To let her fail her GCSEs

[Newpuppymummy]

My 15 year old (y11) is doing basically no revision. She’s laying about doing whatever she wants despite all my best efforts to motivate and help her.

I have offered to sit with her, help make a written plan is, help test her r on things and she’s just not interested and resists everything.

Part of me feels like I want this more than her. I don’t know whether my best option is just to leave her to it and learn the lesson that you have to put work into things to get good results. This goes against my normal parenting strategies but I am at a loss with her.

Some kids just have to fail at school and take the consequences before they get their shit together to find something to invest in.

It’s ok if that’s her path, that’s what she’s here to learn.

@Newpuppymummy

Wow so interesting to read all the different responses.

Money wouldn’t help here. She’s not motivated by money at all.

Of course I have talked to her about it a d discussed what will happen if she doesn’t revise. She’s not naturally academic. If she tried it would be 5/6 grades. If not she may well end up with 3s.

I do wonder if the people saying I need to make her revise/be stricter have teens themselves? I can’t make her revise...impossible. I’ve offered help and she doesn’t want it.

I think the pandemic has had a huge impact on her motivation. I’m not surprised I’m just sad for her that she won’t reach her potential

What would she be motivated by?

If she's not naturally academic, that's a different kettle of fish, because she's not going to be fighting for the type of jobs that look down on resits.

Does she have any clue what she'd like to do as a job?

@Brainwave89

Two years ago I had the same issue with my youngest son. He is bright, but simply did no work, and spent most of his time playing FIFA. My DH was all for frog marching him to study, which we tried with very limited success. I sat down with him and said that at 17, he is almost an adult, and he is accountable for his own decisions. However, he is also accountable for the consequences of those decisions and those can be serious. This initially had a limited impact and he got much poorer results than he was anticipating. We sat down with him again and we were clear we would do everything we can to support him. He decided to resit, alongside working in the local Co-Op. This time under his own steam and with tutor support he worked hard and he got excellent results. I think he learned from the error first time around. My learning would be that kids need to take accountability for what they do and it will take individuals time to take on this accountability.

This.

@Porcupineintherough - through very gentle persuasion, I guess. By assuming that she wants to do well and is not doing it due to some motivational block. Find out what it is and a way around it. Make revision easy by giving plenty of breaks and treats. That sort of thing. "Make her do it' was badly phrased. It sounded like I was suggesting force, which wouldn't work. What I meant was - don't give up on her as easily as she is giving up on herself because we can see the repercussions and she can't.

@Labobo thank you for explaining.

OP does your dd have a clear idea of what she'd like to do next and what she needs to get there? Would it be worth exploring her options going forward?

I was like this as a teen OP, but as soon as I got my first mock results back and failed it terrified me and kicked me into gear! After that I was determined not to fail any exams again, I revised and put 100% in. Just let it run its course x

@Aalvarino

Dont count on her being able to go to college to re-do GCSEs. Generally, and with the exception of maths and English you get one shot at them. I still wouldnt force her but I would clearly explain the consequences.

why would you let your child create even more obstacles? It's all very well for people to say 'let them fail, they'll learn something from it' but the economy may still be tanked when they're trying to land a job, and getting average/below average grades will be used to filter people out.

GCSEs aren't everything and sometimes mucking them up motivates some people to do better at A level

Not true any more

There’s loads of a levels you can’t do without maths and English. Some a levels need a set grade to even be considered to do that.

Things have changed

Please ignore the posters telling you to let her fail. Anecdotes from posters who took their GCSEs 20? years ago are irrelevant. As has been pointed out - things have changed. GCSEs enable the next step, and as some of the more sensible posters have stated, doing badly at them does close a lot of doors.

A lot of school 6th forms only do A levels and don't allow GCSE retakes, and the student then has to go to the local 6th form college for retakes.

I think she needs to understand the implications of doing badly at GCSE.

@Ginfordinner a bit of an assumption saying that posters took their GCSE's 20 years ago!

There are huge implications nowadays when failing GCSE's but the fact is you cannot force a teenager to revise and do well.

It was a pure guess @Newstart20.
I am aware that you can't force a teenager to study, but you can explain the implications of not doing well.

I went through all of this with DD when she was doing her GCSEs, so I completely understand the OP's frustration. I also understand that most 15 year olds aren't emotionally mature enough to be aware of how important GCSEs are for the next step, and how having to retake GCSEs alongside studying for A levels/BTECs is a lot of work.

I know you've had lots of replies since my earlier one but I'm wondering what it is your DD spends her time doing and if she has any idea what she'd like to do next year?

How would she respond if you were to say you'd like the two of you to sit down with a takeaway/similar treat tomorrow night and have a look at course/apprenticeship options for September? It may be that she isn't accepting your help with revision because she doesn't need it but it could also be that she doesn't really know what/how to do. By making a very specific offer to look at courses etc. and fixing a date to do so, it might be easier for her to agree to. The fact it's not directly linked to school work may also help. Identifying and applying for what she wants to do next year may help to motivate her to get the 5/6s in subjects she needs in order to access those opportunities. If all that's needed is a 3 (and retakes for English and maths are built into the course) hopefully it'll help you to feel better about her not achieving her full GCSE potential but still being able to progress to the next stage of her education.

The problem with my DS is arrogance...and the assumption that he'll pass anyway without doing any work. He is bright, but bored by school, sick of this year, no interest in any particular A levels or career.

He will probably scrape fairly shit passes in most subjects. And will be angry and disappointed, but will still believe he can get through A levels with no work or effort. At this point he'll come unstuck.

We have talked til we are blue in the face about how decent grades give you more choices and options in life. He understands this but still won't buckle down to doing anything.

You do realise OP they learn all day in school plus doing their normal homework. For most this will be enough to pass.

And yes the mocks are usually what gives them a good kick up the arse

@Ginfordinner

It was a pure guess *@Newstart20*. I am aware that you can't force a teenager to study, but you can explain the implications of not doing well.

I went through all of this with DD when she was doing her GCSEs, so I completely understand the OP's frustration. I also understand that most 15 year olds aren't emotionally mature enough to be aware of how important GCSEs are for the next step, and how having to retake GCSEs alongside studying for A levels/BTECs is a lot of work.

But as people have pointed out, that doesn’t necessarily work.

All you’re really saying is you had a kid who responded to discussing the implications of not working.

Works for some and not for others. Depends really why they’re not motivated.

The idea that somehow GCSEs were less important 20 years ago is laughable frankly.

"The idea that somehow GCSEs were less important 20 years ago is laughable frankly."

I can't speak for 20 years ago but I can for 35 years ago! Most DC didn't do O levels, they did CSEs. Then went onto Tech for training. A few did O levels, A levels and then Uni.

You could certainly get onto the bottom rung of an ultimately well-paid job at 16 without a single O level.

So, 35 years ago, O levels were less important for the majority of the population.

However, now that so many jobs need a degree (even if gained on an 'EE' A level result entry...) you pretty much do need those GCSEs.

Although my friend's son has just got into a low ranking uni doing something vaguely media'y with 3 or 4 failed attempts at English and Maths GCSE, and a cobble together of other level 2 and 3 qualifications.

20 years ago was 2001 long after o’levels were abolished.

I did the last year of o levels. If you were doing o levels then they were every bit as important as GCSEs are now. And, in the days before grade inflation, they were harder to get top grades in. You needed a minimum number to get into top unis, and in certain cases, a minimum grade in certain subjects.

"I do wonder if the people saying I need to make her revise/be stricter have teens themselves? I can’t make her revise...impossible. I’ve offered help and she doesn’t want it. "

Yes. I have teens and have been on many threads helping people with difficult teens, teens who don't want to study.

One option is to take a very firm but fair harsh line. Gently sit them down and say this is not ok, so for the next 3 weeks we're going to do a/b/c.

I’d not blame you for leaving it, but I would try more with her. If she doesn’t get 5 good GCSEs she might not even get in to college to do a vocational course- and then what will she do?

Keep trying, try as many methods as you can, including asking her what she thinks will happen if she doesn’t get good GCSEs, ask if she’s struggling and needs help or what job she thinks she’ll do without qualifications. Good luck.

Have this with DSD. Shes not done a bunch of art coursework apparently that she told me she had, as school rang me about it and I had no clue. Her answer? Well I don't need art anymore! Ugh. Suspect more is not done but she won't admit. Leaving her to it now, as talking to her is impossible as all she seems to care about is lying about doing fuck all.

Yes @Newpuppymummy I have teenage sons, but I was honest from the start about expectations. That was in primary school when they had homework and then in year 7 when we had full talks on pointing out we do not live with our parents. We had to work to get where we are and if you want the latest games console and all the games then you had better get a job that affords you what you want. The same applies to their phone, their house, their car, their holidays.

I put it across that I never wanted to see them unhappy, sad that they couldn't afford stuff. I only want the best for them and education is a way to achieve that. What are the stats for her school in terms of 5 GCSEs grades 9-5? The local area stats? All this is easily available. She should know it.

I know you say money doesn't motivate her but what does she spend her free time doing? That is her currency, she only gets that if she does revision.

What is her next step post GCSEs? What are her expectations? That is the talk to have with her.

I would leave her to it, the more she perceives you as “nagging”, the less revision she will do. If she fails her GCSEs, it will teach her a good life lesson. If she fails her GCSEs it’s not the end of the world, she can redo the final year and take them again.

If she fails her GCSEs it’s not the end of the world, she can redo the final year and take them again.

I don't think schools have the option of redoing year 11, and I'm not sure that 6th form colleges offer anything more than English and maths GCSEs. I am happy to be corrected.

@Ginfordinner

If she fails her GCSEs it’s not the end of the world, she can redo the final year and take them again.

I don't think schools have the option of redoing year 11, and I'm not sure that 6th form colleges offer anything more than English and maths GCSEs. I am happy to be corrected.

It could well be me that’s that wrong. When I went to 6th form they did all GCSEs as retakes.

@Thewiseoneincognito

It’s a risk but I would let her fail. She will learn the hard way and you can say I told you so.

Social media is showing kids that you don’t need an education to fly in private jets, wear Chanel sneakers, rent slick pads, it’s all filtered to make life seem a walk in the park. So many will fall victim to it, particularly given how covid will reshape the world for better or worse.

Perhaps do a video message so you can show her in a few years if she is struggling to find decent work that you tried and she didn’t listen.

Ugh, really? A video recorded 'I told you so' saved for posterity?

That'll definitely help her self esteem and your relationship with her.....