To refuse to go back to the office

[tillytalks]

I’m currently on mat leave and due back to work on the 15th March.

I work in an office with 12 other people.
At present everyone is in the office.

There is no reason why people can’t work from
home, and I’m pretty sure the reason is that management are the type that wouldn’t trust staff to work at home.
It’s a family run business and the owners are quite precious.

I’m really careful, I don’t mix, I follow the rules to the letter.

I’m 34, have mild asthma and I also have a high BMI (more than 30 but less than 40)
I’m working out and eating well so I’m hoping this will reduce.

Even still, I just don’t feel comfortable sitting in an office all day with 12 other people.
The office isn’t big. It’s a long room, and although we can distance, I feel like it would still be crowded.

I know that I wouldn’t be given any preferential treatment to work from home, but I haven’t asked so can’t be too sure.

I’ll be working 3 days per week and my son (who will be 13m) will be in a nursery.

I’m also aware that my son being in nursery puts me at risk which is something else I’ve been thinking over.

AIBU to not want to return?

@TitsOot4Xmas

But I know my job can be done from home, as can most of our jobs in my office.

None of the 12 in your office are doing it though? That doesn’t strike you as maybe hint?

@TitsOot4Xmas

That’s not because the job can’t be done from home.
It’s because the boss of the company doesn’t want people to work from home.

Please please join a trade union. Everyone should join a union.
No you are NOT unreasonable. If you can do your job from home, you are doing the country a favour. Don't listen to the judgmental twats here x

@HeelsHandbagPerfumeCoffee

I really have not.

I have consistently said I don’t want to return to the office and stated my reasons.

I’ve had responses that suggest I just don’t want to work or that I want to work at home because it’s easier.

I’ve stated I’d be happier going back into the office if it was on a rotational basis (opposed to all staff being in)

My overall feelings toward this is that I’d rather not go back in. Not because I don’t want to work, but because I want to minimise my risk.

If you read all of my posts you will see I have said this all along.

@Unusualusernames join a TU absolutely however that in itself doesn’t change guidance
it’s simply not as you describe. Just because you don’t like or agree with guidance doesn’t mean op just unilaterally does what she wants

Yep, YABVU. You don’t get to choose; it’s not up to you. It’s up to your employer.

If they want you back, you either go back or you resign/are fired. It’s really that simple.

In first post: Management are the type that wouldn’t trust staff to work at home

But at 21.38: The employer doesn’t have a concern about me personally working from home

Which is it OP?

And bearing in mind you've said that you've not yet actually asked them, how do you know that the employer doesn't have a concern?

*22:33 emilyfrost

Yep, YABVU. You don’t get to choose; it’s not up to you. It’s up to your employer.

If they want you back, you either go back or you resign/are fired. It’s really that simple.*

Sigh. It’s not “up to the employer” really. The government have advised those who CAN work from home SHOULD.

Why are people so odd. She’s concerned for her health...I’m not sure if you’ve noticed there’s a pandemic? Op is stating she CAN do her job from home so she should wfh

@emilyfrost

Yep, YABVU. You don’t get to choose; it’s not up to you. It’s up to your employer.

If they want you back, you either go back or you resign/are fired. It’s really that simple.

Sigh. It’s not “up to the employer” really. The government have advised those who CAN work from home SHOULD.

@SnackSizeRaisin

I think you’ve mixed some posters up there.

I didn’t advise the OP speak with their GP.

I didn't say you did - I quoted a post, didn't tag you in it. Think you are a bit confused yourself...

Sorry if I was not clear - I suggested OP speak to GP about managing her anxiety regarding her perceived high risk. Having a telephone consultation about mental health could help OP and is not against lockdown rules.

@Puzzledandpissedoff

In first post: Management are the type that wouldn’t trust staff to work at home

But at 21.38: The employer doesn’t have a concern about me personally working from home

Which is it OP?

And bearing in mind you've said that you've not yet actually asked them, how do you know that the employer doesn't have a concern?

@Puzzledandpissedoff

It’s both!!! They don’t trust staff to work from home.
It’s not a concern with me personally (as in it’s not just me they won’t allow to work from home)
it’s all staff.

@tillytalks I would just give up on this thread. People are just determined to be pricks to you on here

Good luck with the employer/chat with the union

The guidance is work from home IF YOU CAN. Do it depends if you can do YOUR job from home.

Whilst people think some office jobs can be done at home, sometimes they can't. I'm not just talking about the provision of a lap top or computer, it might be a need access to written documents/files. The employee might not have a printer/scanner/copier at home etc. Various reasons.

If other employees are busy doing their job it is unreasonable for the person who WFH to say just copy this for me or do that etc. Some days WFH might work but not all days.

Your employer should ensure there is sufficient space between and a whole list of requirement of must do/not do and lots of offices have those arrangements in place. What makes you think your employer doesn't?

OP said she's vulnerable due to her weight and asthma, but is still sending her kid to nursery, so is prepared to take that risk.

I have read the full thread and I think you’ve been clear and consistent. I have heard from various people that some businesses in certain sectors are insisting on a full return to the office even when targets and outcomes from the last lockdown showed employees can work from home just as effectively. That said, it’s their legal right and if the office is covid secure, it’s up to them if they think you need go br there for business reasons.

Sigh. It’s not “up to the employer” really. The government have advised those who CAN work from home SHOULD

SHOULD, not MUST. ;)

@TitsOot4Xmas

Sigh. It’s not “up to the employer” really. The government have advised those who CAN work from home SHOULD

SHOULD, not MUST. ;)

The employer is still required to adhere to guidance. The burden of proof in a civil claim is much lower.

There are always posters on these threads whose responses are based on a thinly-veiled contempt for wfh.

The same old arguments come out with such regularity it's bingo time:

• other people are going out to work, so there's no problem with you going too. Some people have to go to work in mines or on oil rigs where the environment is inevitably more risky than an office or a supermarket - would you say it's ok for office and retail workers to be exposed to similar levels of risk when it's completely unnecessary?

• very few people work from home well properly / few jobs can be done. Biased opinion that doesn't seem to be supported by research.

• people who want to wfh always think they are just as productive (implication: they're lying slackers). Maybe they are?

• if your employer wants you in, you'll just have get your arse into the office. This one is logical, but depressing to see so many posters unquestioningly take the side of employers.

• wfh is bad for people's mental health. Yes, and it's better for others' MH. Or makes no appreciable difference.

• incorrect legal comments stated with cast-iron authority.

Op has been consistent from what I can see, and unless she's lying or deluded she ought to be wfh.

Ought to be isn’t a category. It’s a wilful misunderstanding of the recommendations

I'm using ought in its usual sense.

If it's being used specifically wrt some category of Covid rules or guidance and I've used it here incorrectly in ignorance, then I apologise but I'm certainly not wilfully misinterpreting anything.

Your employer is appalling. It’s old fashioned control freakery.

Most office work can be done from home. I would ask your employer why you (in fact why all your colleagues) can’t wfh in light of the guidance?

What SPECIFICALLY are the barriers and what needs to be done to address them?

@ParlezVousWronglais

Your employer is appalling. It’s old fashioned control freakery.

Most office work can be done from home. I would ask your employer why you (in fact why all your colleagues) can’t wfh in light of the guidance?

What SPECIFICALLY are the barriers and what needs to be done to address them?

So what happens to the work that can’t be done from home? Just forget it? In our case this would mean patients not getting letters and consultants not getting referrals. Or new staff not being able to prove their identity in person thus risking patient and staff safety. Or staff having disciplinary and sickness hearings on their own over video call, because their union rep and the manager couldn’t be with them. Is that (and more) all fine because “most” office work can be done from home? Maybe the nurses can do all the on site paperwork - not like they have anything else to do.

Sigh. It’s not “up to the employer” really. The government have advised those who CAN work from home SHOULD.

Chipsandchesses It’s guidance, not law. So yes, it is up to the employer.

Who has suggested just forgetting work that can't be done at home?

We're discussing work that can be done at home.

Op you still haven’t answered the question re childcare if you were working from home, would you still use the nursery (which seems to be a bigger risk than the office) or would you expect to work and supervise/entertain your baby simultaneously?
I know parents of older children are in that position but for very young children childcare is still available but it’s not clear whether you would intend to use it?

@emilyfrost yes, and the employer should follow those guidelines. Or do you not agree?

[quote Chipsandchesses]@tillytalks I would just give up on this thread. People are just determined to be pricks to you on here

Good luck with the employer/chat with the union[/quote]
@Chipsandchesses

Thank you.