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Original poster

Do I have a right to be angry about this? (Trans related)

999 replies

Nc109283485 · 07/01/2021 13:09

Nc for obvious reasons. This is a very personal issue to me which I am understandably sensitive about, so this may be why I feel this way. I am perfectly happy to be told I AMBU! I believe trans people deserve love and respect and a happy life just like everyone else. So why did this concern and anger me?

I have a condition called vaginismus which has been very traumatic and caused me lots of grief over my life. In my eyes it is a very personal and female problem. (Look if up if you're not sure what it is).

I have tried to join a support group on a social media platform to really get to the bottom of it and sort it out. I wont say which one as dont want to 'out' either myself or the group involved. My request was pending and a message sent. I assumed this was to confirm I definitely suffer from this condition and to make sure I wasn't some strange pervert, but no! The administrator messaged me to say that before I was accepted I would have to answer a 'test question' as this is a gender inclusive group. Will I be addressing group members as 'ladies, men or everyone'. The tone felt quite aggressive and if I did not pass this test I would not be admitted.

My first thought was are men allowed to enter this group? Do I really have to speak about my vagina in front of 'everyone'? Why not say hello ladies (and the occasional transman who currently has issues with their vagina) no I have to address everyone? Wtf?

I honestly don't know what to think right now but this group clearly isn't for me. But maybe I just need some re-education?

OP posts:
Funneth · 09/01/2021 18:46

*toxic

Ereshkigalangcleg · 09/01/2021 18:48

Expecting women to bend to the will of others and think about others at all times is a thoroughly toxis expectation.

Totes "inclusive" though!

Ereshkigalangcleg · 09/01/2021 18:51

"Inclusive" peeps! Don't you think it's a bit dodgy to call pregnant black women "black birthing bodies"? Doesn't sound at all like a white plantation owner speaking in times of antebellum slavery, or anything.

DifficultPifcultLemonDifficult · 09/01/2021 18:51

And yet 100% of people who have periods are women, were always women and will always be women.

OK, my view is that transmen have periods so I'm not going to agree with this statement. You won't change my view and I won't change yours so I'm not going to discuss that aspect further.

However taking your view into account the study still needs to be clear.

All women? Just those who have periods? Just those within a certain age group? There are many aspects of this that would change the study.

It may be 1 in 10 people who have periods, but 1 in 100 people or 1 in 50 transmen. Its totally dependent on who they asked, which will be explained somewhere i assume.

Ereshkigalangcleg · 09/01/2021 18:54

OK, my view is that transmen have periods so I'm not going to agree with this statement. You won't change my view and I won't change yours so I'm not going to discuss that aspect further.

Quite. Not all opinions are equally valid though. Paris is not the capital of Spain, however someone might wish to insist that is.

Ereshkigalangcleg · 09/01/2021 18:57

You appear to completely miss that many problems with periods can be a sex-based political issue due to the disadvantaged position of women as a sex class, as much as a random personal one. But I guess that's more of the "faux confusion".

Ereshkigalangcleg · 09/01/2021 18:58

And for the lurkers, which is the only reason I'm engaging with certain people here, this is a handy link:

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3145470-Break-it-down-for-me

DifficultPifcultLemonDifficult · 09/01/2021 18:59

Imagine if I was born male and transitioned to be a woman (that'd be fine of course) then went on to develop prostate cancer and joined a support group and insisted that nobody uses the words 'guys' or 'men', do you think I'd be welcomed with open arms

I have no idea, but there should be an inclusive group for such issues, definitely, and if you were to find one then you shouldn't have to accommodate those not wishing to use inclusive language.

DifficultPifcultLemonDifficult · 09/01/2021 19:01

Quite. Not all opinions are equally valid though.

Very true.

Nameitychangity · 09/01/2021 19:03

@DifficultPifcultLemonDifficult

Imagine if I was born male and transitioned to be a woman (that'd be fine of course) then went on to develop prostate cancer and joined a support group and insisted that nobody uses the words 'guys' or 'men', do you think I'd be welcomed with open arms

I have no idea, but there should be an inclusive group for such issues, definitely, and if you were to find one then you shouldn't have to accommodate those not wishing to use inclusive language.

I would be very very surprised if such a group existed or will ever exist. Men just wouldn't put up with having their language and very existence erased.
Whatwouldscullydo · 09/01/2021 19:06

If prostate cancer UK posted asking for black erectile disfunction bodies they'd probably be sued.

Ereshkigalangcleg · 09/01/2021 19:07

I have no idea

Let me give you some links to men's charities so you can wonder no longer about whether this is common practice in the area of men's health:

https://prostatecanceruk.org/about-us/ad-men-we-are-with-you

www.theoddballsfoundation.com/pages/about-us

orchid-cancer.org.uk/

www.yourprivates.org.uk/

DifficultPifcultLemonDifficult · 09/01/2021 19:07

You appear to completely miss that many problems with periods can be a sex-based political issue due to the disadvantaged position of women as a sex class, as much as a random personal one. But I guess that's more of the "faux confusion".

I'm not confused at all, there are many things that would change that, or any, study, which will be explained in the study itself.

I know the difficulties women face, I am one, I have daughters.

I also know the struggles trans people have.

Ereshkigalangcleg · 09/01/2021 19:08

I know the difficulties women face, I am one, I have daughters.

You see, I now have no idea what you mean by these terms.

Ereshkigalangcleg · 09/01/2021 19:10

You could be male. You could have any number of male children.

DifficultPifcultLemonDifficult · 09/01/2021 19:13

Let me give you some links to men's charities so you can wonder no longer about whether this is common practice in the area of men's health

I don't wonder about it, its not something that effects my life at all, and if, for any reason, it did, I would deal with it by setting up an appropriate group if I couldn't find a suitable one, thanks anyway.

I would be very very surprised if such a group existed or will ever exist. Men just wouldn't put up with having their language and very existence erased.

Given the rise in people coming out as trans I would imagine that, at some point, there will be inclusive groups set up for associated issues. I would be more surprised if that didn't happen.

DifficultPifcultLemonDifficult · 09/01/2021 19:15

You could be male. You could have any number of male children.

Very true, I would say ciswoman but I know that's an offensive term on here. See how I changed my language to suit my audience and not cause offence. Easy, wasn't it.

Ereshkigalangcleg · 09/01/2021 19:17

Do you think this obfuscation is helpful? No amount of "I think men are women and women are men if they say so" obscures that women are being prevented from articulating their sex-based concerns in a coherent way. It's misogyny. We wouldn't allow it to happen to any other disadvantaged group. It's the complete opposite of inclusive. The language is positively Orwellian.

Moonbabyskalimba · 09/01/2021 19:18

Nobody should be excluded from a support group that discusses medical issues. It doesn't matter who you are. If you have that issue, you are entitled to be in the group. If you post in the group and you do not have that issue, all the group has to do is politely explain that the group is unable to help with your particular health concern and refer you elsewhere with best wishes.

Is it really going to cause you difficulty to write something than "hello ladies"? Last time I checked, no one uses that phrase on MN.

DifficultPifcultLemonDifficult · 09/01/2021 19:20

Again, its a Facebook group that we are talking about here. A facebook group run by a trans inclusive individual. Do you think its right that the op wants to join a trans inclusive group and change the rules and language? Do you think any transpeople in the group who are struggling and have found support should fuck off to make the op more comfortable?

Ereshkigalangcleg · 09/01/2021 19:21

Gender identity ideology "by the mere act of saying I am the opposite sex, I am so" has little to no basis in fact.

Whatwouldscullydo · 09/01/2021 19:21

When words have meanings you dont have to try and remember where you are and what that word means in that senario.

If someones sick and dying of prostate cancer the last thing they need to do is check every support groups glossary of terms to voice what should be obvious.

Ereshkigalangcleg · 09/01/2021 19:23

Do you think any transpeople in the group who are struggling and have found support should fuck off to make the op more comfortable?

No, I think they should stop making women walk on eggshells when discussing their own bodies and the exclusively female health condition the group purports to address.

Ereshkigalangcleg · 09/01/2021 19:24

And again. If sex and gender are different, what's the issue with "female"?

Quaagars · 09/01/2021 19:25

You see, I now have no idea what you mean by these terms

Oh, give over.