accept the possibility that this is an ongoing crisis and are able to rationally discuss it without getting hysterical and dealing up victim cards. Yes, we need to discuss it, and yes we need solutions, but we need to be looking at the long game, in case we are in rolling lockdowns and distance learning for the next decade. Coming together and finding solutions may only be a forum and Zoom concept. We don't know. We can assume that going forward we are only going to have the lack of one-to-one socialisation to deal with, but we would be remiss in ignoring how much we do enjoy and how much more of a leveller this might be as far as the world as a whole is concerned.

To put it in perspective, it only takes a sustained power outage to remove everyone's ability to pay for food, withdraw money from backs, fill their cars with fuels, go online to find out what is happening, use the mobile phone network, or use any of the computers they need to do their jobs. A week in to a power outage hospitals cease using machines if they cannot get fuel for their generators. They cease operations when their supplies of gasses runs out. Gas bottling plants do not have generators of their own, and need electricity to fill gas cylinders even if they could get fuel to get the cylinders to hospitals. 72 hours into a power outage everything we have in freezers is spoiled and we are dependant on local shops dishing out what they do have and people not being greedy.

And that is the loss of a single utility. That is one single possible emergency added onto the top of the current one. Now, you might say, that can't possibly happen. But then I'm guessing at Christmas 2019 the majority of people would never have thought the entire world could be put into lockdown together and they'd be at home for most of the following year, and I'd bet most people here don't think they'll be in lockdown this coming Christmas and having these exact same discussions on MN next January.

I just think hiding from reality doesn't work for most people. I do recognise that there are some with MH problems that need assistance. It may be a good idea to hide what may be in the future from them (which is what our Govt. is doing with its, just a little bit longer' campaign'), but you cannot change what is from them.

When you say 'accepted it and moved on with their lives' what the fuck do you even mean? Accepted the situation you've created in this little imaginary scenario? Or moving on right now locked down in houses with no social interaction?
I meant accept that we are in lockdown and it is unlikely to change any time soon. Accept that it might get worse an think ahead. I personally think we'll see a let up in the summer, measures to try to stop idiots from holidaying abroad coupled with encouragement to holiday in the UK, followed by greater restrictions in the autumn, an attempt at a firebreak lockdown during the October break, failure of that lockdown. Another more stringent firebreak lockdown in early December, freedom to do as we please within boundaries at Christmas, followed by complete lockdown January through April 2022. Compared to what might happen, I'm pretty positive none of it will.

Regarding institutions to deal with MH problems, we have a huge NHS with a multi-billion pound budget. It is free, even if there is a Postcode lottery when it comes to competence and availability. Some say it is the best in the world, and if so, then we have little to complain about on that score.

ElliFAntspoo · 31/01/2021 16:53

@SnapCracklesPop

It's telling that children mental health, loss of freedom, loss of rights was never discussed, let alone considered, when people were debating Brexit for example,
Yes. It was never discussed when deciding whether or not to host the Commonwealth Games either.

I don't want to side track the thread, so feel free to post elsewhere, but there is no way Brexit is linked to children's MH, and there is a slight difference between Brexit, and a deadly pandemic that effects the whole world.

SnapCracklesPop · 31/01/2021 16:59

ElliFAntspoo

you are proving my point exactly

just because YOUR children or your neighbours' children MH might not be affected in the slightest, you joyfully disregard the millions that ARE directly affected by Brexit and the ones whose MH is being affected... being in the middle of it all.

And it's only an example among many.

or did you think I mean the effect of Brexit on British nationals maybe? yeah...Wink

Silenceisgolden20 · 31/01/2021 16:59

If you haven't been a parent watching your child struggle with their mental health. For whatever reason ASD, covid, anxiety , any reason and feel the helplessness, you have no right to comment so dismissively. Absolutely
non. The worry, anything you can do to help for your child and knowing only so much you can do. It's awful. You can be the most positive parent in the world but it is still awful. It hits you in the stomach like nothing ever before.

Most of the chin up and dismissive attitude on here of mental health have no experience of it. Either in work or as a parent. You are commenting with what you have read and what you think you know.
I came back on this thread to say that.

TheKeatingFive · 31/01/2021 17:02

Discussion of MH issues in children really is a dinner bell for the utter cunts, isn't it?

Yup. It’s really eye opening.

ThePlantsitter · 31/01/2021 17:05

OK ElliFAntspoo. I'm not going to engage with you on how horrendous things could get. I'm a pragmatist too but I don't think creating catastrophic fantasies helps especially. After all there are limits to what we can prepare for.

What I would say is that instead of being scathing of young people and young people's parents because you don't believe this lockdown is causing MH issues - or because you don't think it should Hmm - how about accepting that the evidence suggests it IS causing them. There is no reason to think that most parents are not dealing with this with perfectly sensible strategies but even this thread shows you sometimes those strategies don't work because they are not enough. A national response to MH issues caused by lockdown is not an over reaction. It's not saying lockdown should end over it or just 'it's not fair'.

Obviously crappy parents o exist but the majority of parents are not crappy, or weak of spine, or 'woke' to a fault or whatever you want to call it.

SnapCracklesPop · 31/01/2021 17:08

Yup. It’s really eye opening.

it might be

but some posters answered their own question: How can people NOT care? Simply the way YOU didn't care about children's MH when it wasn't touching yours 🤷

It's funny how some posters pretend they are superior because they suddenly wake up to a problem, and how insulting they are towards others who had to deal with similar situation

WouldBeGood · 31/01/2021 17:08

@TheKeatingFive

Discussion of MH issues in children really is a dinner bell for the utter cunts, isn't it?

Yup. It’s really eye opening.

Yep
TheKeatingFive · 31/01/2021 17:16

Simply the way YOU didn't care about children's MH when it wasn't touching yours

Where are you getting that from? You don’t know anything about anyone’s circumstances.

And regardless of anything else I’ve done or not done, I’m confident I’ve never denied or minimised or blamed a parent for mental health struggles the way many on this thread have happily done.

SnapCracklesPop · 31/01/2021 17:17

Where do I get that? Let me just quote from just a post or 2 above

but there is no way Brexit is linked to children's MH

ok then....

TheKeatingFive · 31/01/2021 17:21

One poster? Wow, you got me. Hmm

SnapCracklesPop · 31/01/2021 17:26

yes, because we don't reply to individual posters now Hmm

I love how some people really cannot accept to be proven wrong, ever. Gives a interesting light over their entire contribution to a thread. Smile

RootyT00t · 31/01/2021 17:27

@Silenceisgolden20

If you haven't been a parent watching your child struggle with their mental health. For whatever reason ASD, covid, anxiety , any reason and feel the helplessness, you have no right to comment so dismissively. Absolutely non. The worry, anything you can do to help for your child and knowing only so much you can do. It's awful. You can be the most positive parent in the world but it is still awful. It hits you in the stomach like nothing ever before.

Most of the chin up and dismissive attitude on here of mental health have no experience of it. Either in work or as a parent. You are commenting with what you have read and what you think you know.
I came back on this thread to say that.

This.
TheKeatingFive · 31/01/2021 17:30

I love how some people really cannot accept to be proven wrong, ever.

But I haven’t ‘been proven wrong’

Your point was about people not ‘caring‘ about other children’s MH before this. Whatever you constitute ‘care’ to be, I can confidently state and I’m sure many others can too, that they haven’t minimised or denied them. That’s a crucial distinction.

ElliFAntspoo · 31/01/2021 18:26

@Silenceisgolden20

If you haven't been a parent watching your child struggle with their mental health. For whatever reason ASD, covid, anxiety , any reason and feel the helplessness, you have no right to comment so dismissively. Absolutely non. The worry, anything you can do to help for your child and knowing only so much you can do. It's awful. You can be the most positive parent in the world but it is still awful. It hits you in the stomach like nothing ever before.

Most of the chin up and dismissive attitude on here of mental health have no experience of it. Either in work or as a parent. You are commenting with what you have read and what you think you know.
I came back on this thread to say that.

So far I see a lot of people coming on to say what MH problems their kids have, a lot of people coming on to tell them 'they understand' but not offering them any advice, solution, support. And a few people, myself included, pointing out that in the grand scheme of things this could be a damn site worse, and maybe if we're not going to offer any practical solutions or support, maybe parents need to shift their own mindset to one of preparing for the long haul as opposed to focusing on today's problems and not getting any answers from people on MN.

So, the MN community as a whole tears down those who try to reframe and refocus the peoples minds and keep them in the real world, and fills the threads with sympathies and lip service.

The problem I see is that if your children have real genuine MH problems developing, coming in MN and being told we're all with you, just hang in there, is no different from the constant flow, don't worry it'll all be over in six weeks which our Govt. has been ramming down our throats for going on a year now. This isn't helping anyone.

If we have to we'll walk away from our careers, our extended families, our friends and our country if that is what we have to do to provide the best environment for our family.

I do not suggest the situation we find ourselves in is anyone's responsibility, but I doubt flooding MN with commiserations about the plights people find themselves in is helping anyone unless they post their tales seeking a pick-me-up and a feeling of camaraderie. I'd suggest most people who are genuinely concerned about the MH of their children want an accurate handle of what can be done, an accurate picture of what may lie ahead, and a chance to rebuild their own resilience and determination to hold it together first.

unmarkedbythat · 31/01/2021 18:35

I really dislike people like the op and hope that one day she is ashamed of having tried to use the experiences of children in Jewish ghettoes and concentration camps in order to dismiss the experiences of children suffering now.

mbosnz · 31/01/2021 18:44

As to things that can help, from our experience:

CBT therapy was very good for PTSD for our then five year old, she got taught very good, age appropriate techniques for managing stress and anxiety that we all use to this day.
Routine and structure was very useful, particularly including little 'treats' like bubblebaths - although as a result, one loves lavender, and finds it very comforting and restful, and the other finds the scent very triggering!
In the 'quakes (they went on for roughly five years to some extent), we also made up games that helped us deal with them, so 'guess the magnitude', with the closest getting a lolly as a prize. It's incredible how accurate we got! Now they're older, we have 'Boris Bingo' - luckily you can't get pissed on Coca Cola.
Accepting that we as parents are human too, and some days we just can't face it, made it easier, and we all felt open to talk about our feelings - when we had good days and when we were finding it hard. Feelings aren't 'good' or 'bad', they're how you feel.
Gallows humour helps to a certain extent, too.

Busygoingblah · 31/01/2021 18:49

Googling ACEs (Adverse childhood experiences) is truely eye opening. Stress in childhood has a measurable impact of both mental and physical health in adulthood.

mbosnz · 31/01/2021 18:49

Adding on to that - but there are no magic wands, and everyone's circumstances and resources are very different. For many of these children who are very much in extremis, these ideas would be facile in the extreme, as I do realise, so I apologise if any of you are out there spitting at the screen, at what could come across as very twee smuggery - it really is not meant as such!

ElliFAntspoo · 31/01/2021 18:51

@unmarkedbythat

I really dislike people like the op and hope that one day she is ashamed of having tried to use the experiences of children in Jewish ghettoes and concentration camps in order to dismiss the experiences of children suffering now.
That's out of order if that is the case. I must have missed that one. A child suffering is a child suffering, no matter what degree of suffering we're talking about. Any suffering among children is just wrong. I don't hold the same opinion about adult suffering because I believe we make choices in our lives, should take responsibility and not play the finger pointy or victim card games so many seem to. But saying one child's suffering is nothing because another child suffers more is just despicable.
ElliFAntspoo · 31/01/2021 18:54

@mbosnz

As to things that can help, from our experience:

CBT therapy was very good for PTSD for our then five year old, she got taught very good, age appropriate techniques for managing stress and anxiety that we all use to this day.
Routine and structure was very useful, particularly including little 'treats' like bubblebaths - although as a result, one loves lavender, and finds it very comforting and restful, and the other finds the scent very triggering!
In the 'quakes (they went on for roughly five years to some extent), we also made up games that helped us deal with them, so 'guess the magnitude', with the closest getting a lolly as a prize. It's incredible how accurate we got! Now they're older, we have 'Boris Bingo' - luckily you can't get pissed on Coca Cola.
Accepting that we as parents are human too, and some days we just can't face it, made it easier, and we all felt open to talk about our feelings - when we had good days and when we were finding it hard. Feelings aren't 'good' or 'bad', they're how you feel.
Gallows humour helps to a certain extent, too.

Bravo that person. Flowers or Cake whichever takes your fancy.
Silenceisgolden20 · 31/01/2021 18:55

God i hate the term the 'real world'.

It's patronising. The world is the world. Peoples reality is different to each person and their experiences.

And if you are looking for advice you certainly don't come on this thread.