Would DH be unreasonable to split his time with his DC?

[Beabfl]

I have two children with DH (toddler and pre-schooler) and he has three older children from a previous relationship ages 7.5 - 10.

Due to circumstances beyond our control we lost our home and have found ourselves having to live in a one bedroom studio type flat on a temporary basis. This could be for 6 months or it could be 12+

This flat consists of two main rooms, the living/kitchenette area which is one space and then one bedroom.

To be truthful it is suffocating, for both us and the kids. 5 children being crammed into one room to eat/sleep/play in is just not sustainable.

It gets overwhelming for everybody, not just the adults.

DH came up with the suggestion that he have the boys come on one day and then his girl the following day, considering they won't be in school for the foreseeable.

Do you think it's unreasonable or a fair suggestion?

I know your question wasn't about where to live, but "London" is already a big concept. Is he set on living in a particular neighbourhood cause I think with £2500 you can find something better that is still London. Cause in many cases it takes longer to travel within London than it takes from ex. Hertfordshire to central London. I can also understand your husbands reluctance to move to a different area. But the situation is still new (?) so maybe he needs a bit of time to mull over the whole living arraingement thing.

Anyways, any of the suggestions are not crazy. It all comes down to talking with the mum. If she wants to keep the current set up, then so be it. Or she might have suggestions.

@Beabfl

Personally I think you might need to think about moving outside of London - you say you can't because of DSC but the quality of the living conditions you're providing for them isn't great and 6/12 months is a long time to do this and I suppose it could conceivably be longer. Plenty of parents do move further away from their children after a split and still see them regularly. You can of course move back when things improve

I did say similar to DH but he won't hear of it. He believes that moving out of London will damage his relationship with his children and they'll see it as a form of abandonment (regardless of his consistent contact)

Sadly this means me and my DC get the shit end of the stick, so to speak, but I do understand him not wanting to be far away from DSC.

As it stands, they spend one night per week here but come for their tea twice.

He doesn't want to reduce the contact, just mix it up, so they're still coming for the same amount of time but on alternate days.

I think this is wrong entirely. London has some of best transport linkages in the UK and therefore perhaps if you slightly further out he doesn’t then need less contact with his children eg my SIL lives in Essex it’s not long to London by train. Or you could even stay in London but go more suburban ( depending on where you stay just now). Or move further into the east.

It sounds like a really shit situation for everyone.

Are you receiving DLA for your son? And the carers element and disabled child elements in UC? Just want to make sure you’re getting the right benefits. If you’re not claiming DLA then please do as it will also remove the benefits cap. Have you check the local housing allowance rate for your area for a 2 bed (which should be what you qualify for) it would give you an idea of how much you’d get on your UC as a housing element.

Is it possible for you and the younger ones to maybe stay at your parents 1 night a week to give your DH and the older kids some space?

You can self refer to the social services children’s disability team and ask for an assessment for your son and also yourself as his carer, hopefully they can then also help with the housing situation.

But the dsc mum didn't decide to have two children with a man who already had 3. OP did. Her husband also decided to have two more children, bringing his total to 5
No but I could say she decided to have children in a relationship that wasn’t going to last couldn’t I? But why would I when it would be as irrelevant and unkind as what you just said.
She’s not the person worst off in all this, and nobody “chose” to be living like this, least of all OP and her young DC.

Why isn’t it an option to stay with his family?

OP, if you left him what would that mean for you and your DC in terms of housing, support, benefits?

Tbh you're dh was selfish in having another 2 dc when he had existing 3 children to care for and inadequate accommodation even with a 3 bedroom house. Does he even pay maintenance? It was reckless behaviour on his part. I agree with pp that he has a duty to care for his dc as he shares parental responsibility its not childcare its them seeing their df.

Having more children isnt a problem. It's the attitude of "well because we have new children, we dont have space for his old children and we dont get a break so why should she".

You were overcrowded beforehand, now you're even more overcrowded and refusing to move somewhere more affordable. It is just shitty, selfish parenting.

£2500 rent pcm?! I rent out a 2 bed house with a small garden in one of the outer boroughs for less than half that! That is crazy. You don't need to "leave London", just look in cheaper areas, with transport links in mind. If you're renting anyway, you can move back in a year if finances improve. Do it now while you're not stuck because of school.

Some suggestions:-

• YHA do nice family rooms & have games rooms etc cheaper than a hotel & more space
• DH goes to see them in their own home
• DH visits his parents overnight with his older children occasionally
• the children come visit but go home to sleep (all their stuff is there)
• you visit your family with children when they visit

I don't imagine it's any fun for the older children to stay over - especially not in winter.

Good luck with finding a new place - I reckon contact council to see if they can help you.

Ok so short answer is you're stuck with it for the next few weeks and months and you all need to get through with your mental health intact.

Chucking some ideas at you - maybe all stuff you've considered

• stop thinking of it as a studio flat. It's a one bed flat with a small kitchen. Physically having space to sleep all 7 of you is better than the alternative.
• make every single bit of use of that separate bedroom. Set it up as a daytime TV room if you can find a second TV or use a laptop, or use it for play or reading in the day.
• We swear by a written routine, especially in lockdown. Long walk with Dad before lunch (or divide and conquer), film after lunch, get toys and activity books out, pack away before tea. If you are up to it, set timers so when the beep goes off it gives a warning to change activity. Even children who you can't explain a routine to will learn it and take reassurance from it.
• Put up a photo of your smaller family, and one with step kids in too. Each night and morning, talk to your toddler and show him which family he'll be with the next day. (While you're at it, do him an album with his favourite people and things, and drink, park etc if he doesn't have one.)
• Force some change into the day to break it up. Maybe the older ones could stage a takeover of your room at 3 or 4pm for screen time when no one's napping.
• Don't feel trapped in your room until everything's packed away. As soon as they are awake, airbeds can be deflated and walked on and they could swap into your bed if they are not ready to get up.

There is no denying it's a bloody awful position to be in, in lockdown, but the parks are open, there's a LOT of stuff on TV/YouTube and you are just going to have to get through one hour at a time.

Some very good suggestions above thanks!

To answer some Q's and clarify a few things:

Our rent isn't 2,500pm. That's the amount we had to pay up front to move in (deposit and rent in advance)

We currently pay 1,100pcm rent.

The bigger the property here the bigger sum required upfront. Whilst we could afford to get this place in a hurry for the sake of having a roof, we couldn't afford anything bigger and won't be able to for a while.

We can't stay with his family because his local relative is ECV and has been shielding for almost a year. That aside, they just don't have that kind of relationship.

We can't stay with my DM because she lives in a residential home.

I'm not currently receiving DLA no. DS was formally diagnosed in December. I do plan on applying.

Prices for 3 bed houses in this area of London range from 1,600 - 2,500 but almost all have a 'no DSS' policy.

I've looked on the outskirts for reference and there is definitely much cheaper to be had, but DH won't move far out.

To be fair we don't have the money to move anywhere yet anyway so we'll be here for the foreseeable.

I forgot to add that there is no resolution regarding my OP as DH decided not to call his ex and discuss changing the arrangement after all.

I just could not live like it. I would move outside of London to a cheaper area and then he might get his kids for a week at a time or longer over summer holidays. He could also get train back to see them every other weekend for the day.

Definitely worth contacting the council for advice, even if it's just to see if they have a scheme to match tenants on benefits to private landlords who will accept (Bromley has one).

'Nothing to do outside of London' is a ridiculous excuse and not one you should allow him to make. Firstly it puts his needs before those of his 5 children, secondly he has 5 children and doesn't need to be 'entertained' like some toddler. Seriously, I feel for all of you, but the situation can be helped, but he is refusing. He chose to have 5 children so he needs to take responsibility.

Op are you renting? Could you really not have found a 2 bed flag to rent!?

Flat*

Um, I'm sure that if a 2 need flat was an option at the time, they would have taken it.

OP, I'd think hard about your husband's attitude here. It's all about what he wants, not the family. It may be worth exploring housing for just yourself and the kids out of London.

@lavenderlove

I think possibly unreasonable as then their mum doesn't get a break at all, however she could be fine with it if you asked.

Access isn’t to provide a break. When does OP get a break? It sounds like purgatory, isn’t overcrowded housing still illegal?

No but some mothers who initially deny their exs contact with the children often change their mind when they need child care/cover for a night out.

Just go OP. I remember you from previous posts. He's never going to budge. You and your kids would be better off presenting as homeless and taking whatever the council can give you. He's honestly not worth it. I don't know how you haven't broken already.

Splitting up his contact time is not going to solve your problem. Living further out and having EOW but with adequate space would but he won't consider it. So leave. Get yourself housed further out and start again. The outskirts of London are hardly Mars.

Would I even be able to present as homeless though? This place is in both of our names and the council have a record of me living here (council tax)

We're in no arrears and the landlord has no reason to want us out so is very unlikely to issue notice to leave.

Even when somebody is given an eviction notice the council's advice is to stay put until it gets to the stage of bailiffs, leaving voluntarily before that level of enforcement is deemed to be making yourself intentionally homeless.

In some ways it would be easier if the landlord did want his flat back because then the council would have a duty to help.

Does your landlord know you've regularly got 7 people staying though? He/she could well be violating the terms of the mortgage...

@Beabfl

Would I even be able to present as homeless though? This place is in both of our names and the council have a record of me living here (council tax)

We're in no arrears and the landlord has no reason to want us out so is very unlikely to issue notice to leave.

Even when somebody is given an eviction notice the council's advice is to stay put until it gets to the stage of bailiffs, leaving voluntarily before that level of enforcement is deemed to be making yourself intentionally homeless.

In some ways it would be easier if the landlord did want his flat back because then the council would have a duty to help.

If you leave him, it doesn’t matter any more what the joint family home arrangements were. At the point that you’re single, with children (and actually jobless currently, is that right?) then you need somewhere to live for yourself and the children that you can afford and at that point you won’t be intending to share with him much longer. So then you’re your own entity (with DC) and can seek help and advice as a single woman with a family.