AIBU to think it’s ok to put kids (4 and 1) into kids club on a ski holiday

[Needallthesleep]

Obviously not this year! Planning for the future.

DH and I love to ski, and given what a shocker this year has been for holidays (plus we have a newborn so not like we can go away anyway) we are planning an epic one next year.

It would be the first time going skiing with our kids, and are planning on putting the 4 year old into ski school and the 1 year old into kids club so we can ski.

For context we are looking at doing 14 nights in a very kid friendly hotel in France with childcare on site. We are planning a 2 week break so that we (and the children) can have some relaxed days together at the pool/sledging and me and DH still get a decent amount of time skiing.

MIL thinks that’s mean. And I am wracked with mum guilt about our plans now. Are my plans unreasonable?

My kids are with us on a family holiday. That's why it's called a family holiday. Clue is in the name. Farm the kids off to a relative they know and fly out for your ski holiday as a couple maybe? You would get peace and quiet to relax. Book three weeks instead of two. Make the most of it.

None of my DC would settle at a crèche. Good luck with whatever you do.

I didn’t ask for your opinion, the OP did ask and I answered her question. I said ‘I wouldn’t leave my 1 yo’ and gave reasons why not.

Taking your children with you on a trip (to South America or anywhere) and spending quality time with them, letting them experience different cultures, foods, environments is very different to me than leaving a baby with strangers in a foreign (in both senses of the word) place for long periods of time. Dump your kids on randoms as much as you like so you can have fun, I think its unreasonable to leave a 1 yo in a kids club which is what the OP asked.

Not that it’s any of your business but our trip to South America was ‘for’ my kids to meet their extended family in two countries and the family to meet them. It was also a wonderful way for us to explore new cultures, food, environments together. I actually like spending time with my children.

This thread goes to show how different families are. I wouldn’t dream of leaving my child behind in the uk and going away without her, but happily put her in childcare (uk nannies run) on a skiing holiday as a toddler then childcare and ski school from age 3.5. We all love it. We have time together at breakfast then meet up mid afternoon and do stuff and chat about our day then dinner and early evening together. Totally different from not seeing her for a week!

I do think it's too early to make this decision now. You just don't know how your then 1 year old will settle into new surroundings. Both of mine would have taken the 2 weeks or even more to get used to new surroundings and people at that age. They would have hated it. I personally would wait till they are older and can go to ski school together. Have a nice family holiday next year that you can all enjoy together. Ultimately it is your decision though not your MIL.

4 year old left in a kids club where doesn't know anyone? 1 year old even worse.....Cant believe any child would think that was fun! Would probably make them really anxious. When parents say their baby loves nursery/going to kids clubs.....do they really? Family holiday is a family holiday.Personally I would never put them in a kids club....not something to be palmed off when dont fit in with your lifestyle.

I agree with your MIL, but there again my daughter is about to have her first - I would be seething if she even thought of leaving a baby in a creche / kids club with strangers while she buggered off to enjoy herself! Why even consider taking the youngest, leave baby with MIL and enjoy your holiday safe in the knowledge that baby will be safe with family. Or do you trust a stranger more than your MIL?

@Elaine1985

I agree with your MIL, but there again my daughter is about to have her first - I would be seething if she even thought of leaving a baby in a creche / kids club with strangers while she buggered off to enjoy herself! Why even consider taking the youngest, leave baby with MIL and enjoy your holiday safe in the knowledge that baby will be safe with family. Or do you trust a stranger more than your MIL?

So parents are only allowed to enjoy themselves if child is with the MIL? Says more about jealousy of the MIL...

If all go on holiday and kids clubs or creche is used they also have time to all enjoy the snow etc together and spend afternoons and evenings together. And if kids club doesnt work out they can review while there.

@Elaine1985

I agree with your MIL, but there again my daughter is about to have her first - I would be seething if she even thought of leaving a baby in a creche / kids club with strangers while she buggered off to enjoy herself! Why even consider taking the youngest, leave baby with MIL and enjoy your holiday safe in the knowledge that baby will be safe with family. Or do you trust a stranger more than your MIL?

That seems pretty controlling to me. As long as their child is safe and cared for, parents have every right to enjoy themselves; they're still human beings.

‘Seething’ gosh that’s a strong word.

When parents say their baby loves nursery/going to kids clubs.....do they really?

Yep - they really do. My adult children will tell you our best holidays were our ski holidays. If you choose a good firm then the childcare is superb. And it's a real bonding experience because everyone gets time to relax in their own space.
As a single parent, I found some holidays quite hard work whereas one week's skiing got us all energised and balanced again.

@OllyBJolly

When parents say their baby loves nursery/going to kids clubs.....do they really?

Yep - they really do. My adult children will tell you our best holidays were our ski holidays. If you choose a good firm then the childcare is superb. And it's a real bonding experience because everyone gets time to relax in their own space.
As a single parent, I found some holidays quite hard work whereas one week's skiing got us all energised and balanced again.

Well, who knows really? My son aged 6 months went to daycare in the chalet hotel 5 hours a day for a week while we went off to ski. The fully-qualified, English staff took him out for buggy trips and to play in the snow and the room itself was equipped with lots of toys and clean, brightly-coloured soft cushions. He didn’t cry when we left him, they told us he seemed happy, never called us to collect early and he greeted us at pickup with a huge smile and slept well at night. He’s now 4 and has no memory of that trip but loves to hear our stories of how we took Baby Hisname on that holiday, and look at the pictures. That is enough to reassure me that he was happy, and even if he wasn’t, it’s had no lasting effect.

When parents say their baby loves nursery/going to kids clubs.....do they really?

Well the other day when I said we were getting ready for nursery DC2 (not yet 2) clapped and said "nursery nursery nursery" over and over whilst dancing around. I'm pretty sure she likes it! As much as you can tell very young children like anything to be honest.

When parents say their baby loves nursery/going to kids clubs.....do they really?

Yes, they do

As very keen skiers, our DD was booked on her first skiing holiday before she was born! Go for it. Our DD put skis on when she was about 2.5 and had her first lessons the following year at 3.5. She loves ski-ing.

Couple of things we found

• the French creches we tried were very regimented; even 7 yr old were expected to nap in the afternoons - eg, Club Med

• French ski schools are similar, especially ESF. If there are any french-speakers in the group, only french is spoken type thing

• we found the best child friendly ski care and classes in Austria and Italy. They really seemed to want the children to love ski-ing and would go the extra kilometre to promote that

• 2 weeks is too long; separate weeks is the way to go, even though it's more expensive. The 4 yr old will be knackered even if she loves if, and if she doesn't. it's a long time away from home.

• splash out on a family suite in French hotels - french hotel rooms are not usually as big as those in Italy & Austria and you'll need the space. Remember your one year old may be walking by then

• find a hotel near other things to do, eg skating, toboganning

• Use ski travel companies whose USP is family ski-ing holidays, not ski companies who can accommodate children. The best we found was Ski Familie and Mark Warner. They were the best at integrating the ski-ing and child care and everyone has kids. They were also the best at providing fun things to do in the afternoons after ski-ing in the mornings, not just colouring and film watching. happy to share companies I wouldn't touch with the proverbial barge pole.........

• borrow kit where you can, eg ski suits, snow boots

• don't take a non skier on a ski-ing holiday - they'll be so bored. The hotel empties during the day and they're not really able to join in the apres ski banter. Also if the idea is for the non skier to provide the child care - see comment about french hotel bedrooms and you'll have to take toys, games etc which you will not be able to borrow from the hotel creche - don't believe them if they say you will. The creche staff will give a very firm 'Non!' at the very idea. Remember there's not much to do in a ski resort if you're a non skier, especially for 2 weeks

sorry - that's more than a couple of things, but we've been a loads of ski-ing holidays over the years and have learnt the hard way....

Just gone back and read some of the comments about childcare on holidays etc

Even on her first ski-ing week, we all went ski-ing together in the afternoons so we had plenty of family time. Not every day as she was tired. She was in ski school in the morning as we believed she was better off being instructed properly, rather than us teach her our bad habits. One of my proudest moments was watching DD aged 6 parallel ski-ing behind DP.

Ski-ing is the ultimate family holiday - we would have been ski-ing back in March last year with DD and she's 21. And I know of many families where parents and adult 'children' ski together long after the family beach holidays have fallen by the wayside.

@DPotter super helpful info!
No my post, but thank you as it will help me to look at other companies beyond Crystal who I've been using for my last 2 couple ski trips.

You're very welcome @Belle1983.
Crystal weren't bad actually but once you've experienced a really good company it's difficult to go back.

I used Esprit Ski when the DCs were small. They were excellent. I'd probably recommend chalets over hotels when they are young just for the space. (The Esprit chalets we were in were not stand alone - they were like apartments within a building with the creche and kids club on ground floor.)

I’m always curious as to why people start threads like this.

You’re never going to get an endorsement of your action. And, in fact, you’re going to get lots of people making you feel much, much worse about it.

OK, it’s good to get a range of opinions. But many of the opinions are given so unkindly, that it can hardly be helpful.

And surely you just end up doing what you were going to do all along, except now with an added layer of guilt.

Just go skiing. Break the days up so that the kids aren’t at ski school / daycare every day, all day. In other words - the sort of amended holiday that we all have to take when we have very young DC.

And then enjoy. And don’t ask on Mumsnet ever again!

I've used Esprit and Mark Warner and also stayed in a kinderhotel in Switzerland. it's fine. But I would say a week is enough, and mornings only in childcare. The children really like being with you in the afternoon. Now mine are older, they are much better skiers than I am, and it's so much fun skiing with them. Although they spend most of their time laughing at me, and whizzing off down the slope.

(I had to cancel my skiing holiday last year, and haven't booked one this year....).

@PlanDeRaccordement

I wouldn’t personally because I think 1 is too young to be put in kids club. But part of that was the fact I worked FT and so if I did that, a holiday would not be a holiday for my child? It would still be daycare for the child. No real difference. Also I tended to want to have my children with me when on holiday because I wasn’t with them in the days normally due to working. So if you are a SAHM, then I can understand you doing it more than someone in my situation.

Agree with this.

Find it odd that if they're in FT childcare, that you want to put them into childcare again on holiday.

Haven’t read the full thread but read quite a few posts and just thought I’d post our experiences.

Ours kids are 8 and 10 and have been skiing every year since they were born. My son was on skis just after his second birthday. The investment of bringing them when they’re young really pays off. They are brilliant now, we should have been going this year and I think it would have been the year where they overtook me!

My DH has done a few winter and summer seasons with Mark Warner, and we have holidayed with them. Yes it’s full of pre and post uni kids doing their ski seasons but they’re pretty well run. However my DD hates kids clubs and always has (she didn’t go to nursery) but my ds has always been generally fine in them. We have tried different things- local nursery was horrendous and we ended up pulling them out after a couple of days and forfeiting the skiing. Local nanny from an independent company in the resort worked best for us. They can come to your chalet/apartment and then play with them, they can have naps, they bring them out for walks etc. It’s more expensive but in the early years we maybe did that 2 or 3 times in a week and just didn’t ski together the other days.

Ski school - morning lessons has worked best for us. It gets you all up and out and keeps the timings of the day and meals running well. Last year I messed up booking the lessons and we had them in the afternoon and it buggered the days up. We had no motivation to get up and out, we would end up having a late breakfast which means the kids weren’t hungry for lunch before the lesson but then we’re hangry after so needed snacks so then weren’t hungry for dinner etc etc

Use an English ski school company. We go to Morzine and use easy2ride, all the instructors are either English or speak perfect English. All the other kids are always English or Irish too so they make some friends. BASS are good too.

I would say 2 weeks is too long. I’d do a week or 10 days max. They will be exhausted and if you have very cold or bad weather it can be hard to entertain them. One year we had freak freezing weather and it was painful to even walk outside for a potter around the shops or for a crepe etc.

Def bring them young, you won’t regret it in the long run although holidays for the first few years won’t be as they were pre kids! But it’s an investment that pays off.

Find it odd that if they're in FT childcare, that you want to put them into childcare again on holiday.

Sometimes I want time just for me. As an adult, by myself or with my husband. We get virtually none of that.

The judgement on this baffles me. Do people never spend leisure time away from their children? Why is it different because you’re in a different country?

Most people who go on skiing trips are fortunate to be able to afford more than one holiday a year, so it’s hardly as though children are missing out.

The judgement on this baffles me.

It's MN. Don't worry, SAH mums are getting even more abuse. Anything that posters feel remotely jealous about brings a completely ridiculous amount of nastiness.