My 16yo DS and his girlfriend (and her mum)

[workworkworkugh]

I'm going to write this in point form, I just want to get some other unbiased opinions on my son and his gf of 5 months.
Our point of view is that the relationship is not a healthy one.
We understand that at this age teens start to move away from the family unit but we feel this is above the realms of 'normal'

*she gets mad at him if she doesn't have his full attention.
*she gets mad at him if he hangs out with his mates, so he hasn't hung out with them for 3+ months.
*last time he did she dumped him.
*she cries if he's not at school
*she gets mad at him for playing his Xbox (and not answering her call on the first ring)
*he got a new Xbox for Xmas and she's already making noises about him playing it too much, also about his sport that he loves playing is starting up again soon and she's getting sad about that.
*he spends every single day with her, anywhere from 6-14hours
*it's like he feels guilty if he spends time with us so has to make it up to her
*he can't spend a full day with us as a family, not even Xmas day
*we invite her to our house and to things we're going to but she refuses
*at one point he didn't eat dinner with us for over two weeks as he was with her
*they send literal pages of gushing to each other every single day about how much they love each other and the kids they're going to have 😳
*her mum seems to encourage it (the intensity) which doesn't help
*the Mum, who is 50yo, has texted him (in reply to his messages) "thank you my beautiful James Arthur, you're so adorable" along with a kissy face emoji (not his real name obviously)

We're happy for him to spend time with her and don't stop him much, but it's getting to be too much. We miss him and sometimes want to see him too.
He seems to know it's not right but 'loves her', and I remember young love, we're only in our 30's, so we're happy to be flexible but it still feels very unhealthy to us.
We also don't want to alienate him.

So AIBU and how to we put some boundaries in place, because he clearly doesn't know how to!

Everything @DeRigeurMortis and @SpittingChestnuts said. Yes, to letting him find things out for himself but equally show him that the rest of the family have lives too and that everybody else cannot be inconvenienced by him. The more sensible and reasonable you appear, the better.

You may have to give up on the idea of having whole family days at the beach- so go with the rest of the family and have a good time. Don't rub his nose in it- have a good time for your own sakes. Don't let too much revolve around him.

As a mother of four sons, (all now adult) I would say leave saying/doing anything that first love is horrendously intense for boys, be ready to be supportive when it all goes tits up (which it will, believe me!)
The good thing about this is that at 16 it will happen sooner rather than later, ( its worse when its at 18 ) I hate to say it but young women at that age are very fickle and she will probably have her head turned by something or someone soon and your DS will be out in the cold, when it happens his mates will rally round and all rubbish the ex girlfriend in an effort to make him feel better.
Just bide your time, and get his father to talk to him, impress upon him, the importance of contraception.
As for the Mother ignore her.

She's defo OTT hopefully it will fizzle out soon. Can expect she might turn crazy when it does though.

@HazelBite

As a mother of four sons, (all now adult) I would say leave saying/doing anything that first love is horrendously intense for boys, be ready to be supportive when it all goes tits up (which it will, believe me!) The good thing about this is that at 16 it will happen sooner rather than later, ( its worse when its at 18 ) I hate to say it but young women at that age are very fickle and she will probably have her head turned by something or someone soon and your DS will be out in the cold, when it happens his mates will rally round and all rubbish the ex girlfriend in an effort to make him feel better. Just bide your time, and get his father to talk to him, impress upon him, the importance of contraception. As for the Mother ignore her.

Sorry but I think your post is very sexist.

Just because your experience is with 4 sons I don't think whatsoever this phenomenon is limited to teen boys nor that they fall harder for "first love".

Neither do I agree that the girls are more likely to have their head turned and move on to their next "victim".

Frankly your attitude to teen girls is pretty damn awful and absolutely smacks of a multitude of horrible and inappropriate stereotypes.

IME it's something that happens equally (and with equal intensity) to boys and girls.

The overwhelming factor is the maturity of the children involved - not their sex, insofar when you get two teens that are both pre-disposed to this phenomenon (usually as a result of the stage of pubescence they are at) the end result is more intense.

Where one teen is older/more mature they don't want/allow/tolerate this level of intensity over and above their other interests as thus the dynamic never establishes itself.

Just to comment on the mother OP.

There's nothing you can do but please don't feel jealous.

Truth is it's easy to be the "cool mum". You simply stop parenting at the expense of your child who never understands boundaries or responsibility, something that will hamper them greatly in later life.

IME the people who do this always have issues of their own - usually with self esteem and they use the "adoration" of their children and their friends to alleviate this and try to live vicariously through them.

Children might find these adults fun to be with at first, but it doesn't take long to find it increasingly odd as to why a middle aged man/woman wants to "hang out" drinking cider/eating pizza/chatting about "cool" music/take selfies etc with a group of young teens.

What's "cool" inevitably turns out to become pretty damn creepy over time.

Are you more affluent than this girl’s family? I have seen a case where a girl and her family really made a huge fuss of a teen that was well off.

It was all very intense for a few months, but as soon as the boy’s dad told him that if he got her pregnant there was not going to be any support/money coming from his family the girlfriend swiftly dumped him and found herself a.. girlfriend.

If this was in reverse it would be a get the daughter out of this situation so why is the same not being said for your son? She seems abusive and controlling as does her mother I suspect. Can you explain about emotional abuse to him and hopefully he will wake up to it. It is an unhealthy relationship at any age but especially in someone so young.

She sounds abusive and controlling. I don't believe that's just teens like some pp. His lashing out at you is probably the expression of frustration that he doesn't express around his gf and her mum. It's so difficult because you don't want to play into their hands. Perhaps make some observations to him or ask him some questions and see what he says. "I've noticed you only play your x-box at night now." "Gf seemed distressed by you doing your hobby. Do you think that's reasonable?" etc Get the conversation flowing, he can explore his feelings with you and knows he can talk to you about it which is important.

@LilQueenie

If this was in reverse it would be a get the daughter out of this situation so why is the same not being said for your son? She seems abusive and controlling as does her mother I suspect. Can you explain about emotional abuse to him and hopefully he will wake up to it. It is an unhealthy relationship at any age but especially in someone so young.

If someone is in an abusive relationship, regardless of age or sex it's not as simple as just "getting them out of it".

I don't think anyone has said this is a healthy relationship - quite the reverse.

However, the intensity of "first love" is a factor in creating this dynamic.

When someone is in this situation you have to tread carefully.

Going in all guns blazing to "rescue" them invariably backfires.

It simply alienates them further from you and plays right into the hands of any abuser in whose interests it is to paint you as the bad person who should be "cut out".

At 16 the OP can't physically restrain him from seeing this girl.

What seriously do you propose she does?

Any attempts to break them up are likely to result using his "new" key "kindly" provided by GF's mother and move in there where she's utterly unable to exert any influence whatsoever.

My advice would be identical regardless of the sex of the child.

This is such a hard situation. I would support him and hope that it burns out as many relationships at that age do.

I would agree whether sexist or not that girls especially are fickle at that age and they are more than likely to drop the boy, it's the age we are in now where girls want their own way and constantly want their the top priority. Sadly I have seen this several times. Just thought I would point out that the previous person was talking from experience and do am I. It appears to me these days girls can be very manipulative. Aside years ago it was always girls need protecting from boys when they are older but I am glad now it is very prominent and out there that quite often these days boys are the ones who lose out due to how girls treat them. Rant done.

@Timeforredwine

I would agree whether sexist or not that girls especially are fickle at that age and they are more than likely to drop the boy, it's the age we are in now where girls want their own way and constantly want their the top priority. Sadly I have seen this several times. Just thought I would point out that the previous person was talking from experience and do am I. It appears to me these days girls can be very manipulative. Aside years ago it was always girls need protecting from boys when they are older but I am glad now it is very prominent and out there that quite often these days boys are the ones who lose out due to how girls treat them. Rant done.

🤦‍♀️

Such a massive generation that isn't helpful to the OP.

Of course there are girls who are very manipulative...and there are boys that are very manipulative.

The sex of the child is irrelevant, it's the behaviour that's important.

The assumption (and that's what it is) that girls are more likely to assert coercive behaviours against boys is empirically unfounded.

The pressure on girls to "please" boys through sexual activity has always been and continues to be highly significant. The slut/cock tease dilemma never goes out of fashion.

In reverse, sexual activity for boys is always socially rewarded.

As the mother to a teen boy and (now adult) DSD I've no axe to grind here.

I simply find some of these posts, presumably by women, about teen girls spectacularly misogynistic in tone.

However I seem to be a lone voice in that regard.

I think you actually need some professional help with this, OP. I suspect it's beyond amateur suggestions on a forum.

Every possible suggestion made to you here has a possible and dramatic downside to it. I think you really need to explore this with someone who knows what they're doing.

A relationship like this between one of my daughter's classmates and her controlling and jealous boyfriend ended tragically. I'd hate any advice given here to rebound so dreadfully.

"I would agree whether sexist or not that girls especially are fickle at that age and they are more than likely to drop the boy, it's the age we are in now where girls want their own way and constantly want their the top priority. Sadly I have seen this several times."

So no boys ever want their own way in relationships- or do you mean that you'd judge them differently for that?

And no boys ever dump girls- or is that somehow not the same?

It's some time since my dd was a teen, but from what I remember she seems to have got dumped roughly 3 times out of 4.

Sorry I can't get past that she cries if he's not in school

I reckon the girl friend has massive insecurity and abandonment issues and maybe doesn’t have many friends. Her mother is pleased her daughter has a boy friend and so is doing all she can to encourage the relationship.
Definitely speak to your son about boundaries, this is not healthy for him.

The girl friend also needs urgent help , my dd is like this and has at last started counselling (she’s also older) although I haven’t ever been like the mother in this case .

@Timeforredwine

I would agree whether sexist or not that girls especially are fickle at that age and they are more than likely to drop the boy, it's the age we are in now where girls want their own way and constantly want their the top priority. Sadly I have seen this several times. Just thought I would point out that the previous person was talking from experience and do am I. It appears to me these days girls can be very manipulative. Aside years ago it was always girls need protecting from boys when they are older but I am glad now it is very prominent and out there that quite often these days boys are the ones who lose out due to how girls treat them. Rant done.

IME experience at 29, this is just not true.

Can you organise a trip away? Help him get some distance from the relationship and hopefully a bit of perspective?
I’d also speak to his school, does he have Personal Social education classes that could touch on healthy relationships? It’s in most curriculums. Good luck OP

Where do they spend time together? My 17yr old son and 16yr old GF are having difficulty spending time together due to the current guidelines. They seem to wonder the streets together (definitely not socially distancing from each other!)

@heatered

Where do they spend time together? My 17yr old son and 16yr old GF are having difficulty spending time together due to the current guidelines. They seem to wonder the streets together (definitely not socially distancing from each other!)

The OP is in Australia where the pandemic situation is very different to the U.K.

According to the OP they are spending their time at his GF's home.

Bear in mind it's also school summer holidays in Australia.

Whilst the GF does sound awful, to be perfectly honest OP your DS isn't coming across particularly well either. Has his behaviour changed since he got with her? Would he have said things like he "saved your house" and dictating lifts before her?

@workworkworkugh

I just want to write down my thoughts here as it helps me to get them out as I don't have many people to talk to about this, like a diary of sorts.

We're having a beach day today and told him last night we'd really like him to come, no luck, he refused. Thinks it's boring and all we do is argue with him (not true) I said ok, we'll call a truce, no arguments as we want to have a really nice day, so he told me then we're just being fake.

He told me last night that all we do is have a go at him about everything, abuse him, he hates it here, never wants to be home, he does so much to help us out (😂), we don't take responsibility for how we treat him, and two years ago we borrowed some money from him as we were unexpectedly in a tough spot, we paid him back ASAP, but he brought that up saying he's the reason we kept our house (also not true at all) and he thinks we're shit parents for telling him to start paying for his phone and that he'll probably have to start paying for our other bills too 🙄 (on his one shift a week)

This kid just got the newest Xbox for Xmas that he requested, a very expensive sports top, he goes to a private catholic school that's costing us a fortune and does make the budget tight for us, we're his taxi to everywhere, we encourage and drive him all over for his sports that he loves because we want him to do what makes him happy.
I literally do not know the kid standing in front of me anymore.

So we left him at home and he went straight to the gf's. God know what he's telling her and her parents about us!

Thanks for letting me vent 😔

How did a school child have enough to 'save your house'?

I think you are doing great job OP - he might be saying how terrible and abusive you are, but he's actually talking about how his girlfriend is making him feel. You are doing it great.
Be persistent on wanting a teeny bit of family time, wanting him to do school and sport and see friends, wanting to spend time getting to know his girlfriend (sorry, but kill them with kindness, he will 'see it' when she is with you all in a way he won't at hers). Telling him that he has a right to be happy and be treated well.

I haven’t read all the responses but I truly empathise. I was in a very similar situation with my DS when he was 17. He was in a relationship just like this where he was controlled and emotionally abused and I am afraid I still wouldn’t be able to offer you any advice. Nothing we did made any difference at all, and it was hell. He moved in with her and her abusive parents, she then got pregnant which I knew all the way along would happen. She controlled him so much, he couldn’t go to college or work and he would cut himself in desperation. Long story short, we never gave up on him and thankfully he eventually slowly saw how toxic and unhealthy it was. He is now 23 and lives back with us and has full custody of the child. He has rebuilt his life and is now looking to the future.
Sorry that was really long and I think my point really was, I seriously don’t know what I could have done differently, but it haunts me all the time. Just never give up x