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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

AIBU to think this isn’t murder

271 replies

AldiAisleofCrap · 13/01/2021 21:30

AIBU to think this is really wrong. In America four teenagers break into a house , the home owner fires a gun and one teenager dies. The boys age 17 are charged with murder and sentenced to 55 years in prison.
The judge said done one has to be held responsible but surely the teen who is dead is responsible for his own actions.

OP posts:
Aloethere · 13/01/2021 23:01

I can't believe people are saying this is fair. These are 17 year olds who are now going to spend their lives in prison for breaking into a house. And yes depending on what happened exactly I think the man who did the shooting should be charged. Breaking into a house should not equal a death penalty.

I place pretty high value on human lives and I don't think it should be taken lightly. Someone being afriad that their tv would be robbed does not give them the right to execute somebody. Tvs can be replaced, the boys life is gone forever. I didn't read an article about this so if this man was threatened with his life then possibly I could understand him taking someone elses.

ivfbeenbusy · 13/01/2021 23:01

Their collective actions and decision to
Beak into someone's home (especially in America where right to defend your home and carry your own weapon is sacrosanct they were doubly stupid) led to his death.....so whilst being labelled a "murderer" sounds harsh they are responsible for his death

Original poster
AldiAisleofCrap · 13/01/2021 23:02

@HerMammy oh really , I am pleased. I hope he has a productive life.

OP posts:
WeAreShiningStars · 13/01/2021 23:02

They would have been convicted under felony murder rules, a justified finding.

LizFlowers · 13/01/2021 23:04

It is harsh, many of the sentences dished out in the USA are unbelivable. However, in view of their ages, the boys will probably have a lot of rehabilitation and be paroled in a few years.

LochJessMonster · 13/01/2021 23:05

@Goldieloxx

Or maybe if civilians didn't have guns no one would have died. There's no point applying logic to the US justice system, they have the death penalty for goodness sake so can't be classed as a civilised country
Or the intruders could have been violent and the innocent homeowner would have died.

I’d much rather the criminal was dead.

LochJessMonster · 13/01/2021 23:07

@Coyoacan

I think the USA must one of the most uncivilised places on God's earth.

They need a criminal justice system where the accused has access to a decent defense lawyer.

I actually commend the US for allowing their citizens to feel safe because they can defend themselves in their own homes.
Aloethere · 13/01/2021 23:11

I actually commend the US for allowing their citizens to feel safe because they can defend themselves in their own homes.

Seriously? Would you really kill someone over a wallet or a laptop? How many burglaries here end up with them killing the home owner? They aren't interested in hurting you, they just want your stuff. I'm not saying that is ok but I am saying it isn't a crime that should be punishable by death.

FilledSoda · 13/01/2021 23:11

I watched a documentary about women in jail for murder and one was a young women that lured a man to a location on the pretext of selling him drugs and going on a date ( he told his family he was going on a date ) . She led him to a secluded spot and left him with her two friends who attempted to rob him . There was a fight and he ended up dead , I think they shot him . Anyway she was found guilty of murder for her part and sentenced accordingly.

EngTech · 13/01/2021 23:12

Right to bear arms and defend your home

MustardMitt · 13/01/2021 23:12

I listened to a podcast recently, it was about a case where a police car sped through an intersection, killing a woman in her car. The man they were chasing was charged with her murder.

Ridiculously, they’d pulled him over minutes before and ascertained that he was not guilty (a pissed off friend had reported him for theft). The guy didn’t even know he was being chased until the accident happened - and it happened before the first officer who pulled him over didn’t update the report.

There is so fucking much about US law and order that is just nonsensical. I don’t think we’re the pinnacle of justice or anything, but the stuff that comes out of America is horrifying.

Saz12 · 13/01/2021 23:15

But I absolutely wouldn’t feel safe just because I had a gun.

The idea that “someone died, so someone else has to pay” is a ludicrous basis for a “justice” system. The outcome was foreseeable, which should have been a deterrent to the criminals, but to lock 17-year-olds up for 55 years in this instance is appalling.

ElizaLaLa · 13/01/2021 23:16

It’s a a very sad life of children’s life. I do think there should be consequences, but that does not fit the crime of juveniles breaking and entering

It's a good deterrent though 🤷‍♀️

CharlotteRose90 · 13/01/2021 23:16

Fuck me if that’s their rules I’m glad I live in the uk. That’s actually disgusting those kids didn’t murder the teen the person with the gun did. That judge has taken their life’s away.

LimitIsUp · 13/01/2021 23:16

I've reported this thread to ask HQ to check for sock puppetry. Perhaps there isn't any going on, but for the sake of my own peace of mind I would prefer to believe that there is only one avenging harpy with multiple user names, rather than there are actually lots of people, who walk among us, who think this is okay

UndertheCedartree · 13/01/2021 23:17

Eh? I don't think anyone was guilty of murder. The homeowner may be guilty if he used more than reasonable force to defend himself. Did he really need to fire a gun against a group of teens? But the gun culture in the states makes no sense to me, anyway. It is very sad all round.

LochJessMonster · 13/01/2021 23:17

The only person that is disadvantaged by the ‘stand your ground’ law is the person breaking in.
If they aren’t happy with possibly being shot/killed - don’t break in. Very simple.

LochJessMonster · 13/01/2021 23:18

@UndertheCedartree

Eh? I don't think anyone was guilty of murder. The homeowner may be guilty if he used more than reasonable force to defend himself. Did he really need to fire a gun against a group of teens? But the gun culture in the states makes no sense to me, anyway. It is very sad all round.
4 men breaking in to your house and you wouldn’t fear for your life?
SchrodingersImmigrant · 13/01/2021 23:22

Sorry, but 4 17 year olds do look like 4 adult men, especially considering the adrenalin. As if they broke into your homes you would be correcting people into "boys, not men". Even outside of my home, if I was approached by 4 17 year old in a threatening matter, I would be looking for defence weapon🤷🏻

Yeah, it is quite OTT but I can see the hint of the logic. Though 55 years is a lot.

BooFuckingHoo2 · 13/01/2021 23:23

Sorry but if four men (and let’s be honest here I’m sure the man in the heat of the moment wasn’t able to identify their ages) broke into my house in the middle of the night I’d be absolutely fucking terrified and if I had a gun I would open fire to protect myself and my family, bearing in mind in the US I have no idea whether the robbers have a gun or not.

I’m shocked at the people saying it was “just a home invasion”, can you actually imagine how terrifying it must be to have four men who may be carrying guns break into your house in the middle of the night?!

Harsh sentencing but they knew what they were doing and should be held responsible for the death of their friend, although I think manslaughter would be more appropriate.

BooFuckingHoo2 · 13/01/2021 23:25

I've reported this thread to ask HQ to check for sock puppetry. Perhaps there isn't any going on, but for the sake of my own peace of mind I would prefer to believe that there is only one avenging harpy with multiple user names, rather than there are actually lots of people, who walk among us, who think this is okay

Can you really not stomach that your opinion might be in the minority?

chomalungma · 13/01/2021 23:25

When you think about all the reasons why someone may be part of a gang who break in - there are potentially many reasons why that teenager ended up breaking in to that house. Yet if it was 'the system' that led to such events, life events etc - they are not put on trial and they are not sentenced.

Someone commits a crime. They end up dead. Who is responsible for that death?

TheLisbonSisters · 13/01/2021 23:26

I don't agree with this but would also be interested to know if they have this law in Washington and if so whether the Capitol building invaders will be charged with murder and if not why not.

LochJessMonster · 13/01/2021 23:27

@TheLisbonSisters

I don't agree with this but would also be interested to know if they have this law in Washington and if so whether the Capitol building invaders will be charged with murder and if not why not.
Someone upthread said prosecutors were looking to charge them with felony murder for the death of the policeman. Would be interesting to see if it happens
chomalungma · 13/01/2021 23:28

I wonder how many parents on here would be happy if their teenager ended up as part of a group - and then someone in that group pulled a knife and stabbed someone?

And then their teenager was jailed for 20 years because of collective responsibility?