Moral obligation to have the vaccine. Is one of us being selfish?

[FLOrenze]

We are in our mid 70s and are both very fit. We have strictly observed the rules from the beginning. The on-line calculator says we should be due for the vaccine in February.

DH says he won’t have it yet so that someone further down the line can be vaccinated. I think we have a moral obligation to vaccinate.

His view is that we we only go to the supermarket, we wear masks and wash our hands. I think that even though we have minimal chance of catching the virus he should protect me before others.

@Belladonna12 you have a great deal more faith in the organisational abilities of the NHS Machine than I do - I personally think they couldn’t organise a piss up in a brewery so I think it’s much more likely that vaccines will go to waste.

The right to bodily autonomy and informed consent is important.

That said, it's obviously better if people make that decision because the evidence is that it's beneficial.

Piling on morality is never persuasive. You stand a better chance by pointing out the logistics make more sense for him to accept when offered. Sometimes people also need a bit of quiet space to revise their opinions.

[quote Dyrne]@Belladonna12 you have a great deal more faith in the organisational abilities of the NHS Machine than I do - I personally think they couldn’t organise a piss up in a brewery so I think it’s much more likely that vaccines will go to waste.[/quote]
It's not just the NHS who will be giving a vaccine . Anyway , I used to work in the NHS and know many people who still do. I am perfectly capable of organising a piss up in a brewery and I would say the same for most of my colleagues.. I'm not saying that OP's DH shouldn't get vaccinated but I'm not fussed if he doesn't as I know plenty of people who are at least as vulnerable as many people in their 70s and are well down the priority list at the moment.

I wont refuse the vaccine but I am mobility impaired, dont have transport and can only stand for short periods without pain. So standing in line is a no no for me unless there were wheelchairs available. I have not yet heard anything about the logistics of how they plan to roll it out to the many people like me who cannot stand and queue.

I don't think it is right to equate morality with health and medical treatment choices. Medical consent is an important freedom which should not be compromised. That is not to say I disagree with vaccines, though.

I'm 55 and will take the vaccine when my turn comes. My 2 younger kids are teenagers. I want them to have a good chance of living without the worry and restrictions of a contagious illness. I've had alot of my life and so have people older or abit younger than me. Everyone has the right to choose but fir ne it's about the bigger picture.

But someone is the last of the day... there would still be one vaccine left over at the end of the day....logic?

They aren't going to find out about it at the last minute though. They can either phone someone up and see if they want to come in all they can use it on somebody who works at the surgery.

Technically both of you are being selfish - ie putting your own view above the others.

Vaccines are not mandatory and he is well within his rights to decide he doesn't need it.

Also, if OP DH gets an appointment they can just phone up and say they don't want it at the moment and they will give it to someone else who will be equally as vulnerable. It doesn't mean it's going to get wasted.

Yes, I think he should take the advice of highly qualified medical staff, shocking isn’t it?

As someone whose dad lived until he was 89 in his own home with numerous health conditions and caught Covid and died last night within four days of testing positive after the someone brought it into the previously Covid free care home he was in respite in, don't take chances.

It's too late to change your mind when you've got it.

Ironically dad's vaccination was scheduled for this late. Just a week or so too late.

@Amylou30 you need to start your own thread in the pregnancy topic. I t will just get lost here. You will get support and advice there.

@Belladonna12

Also, if OP DH gets an appointment they can just phone up and say they don't want it at the moment and they will give it to someone else who will be equally as vulnerable. It doesn't mean it's going to get wasted.

They can 'just' phone up and say they don't want it at the moment?

It's not a hair appointment or a car service!

Do you think everyone else should be shuffled around to accommodate someone who's 'just' decided they don't fancy being vaccinated this week. Perhaps they'll decide when they do want to be vaccinated and be gracious enough to tell the NHS when they'll be attending.

It's in everyone's interest to be as cooperative as we can be s vaccination programme and not cause needless disruption to it.

@Neenan

As someone whose dad lived until he was 89 in his own home with numerous health conditions and caught Covid and died last night within four days of testing positive after the someone brought it into the previously Covid free care home he was in respite in, don't take chances.

It's too late to change your mind when you've got it.

Ironically dad's vaccination was scheduled for this late. Just a week or so too late.

I'm so sorry.

Urgh...I know a man in his Seventies being really irresponsible re covid risks...
He says ''I'm fit, active and not overweight and eat healthily...And have never smoked''

So he travels to other parts of Country, and has get- togethers as normal.

He will not listen to the fact that AGE itself a risk.

Do you think everyone else should be shuffled around to accommodate someone who's 'just' decided they don't fancy being vaccinated this week. Perhaps they'll decide when they do want to be vaccinated and be gracious enough to tell the NHS when they'll be attending.

The DH won't be in line for vaccination this week. By the time he is invited, I do think he will be able to phone up and cancel or change as people do with the flu vaccination.

He must take it. Just because you think you won't get seriously ill with Covid because you're otherwise fit and healthy for your age doesn't really count when it comes to this thing - the hierarchy has been determined around known risk.

Having said all that, I do not believe anyone should be pushed or made to believe they have a moral obligation to do so, if they do not want to for whatever reason.
I don't believe he should be forced to take it but he shouldn't be allowed to think that not taking it is the moral choice.

@sneakysnoopysniper

I wont refuse the vaccine but I am mobility impaired, dont have transport and can only stand for short periods without pain. So standing in line is a no no for me unless there were wheelchairs available. I have not yet heard anything about the logistics of how they plan to roll it out to the many people like me who cannot stand and queue.

It'll be like the flu vaccine - no one will expect you to stand in pain waiting for your shot. There'll be shelter and chairs available and extra help for those who need it, just like always.

Everyone can decide whether they want the vaccine, or any vaccine or any medical treatment or procedure. No one should have any moral obligation to inject something into their body for the benefit of anyone else.

You can be as 'fit and active' as you want, but like it or not an over 70 is physiologically more likely to suffer ill health, with or without Covid.
You are more likely to have undiagnosed cancer, diabetes or hypertension. Your organs aren't functioning as well, your blood vessels are narrowing and hardening etc etc. You don't feel or look any different but you absolutely are.
No-one should be forced to have a vaccine they don't want, but shouldn't be under any illusion about increased individual risk due to age.

@Godimabitch

Everyone can decide whether they want the vaccine, or any vaccine or any medical treatment or procedure. No one should have any moral obligation to inject something into their body for the benefit of anyone else.

FFS. Yes they have the right to refuse, but it is a moral choice.

Putting other people at risk of death because you want to be a prat is an (im)moral choice.

"No one should have any moral obligation to inject something into their body for the benefit of anyone else."

Pre lock down I would have agreed. People are facing joblessness, homelessness, children have gone without adequate teaching and therapies. People have died because of lock down, suicide rates are up. Some businesses will never recover.

We have sacrificed a lot in the name of Public health. Everyone needs to play their part and many older people can do that by getting the vaccine, so if they get Covid they won't take up a hospital bed.

@Ponoka7

Everyone needs to play their part and many older people can do that by getting the vaccine, so if they get Covid they won't take up a hospital bed

Yes, but still the right to body autonomy should prevail

[quote trulydelicious]@Ponoka7

Everyone needs to play their part and many older people can do that by getting the vaccine, so if they get Covid they won't take up a hospital bed

Yes, but still the right to body autonomy should prevail[/quote]
Well yes it should - but I doubt anyone who refuses the vaccine will refuse hospital treatment for Covid-19. So it stands that for the good of themselves, their loved ones, their community and the NHS they have the vaccine that's offered to them.