To be a bit jealous of over 50 holiday bookings

[Toomuch2019]

I probably am but here goes

I was reading an article about surges in over 50s holiday bookings driven by the fact that they are anticipating getting vaccinated soon.

And I'm finding myself incredibly envious that there is a subset of the population that will be able to go about living normally and going abroad while the rest of us are locked away waiting for a vaccine.

I don't feel like I can plan anything holiday wise at least abroad right now as there is no timeline on vaccines for under 50s and I don't want to risk getting ill in another country. Particularly if insurances will only cover vaccinated people (which isn't the case yet but can see it moving in that direction).

I know there is no answer and obviously I'm not arguing vaccines aren't in right order but does anyone else feel wound up with articles like this rubbing it in?

www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/business-55654127

I am hoping that bookings are on the provision that it includes all. Not just people that are vaccinated. Otherwise yes I will be mightily fucked off and I think it will cause a big problem on further adherence to the rules. I can’t imagine there would be a rule that if you are vaccinated you can do as you please. That seems insane.

I also feel jealous about all these people getting the vaccine

Me too! I'm eligible for one because of my job, but there have been no appointments available at any of the 6 hospitals I could go to. I've been on the booking site several times a day since last Thursday, as have many colleagues, and I've yet to hear of anyone managing to get an appointment.

The booking website is used by social care/health staff across 2 counties and a city, and it's an area with a lot of residential care homes, so demand is very high. I'm 65, so I wouldn't be surprised if I get an appointment for my group 5 vaccine sooner than my group 2 one.

Does it really make a big difference to travel though, given that being vaccinated doesn't prevent you from transmitting Covid, just from getting ill?

I wish people would read the sodding article and not just the headline message that OP has posted.

fizThe elderly have too many benefits and breaks compared to the rest of the population, that has long been the case. Your average seventy year old is NOT paying off the war debt!! Goodness gracious.

I actually said in my post they probably paid off the war debt for most of their working life.
Supposing a 70 year old starting working at 16 (1966) and retired at 60 (2010) then I think they would have paid towards it for 40 years of their working life....?
Is that wrong? (I believe it was paid off in 2006)

@Icanseegreenshoots

The NHS covid wards are mostly full of older people. Cancer patients including those that are young are having their surgery cancelled to make way for more covid patients. It is misleading to suggest the under 30s are currently filling the hospitals, because they are not.

The elderly can not be blamed for the situation, of course it is not their fault but that is what is happening. Fact. And we need to pay for it - all of us and not just the young.

The average age of Covid patients in ICU (which is where the pressure is) 60. The state pension age is 66. These are people of working age.

The very elderly (80+) aren't even getting put on ICU in many hospitals.

And while the U-30s may not be filling the hospitals, because they generally don't get very ill with Covid, they have had a much higher rate of infection than other groups in recent months, so that age group is a significant vector of infection.

Actually that was a knee jerk reaction for me (and yes I haven't read the full article) I guess different tiers have been allowed to do diff things. But my concern is ultimately if it's one thing for one and one for another the virus is going to keep on going. Will now go and read the full piece! (am just moody coz I have two kids and trying to work)

@Fizbosshoes

fizThe elderly have too many benefits and breaks compared to the rest of the population, that has long been the case. Your average seventy year old is NOT paying off the war debt!! Goodness gracious.

I actually said in my post they probably paid off the war debt for most of their working life.
Supposing a 70 year old starting working at 16 (1966) and retired at 60 (2010) then I think they would have paid towards it for 40 years of their working life....?
Is that wrong? (I believe it was paid off in 2006)

You're right, @Fixboss

@Lurkingforawhile

And wasn't the news article about the coach holidays recently released which have been booked? I'm guessing the demographic for those is mainly only 50

It was about over 65s.

I'm in my 50s, no idea when I'll get my first vaccine, no matter about my second one. My parents in their 80s with serious underlying health issues have have their 1st vaccine this week but no date for their second.

I certainly haven't booked any holidays. I am looking forward to seeing my parents who I haven't seen since last summer but in the meantime, like many people in their 50s, I'm working in a full time senior and demanding job while trying to home ed kids, one of whom has autism.

Life of Riley it isn't. I am so fed up with the casual ageism on mn.

I guess the thing about ageism, is that those ugly enough to spout it, will reap what they sow. They will teach their children ageism, and then be subject to it.

I am 50 nearly 51 and have no clue over when I am likely to be vaccinated. And even if I knew I would have a vaccination by a particular date, it doesn’t mean I can travel, it doesn’t mean FCO advice will be updated, it doesn’t mean other countries will open their borders for me and it doesn’t mean I will be able to find suitable holiday insurance.

So yes you are being petty and unreasonable to think over 50s are all off planning holidays. I do have something booked for at the end of the year, but it was only booked because it is fully refundable and I have less than 50% confidence that I will get there.

Also nobody has been following rules for my personal benefit, I have barely left the house since March and am doing my bit as much as anybody else is.

Is that wrong? (I believe it was paid off in 2006)

You're right, @Fixboss**

The last war debt was paid on 9 March 2015 apparently. I always had 2006 fixed in my head for some reason.

I'm mid 50s and haven't bothered to renew my passport, as I can't see any reason to go abroad this year.

@Fizbosshoes

fizThe elderly have too many benefits and breaks compared to the rest of the population, that has long been the case. Your average seventy year old is NOT paying off the war debt!! Goodness gracious.

I actually said in my post they probably paid off the war debt for most of their working life.
Supposing a 70 year old starting working at 16 (1966) and retired at 60 (2010) then I think they would have paid towards it for 40 years of their working life....?
Is that wrong? (I believe it was paid off in 2006)

I'll start that again!

You're right, Fizzbosshoes, it was 2006.

I started work in 1972, so I was paying towards the war debt for 34 years. By the time I get my pension in August, I will have worked for 49 years. In that time, as well as the war debt, I have been paying towards the pensions and health care of the generations that came before me, and the child benefit, education, infrastructure, welfare benefits and everything else for several generations that come after me.

And I don't resent a penny of it (well, maybe the bit spent on contracts handed out to friends of the government who then fail to deliver lol), because I consider that to be an important part of the social contract.

The other important part of that contract is that society as a whole takes care of its vulnerable, including the elderly.

I'd like to know what "breaks and benefits" old people get that the pp you quoted would like to do away with. Bus passes, perhaps? The half-price shampoo & set that pensioners can get on a Monday, when the salon would otherwise be empty? Free prescriptions? That saves me a princely £105.90 a year, less than the tax I pay in 2 months on my tiny occupational pension.

Covid has one unpleasant and largely unreported side-effect. It's brought a lot of nasty ageism out into the open.

Tinsel you're probably right I wasn't very balanced. I didn't reference the other 50% (who are obviously more happy with the risk than I am) or the multigenerational groups.

On the latter front all I can see is articles like this encouraging more booking because people worry about scarcity so more of it happens. I fully expect as soon as my wider family is vaccinated (mixture of older and healthcare) I that I'll start getting pressured to book group family holidays / meals out because they are ok.

And so I'll have to both miss out because I'm not happy to take the risk for myself and simultaneously be fallen out with for doing so.

@Icanseegreenshoots

There is a growing feeling in the country well before covid that the elderly have had all the benefits of rising house prices, jobs for life and tripe locked pensions and the young have been left out in the cold - paying huge university bills that were free for previous generations, they are finding that owning a house is a pipe dream and the cost of living is crippling. In real life many young people feel aggrieved at the injustice, and I don't blame them.

Where are all these poor youngsters?

All my adult kids ranging in age from 23 to 36 are in professional jobs and are home/car owners.

Yes, they paid for university (with a lot of help from us) but then they got their heads down and worked bloody hard to get their careers on track, as did we at their ages.

We have worked all through the pandemic and at 60 don't consider ourselves old, vulnerable or in need of shielding.

We shield our elderly parents and shop for them and take them for vaccinations and hospital appointments.

We have two holidays booked for 2021 and if we can we will be going.We are entitled to a life just as much as the younger generation, we have worked damned hard for it.

@Hadjab

Pensioners paid off the debt incurred in fighting World War 2. Debt gets passed down the generations, that's how it works. The 50-something generation will be paying income tax for a good 15-20 years yet and no, the vast majority will not have final salary pensions

@SanFairyElla thank you! I’m 50 and I don’t know anyone with a final salary pension

Quite. Frankly the 50 somethings are likely to be some of the biggest taxpayers over the next 10 years. I don’t know anyone in their fifties with final salary pensions or looking at a particularly luxurious retirement this side of 70. I am paying more tax than I ever have and I’m now providing employment for others. I don’t begrudge a penny of my tax bill but I resent the implication that hitting the big five-oh means we are suddenly a drain on society!

The optics will not be great if lots of pensioners jetting off on holiday leaving the young to pay the bills unvaccinated who’s “paying the bills” exactly? Not the 50-67 year olds? What about the 65+ who contributed to society including “paying the bills” for decades?

cheltenham I guess you would think that if your kids have had easy effortless access to lots of money from you! It wouldn't be so hard to get through university - buy cars and houses if your parents are bankrolling it all!

I think we are mostly talking about the vast majority of the young people that do NOT have access to Mummy and Daddy's coutts account actually.

You sound detached from reality quite frankly.

The last war debt was paid on 9 March 2015 apparently. I always had 2006 fixed in my head for some reason

You made me doubt myself, @SusannaSpider, so I did some googling and everything I found said 2006 for the war debt to the US, eg

"Unlike the American debt accrued during WW1 this 50-year loan at 2 per cent was finally paid off in 2006, albeit after several suspensions" www.historyandpolicy.org/policy-papers/papers/covid-19-and-the-uk-national-debt-in-historical-context

Maybe we borrowed from other countries as well. Or maybe some careless person has used "debt" when they mean deficit.

"There is a growing feeling in the country"

Please don't speak for the country.

Over 50 here and just booked a holiday, but holiday is in October when hopefully things may be able to go ahead...
PS I wouldn't describe myself as elderly either...

The rules aren't going to change for vaccinated groups any faster, though. When foreign travel is allowed again, it will be allowed for all based on herd immunity. I think booking holidays at the moment - unless you have the promise of a full refund in case of cancellation - is a silly thing to be doing.

I am over 50 - you are welcome to my foreign travel and holidays. I am lucky as I don't need either to make my life complete.

I'm feeling bad for posting now. I didn't mean to start such an angry fight.

It has made me think a lot so thanks to those who posted that IABU, particularly as jealousy of those who are vulnerable is not a nice emotion, I accept that.

I guess what I was looking for was some shared empathy "yes it's crap isn't it, I get why you are riled, the bbc shouldn't be publishing things like this as it is sh*t stirring. But don't worry one day this will all be forgotten". Thank you to those who understood what I meant and that I wasn't trying to antagonise things. But I can see that was shortsighted and should have seen where it would go.

I'll leave the thread now as I understand IABU.

@LakieLady

www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-30306579

We aren’t one homogeneous lump, y’know! If I go away, it will be when restrictions allow, and will be in the UK.

We’re all in this together!