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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

In-laws have declined the vaccine... AIBU?

543 replies

HotGlueGun · 30/01/2021 11:14

So my in-laws (early 70s) have declined to have the vaccine. They are in our childcare bubble and so we see them regularly. They also ask us to do their shopping. WIBU to a) stop doing their shopping for them and b) reduce/ stop their contact with the kids? I'm really cross about but appreciate that they have free will and it's their choice. But resent having to do shopping for them... it's like they are happy for us to be at risk and aren't prepared to take reasonable steps to reduce their vulnerability and eliminate the risk for themselves/ the wider community.

OP posts:
Grannycurls · 31/01/2021 06:16

@AStudyinPink

Some people are happy to do wrong -- happy to be bad people. Are you one of those people, Grannycurls ? Are you happy to be a bad person? If not, you should get vaccinated.

No reasonable person is going to pay any attention to this crude emotional blackmail.

Thank you. I was going to reply but you are right. The condescension and uninformed judgment is beyond belief.

What is it about today's society that we are ready at a moment to call anyone who makes a decision you don't agree with, a "bad person"?

Luckily I'm immune to such accusations.

Grannycurls · 31/01/2021 06:27

@Bourbonic

I'm struggling really to see how anything is any different whether they have the vaccine or not. You're already mixing with them. To just stop doing their shopping and stop allowing your children to visit would absolutely be punishing them for a decision they've made which impacts nobody but themselves.

My mother is 70 and I couldn't imagine telling her she'll have to do her own shopping just because we disagreed on whether she should have the vaccine. If she chose not to have it, it would be all the more reason for me to continue doing her shopping. But then I adore my mother and would do anything she needs to make her life better.

Yes, this is the arrangement I have with my daughter. It's all theoretical anyway; I am not due for a vaccine and I don't know if I will refuse it when called, or not. But my kids and I -- we simply help each other out. If for any reason whatsoever it was safer for me to stay home, of course my kids would help out. Even staying at home, I am still doing a hell of a lot for them, and they know it.

As for the future, we just don't know. I am be patient and wait and see. Nothing is written in stone, I'm not in a panic, I probably won't die if I do get Covid19, and, well, we'll all be a lot wiser five years from now.

AStudyinPink · 31/01/2021 06:44

What is it about today's society that we are ready at a moment to call anyone who makes a decision you don't agree with, a "bad person"?

Indeed. It’s arrogance beyond measure.

AStudyinPink · 31/01/2021 06:46

Bog off' struck me as indicative of one who has run out of reasons or their means of expression. Misreading argument as opinion largely confirms this assessment.

Not ‘run out’ of reasons or ‘run out of expression’ at all. It’s just very very simple and has already been said. You’re not the arbiter of morality for everyone else. That means, in matters of other people’s healthcare, you should mind your own business. Not complicated, but I suspect that won’t help in your case.

LunaLula83 · 31/01/2021 07:04

You don't want to put yourselves at risk so cut them out of your bubble.

Smiledwiththerisingsun · 31/01/2021 07:07

Cant they get online shipping?

Smiledwiththerisingsun · 31/01/2021 07:07

(Shopping)

inquietant · 31/01/2021 07:17

I would just let things calm down, they may change their minds and currently we are in a lockdown so I think doing their shopping is ok for now. In two or three months hopefully case rates will be far, far lower so there would be a lot less risk for the unvaccinated anyway.

Ultimately you can't control their choices. Not sure why you'd change the childcare (I am not confident enough about the rules to process on that) when there is no change to risk whether they vaccinate or not - the risk to your family will be lower going forwards anyway as lockdown works.

It sounds to me like you're just angry about their choice, which is really an emotional problem not a virus problem.

makingmammaries · 31/01/2021 07:42

They can do what they want re the vaccine, but you need to stop enabling them by doing their shopping. It’s not difficult to get a data package for the mobile phone and use it for internet shopping. Seriously, they think you’re going to be shopping for them for how long now?

Pimlicojo · 31/01/2021 09:11

They're in their early 70s - most people I know of that age are perfectly able to do their own shopping. It's kind of you to do it for them whilst they are high risk, but if they choose not to have the vaccine I wouldn't continue to do it for them. It would be wrong of them to expect you to do so.

PerveenMistry · 31/01/2021 09:30

I would withdraw from them and tell them why.

We are in a massive global crisis that, after a year! Is getting worse not better. Anyone who doesn't suck it up and do his/her part is beneath contempt. No pass for being elderly and/or ignorant.

Schoolchoicesucks · 31/01/2021 09:30

I would be infuriated with them too OP.

Would I continue doing their shopping for them? Depends how much of a pain it was for me. Could your DH do it for them instead? Or could you set them up a weekly internet shop?

Would I continue the childcare bubble with them? Probably yes while the kids are still off school. Once they were back though, the kids will be an increased risk to them. If your parents have been vaccinated in the meantime, would think about switching the bubble over to them (even if they live further away).

Schoolchoicesucks · 31/01/2021 09:32

@boredtodeath. I don't think the OP's PIL should concern themselves too much over the impact of the covid vaccines on their fertility...

Carriemac · 31/01/2021 09:35

Don't do their shopping - just explain that as they are unconcerned about catching and/or transmitting the virus they can obviously do their own.

dontdisturbmenow · 31/01/2021 09:36

I don't get how shopping for them out you more at risk. Just buy what's in their list at the same time you do your own shopping, which you can do when your kids are with them.

uggmum · 31/01/2021 09:41

To be honest you sound mean.

They are older vulnerable people who have been misinformed about the vaccine. They are probably scared.

Have you thought of printing them out some accurate literature and giving it to them so they can make an informed choice.

You have been quite happy to use them for free childcare but withdrawing help because they won't do what you want is mean.

Is it really a big deal to get their shopping.

My MIL has had the vaccine but she refuses to go out. We get her shopping for her.

She is scared and hasn't gone further than the end of her street since last March.

nervalslobster · 31/01/2021 09:43

I'm afraid I would not be able to hide my contempt for them. I'd be telling them to fuck off and find some other mug to do their shopping, and they wouldn't be seeing the kids until they got vaccinated. I've cut contact with anti vaxxers before.
Actions have consequences. And let's face it, if you don't knock this on the head, you could potentially be doing their bloody shopping for another 15 years. Why don't they have internet? The excuse of being old is wearing a little thin. Firstly early 70s is not ancient, and I've been working with computers since I started holiday jobs in 1980, so I find it hard to believe that anyone is not at least a bit familiar with computers, and secondly, if they're not they should fucking well learn. But I generally have no sympathy whatsoever with people who for no good reason refuse vaccines, or refuse to get even the slightest bit computer literate.

WombatChocolate · 31/01/2021 09:47

When AIDS was a serious risk in the 1980s, government launched a massive information campaign on TV and by leaflets in the post about safe sex. It was vital in helping people make informed choices. Some still chose not to use condoms, but the info was out there.

Today, the government is using the internet and TV to get the message about the vaccine out. Some people like the Op’s in-laws don’t have TV or internet. They are amongst a small group who wint have either, but perhaps a postal campaign of information is still needed by government to reach more people.

This ‘mind your own business’ about other people’s healthcare is essentially a nonsense when it comes to family isn’t it. Families are frequently involved and part of their family healthcare - that can be in the early stages of diagnosis simply by taking an elederly relative to the hospital for tests, or phoning to receive results, or going with them to get results, or talking through options, to helping with convalescent care, to having them live with them in final life stages. ‘Mind your own business’ just seems like such a daft phrase to use, when clearly people are hugely involved in each other’s healthcare and also in decision making.

The Op will have to accept the choice of her PiLs over the vaccine....but it is NOT the case, that family members should unquestioningly accept decisions where they know full well that a choice has been made when there is either a clear misunderstanding of information or simply that the vast amount of the facts have not been available to the decision maker. It would be like expecting a person from a different planet or different time in history to make a choice about something that could affect their future health, when they don’t even h deist and the language being used.

Of course the Op and her famiky should get some information to the PiL....it would be negligent to not do this. And in reality, is anyone, even the anti vaccers or anyone else saying that family members should accept without a single question a decision from a vulnerable adult (and their lack of access to formation and isolation does make them vulnerable) that can impact their future health, because having the right to choose at the point of having no information means no-one can ever offer further information or ask any questions. No-one actually thinks that. And those pushing the point that the PiL are feee to choose whatever they like, never refer to the fact that they are lacking the vital information which has been available to the vast majority during this pandemic, through isolation and being cut off from sources of information. All they do is push the point about adults being free to choose without interference and quote parts of people’s posts out of the context of the whole post.

Ultimately, it will be the PiLs choice. They have made their choice for now and declined the vaccine. But it wasn’t a one-time-only offer and the vaccine will be available still for them next week or next month. And given that they made their choice without having had access to the information about it, I really think it is the Op and family’s duty to give that information to them. That is very different to refusing to accept their decision. If they then decide they still do t want it, Op might not understand the choice, but will have to accept it is their choice. At that point to be seriously trying to influence them might be questionable (although they will need to choose being fully aware of the consequences for their interaction with family too) but UNTIL they have been given the chance to read and understand a bit more about the vaccine, I wouldn’t say they are in a position to make a final decision on the matter.

4redSocks · 31/01/2021 09:49

** They think they are invincible.

OP. This isn’t about the shopping because you can order online for them. This is about you wanting to push your own personal views onto other people. I’m tired of these threads.

Your entitled to look after your own child. So get on with it if you don’t really need your relatives to help you at. At 70 I would say it’s more for your benefit than their own.

AStudyinPink · 31/01/2021 09:54

and they wouldn't be seeing the kids until they got vaccinated. I've cut contact with anti vaxxers before.

Surely if you cared this much, you would already know your parents were “anti-vaxxers”? And you would have denied them a relationship with their grandchildren years ago?

AStudyinPink · 31/01/2021 09:56

This ‘mind your own business’ about other people’s healthcare is essentially a nonsense when it comes to family isn’t it. Families are frequently involved and part of their family healthcare - that can be in the early stages of diagnosis simply by taking an elederly relative to the hospital for tests, or phoning to receive results, or going with them to get results, or talking through options, to helping with convalescent care, to having them live with them in final life stages. ‘Mind your own business’ just seems like such a daft phrase to use, when clearly people are hugely involved in each other’s healthcare and also in decision making.

No, it isn’t. People with competency can make their own decisions about healthcare. They might invite opinions from others, they might not. Family or not, unless you live in an actual commune, you are perfectly entitled to say, “Keep your nose out, it’s my own business” to anyone you like.

nervalslobster · 31/01/2021 09:59

Oh and @MotherExtraordinaire just stop it with suggestions that MS is caused by this. It's not true and very hurtful to people with this disease. Your ignorance is disgusting.

nervalslobster · 31/01/2021 10:03

@AStudyinPink the OP hasn't indicated that they have refused other vaccines has she? But yes, if my parents or in laws had been stupid enough to be anti vaxxers they would not have seen their grandchildren. A friend of my daughters has anti vax parents and was only able to get vaccinated herself when she turned 18. She says she will never let any child of hers near her parents while they hold these views.

AStudyinPink · 31/01/2021 10:04

nervalslobster

I find that bizarre and hysterical, but each to their own, I suppose. I wouldn’t see you either.

TheChip · 31/01/2021 10:05

Being against one vaccine does not make you anti vax though. Denying a relationship between grandparents and grandchildren over a decision that only affects their health, is manipulative and disgusting. Imo

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