To not love my parents and be jealous of people missing theirs

[ifitcouldbe]

Growing up my parents were very traditional, old fashioned in their ways. Children should be seen and not heard type thing, stiff upper lip and no affection, no saying I love you or proud of you.

My Dad was very much the father going out to work, we mustn't disturb him after work. My Mum stayed home and did cooking and cleaning. She as she will admit never played with us or did homework as she was obviously depressed. We didn't do very well at school, not naughty just struggled and that mad my Dad cross. They issued physical punishment, smacking hitting mainly from my Dad, but I did ask my mum why she let him and she said she had no choice. I'm 40 now although my parents had me their oldest child at 30.

I have a younger sibling , which they were a bit more lenient on, but second child is treated differently generally, but he is a very different personality, could just be girl / boys differences.

I'm some ways I am now very independent from my upbringing, but I did struggle as a teen keep going back "home" after moving out young, as I thought it would make me feel better, but it didn't change. A bit like not wanting to leave your abusers I suppose as it's all you know.

I now struggle with giving the love /affection thing and have personal space issues even with my young children, who I adore. I just don't feel anything for my parents.

Lockdown has been great and I haven't had to be obliged to see my parents. I'm so jealous of people missing their families. My Dad is very much family is the only thing that matters, but it's a joke the wider family couldn't care less about anyone but themselves and my parents haven't been in anyway kind. I have tried to view it as they did the best they could manage with what they know , but I struggle with that.

Anyone else feel the same? It's almost shameful with people missing their families this Christmas 😔

Lock down has been a gift for people in these situations! It's totally taken the pressure off us..
I wonder what the key is.... I guess just being similar, similar interests? Things to discuss or talk about?

I was very happy to socialise with my dp esp dm, she was great fun!! Wanted to be cheerful and Cheer others up, df could be incredible hard work but had very sociable side too, good fun, entertaining... Is this the difference?.. Dh dp would never socialise with us, even when occasionally bumping into them when out they couldn't wait to get away!
It's really weird I've never known anything like it.
I think being chatty helps but also jolly and being able to laugh at ourselves, themselves, building up family memories and being light hearted.

My parents were crap, mother buggered off when I was 8, we were both dumped on an aunt who never wanted us, my father we’d only see three or four times a year if he could be bothered. It was my in-laws who’ve become the parents I never had, today both of mine are dead I refused to go to my mother’s funeral in fact I just didn’t care she’d died, why should I, my father though I did cry at his funeral I stopped feeling guilty after a year, of not really missing him, he’d got better in the last couple of years of his life, but it’s the in-laws I love.

Another one here who feels like you, OP. Some of my friends are bereft at not seeing parents. I can’t understand it and I’m perhaps envious.

@Emeeno1

And you think that your children will never feel this way about you because you have got it `right`?

The reality is this could happen to you yet. Dont be so assured your children will not criticise you as you criticise your parents. This board clearly evidences that adult children hate their parents for all sorts of perceived abuse`. You may yet have time to understand your parents.

This.

Very few parents think they aren’t good ... or good enough... parents

But the number of LC or NC on Mumsnet prove that must surely actually be the case.

That’s not to minimise anyone’s experience. Just that some parents perception of their ability obviously doesn’t match the reality.

I can identify with this. I feel very little towards my parents. My dad particularly was cold. I craved love and affection from my mum but didn’t really get a great deal.

I'm not close to my parents either and live in a different country. I don't miss them. I'd like to see my dad, but I'm sort of relieved to avoid seeing my mum for another year. She's always been my biggest detractor, and she's only got worse as she's got older.

Since I became a a parent, I see them in a whole new light, and not a good one. I give my Dad more of a pass because he had a terrible childhood, but i don't really feel a connection to them, and they're the last people I'd call in a crisis.

@ifitcouldbe

Growing up my parents were very traditional, old fashioned in their ways. Children should be seen and not heard type thing, stiff upper lip and no affection, no saying I love you or proud of you.

My Dad was very much the father going out to work, we mustn't disturb him after work. My Mum stayed home and did cooking and cleaning. She as she will admit never played with us or did homework as she was obviously depressed. We didn't do very well at school, not naughty just struggled and that mad my Dad cross. They issued physical punishment, smacking hitting mainly from my Dad, but I did ask my mum why she let him and she said she had no choice. I'm 40 now although my parents had me their oldest child at 30.

I have a younger sibling , which they were a bit more lenient on, but second child is treated differently generally, but he is a very different personality, could just be girl / boys differences.

I'm some ways I am now very independent from my upbringing, but I did struggle as a teen keep going back "home" after moving out young, as I thought it would make me feel better, but it didn't change. A bit like not wanting to leave your abusers I suppose as it's all you know.

I now struggle with giving the love /affection thing and have personal space issues even with my young children, who I adore. I just don't feel anything for my parents.

Lockdown has been great and I haven't had to be obliged to see my parents. I'm so jealous of people missing their families. My Dad is very much family is the only thing that matters, but it's a joke the wider family couldn't care less about anyone but themselves and my parents haven't been in anyway kind. I have tried to view it as they did the best they could manage with what they know , but I struggle with that.

Anyone else feel the same? It's almost shameful with people missing their families this Christmas 😔

You should feel some thanks for your parents, because they have taught you a valuable lesson, and that’s how not to parent your own children.

I feel the same about my parents. Be kind to yourself and the only family that matters are your own family at home x

I can identify with op and @allfurcoatnoknickers - I give both of mine a pass as they both had awful childhoods, one was given away. Moved out at 18 and never looked back. I still pretend to miss them to fit in society. My mum used to hit me on legs till it bled whenever i was naughty. Dad never hit but never stopped it.

I constantly worry that my DC will feel the same about me in the future.

Disclaimer - didn't read the full thread.

I used to be close toy parents. Then we had a series of huge rows (they weren't happy about some life choices I made). They haven't been amazing grandparents either. I live in another country, which is great. Saw them 2wk in the past year. I don't feel bad about it.

I'm not jealous of others though. I'm glad that I don't have to worry or care.

I adore my Dad, but feel similar to you about my mother. She used to beat us if we didn’t do well enough in school, would tell us constantly how shit we were, would humiliate us for nothing. I don’t miss her. In fact there hasn’t been a day in my life when I haven’t longed for a mother, but she isn’t that person.

Both DH and I are the same, OP. I'm not even jealous of those with a loving parent relationship anymore, just kind of bewildered by it, it's so alien.

@ElectriPfizing I worry that my DS will feel the same about me in the future too.

But then, I think of some of the nastier things my parents did/said to me and I can't fathom doing the same to DS. I suppose they gave me a good guideline of what not to do...

I can identify with you OP.

The idea of being hugged by family is alien to me I was never told I was loved or that anyone was proud of me. I was scorned, ridiculed and constantly criticised. I was never chatted to and now that I have my own children I can see that I was quite neglected. Homework was never checked, I could never turn to ‘home’ for emotional support, it just wasn’t there. I suppressed my feelings as much as I could.

I have children of my own now and often feel quite detached and distant from them which really worries me. I tell them daily how I love them and that I am proud of them, I try to help them by pretending something similar had happened to me and how I solved the problem, all made up of course but I don’t want to ‘tell’ them what to say and do and think like it was for me growing up.

I we told through a stage of feeling sorry for my parents who grew up without emotional support themselves but I stopped when I saw hints of them treating my own children the same way. I don’t believe they would see anything wrong with their behaviour even if spelled out to them.

PIt’s a form of control too and nothing changed as I aged. I find it difficult to maintain more than a three minute telephone conversation before I get irritated or upset but mainly disappointed by their lack of interest in anything I say.

I can relate to this, although in my case my Father has now passed. it took me four years of therapy and getting to know more about his own childhood through a step-sister that enabled me to let go of what I had always hoped for. Once I let go of my idea of what a father should be, it was a whole lot easier to see him as just another damaged person whose hurt was in turn inflicted on those around him. After a long NC period I bumped into him, had a civilized conversation and managed to walk away with my head held high.

I phoned a friend and said "I've just seen my father and I didn't walk away feeling like a piece of dirt". It was such an incredible feeling.

My Mum and I worked to overcome her own lack of mothering. I told her that I'd never heard her say she was proud of me or my achievements, that she loved me, etc etc. Talking about it honestly made it so much easier between us, she even stopped sulking! Sadly, she has started to show signs of dementia and often returns to the somewhat spiteful ways she had before, so I have now to back off for my own well-being. I go home, have a cry, then she phones and is back to her reformed self, until the next blip. I've just decided today that I won't be spending Christmas with her. Having talked it through with her on a lucid day. It hurts that she's not at all bothered that I will be alone, but if she's happy, then I'm not going to put myself through what I did last year. I hope that my brother might take her over a roast dinner, but I won't ask him to. She's nice as pie to my brothers, who will spend the day with their families.

When I relayed my excitement after having encountered and 'survived' bumping into my father that day, a friend was upset having recently lost her own father. She'd have given anything to bump into her Dad. I'd like to have had a father who was worth missing/hurting over.

Letting go of your parental 'ideals'. and seeing them as flawed human beings who have missed out on an awful lot, somehow makes it easier.

There's nothing shameful about being realistic. Have a great Christmas with your loved ones.

I’m relieved DH and I won’t have to host our respective parents for Xmas this year and, tbh, it’s been lovely having them both safely shielded away from us. I know that sounds awful but I think they’re equally happy not having to pretend to enjoy their grandchildren in return for my cooking.
They were awful to us as children but, now they’re both on their own, we got stuck having to play happy families.
Covid has given us all a graceful excuse to drop the pretence.

Another one here OP. Had to listen to a friend saying how devastated her kids were not to see their grandparents at Xmas. And it’s not easy. In-laws not better either. Causing trouble and generally belligerent people. I get depressed by it so this thread is encouraging if not sad!

I am not close to my parents, they should never of had children tbh.
My dad is selffish, insecure and has always put the current women in his life over his children. My parents had an abusive relationship, he had multiple affairs, we were smacked alot as children and grew up poor, while it wasn't the worst childhood it wasn't the best. Parents divorced in my early teens after my mum had an affair and left us. We went to live with mum while dad moved abroad. I rarely see my dad and while mum lives close by I don't see her much, I don't have anything in common with her, I find her irritating and don't particularly like the person she is.
I have my own family and concentrate on being the best parent and wife I can to provide a loving, happy home.

You are clearly not alone OP and we are all in good company. For those who struggle at this time of year, I stand with you and send lots of hugs.

I think that being told 'I love you' is far less important than the feeling of being loved, considered and cared for. So many people I know of my generation (late 40s) have no experience of being told those words or indeed hugged freely and daily but we knew by the atmosphere in the home, the tone in which we were to, etc that love was there.

That is so true. Obviously some people were terrible parents, just as some still are these days, but when I was a child things were different. My parents loved me and supported me, and we are close, but parenting was different then. Parents had their own lives and didn't live through their children - the children were expected to fit in with the parents' lives, not the other way around. Parents didn't tie themselves into knots trying to entertain children, or ferry them to activities every day. My childhood memories are mainly of playing with my friends rather than doing things with my parents. They didn't constantly tell me they loved me, but I just knew that they did.

Eaglejulesk, you have described my childhood almost exactly. Truthfully, I think it was perhaps closer to ideal - if there can be such a thing - than the levels of overinvolvement and near martyrdom I sometimes see around me. I think family ties, love, support etc are important as a foundation but ultimately we all have to figure out for ourselves who we are, what we want, we have to sort of build the house around ourselves as we go. I think we should be wary of swinging too wildly in the opposite parenting direction. I have a friend who has the kind of cold, loveless family situation growing up and has been the very opposite with her children, does everything for them, never says no, has no boundaries in terms of stating her own individual needs and frankly her children have very little respect for her. As always, I think a balanced approach is best.

This is a strange one for me as my parents weren't too bad when growing up but I just have no desire to hug them or see them as they have never shown a desire to hug or see me. I cannot relate to anyone who misses their parents or wants to see them or who will have an incomplete Christmas without them. It just doesn't make sense to me. It's so odd to me.

My story is slightly different as I'm close to my dad but was abused by my mother. She only really liked me when I was a child and obedient. As soon as I became a teenager and started having opinions that were different to hers, I was told I was wrong, that no one would ever like me, that ,y thoughts didn't count.

One of the most abiding memories of my childhood was coming back from visiting relatives or a day out and asking if I'd been good....and being terrified of the reply. I was shaken and thrown across the room on numerous occasions for things like wanting her to play with me or do something for me.

Even as an adult I was always screamed at, told I was fat and ugly and that if I lost weight/bought clothes that she approved of/changes my hairstyle to one she approved of etc etc I would be pretty.

My brother and sister seemed to be unaffected but my sister eventually admitted that she experienced the same as me. Our brother was the boy and the heir so got away with being a dick to us. We don't have a close relationship with him now and our father is leaving the estate to my sister and I jointly so he's fucked.

Anyway when she died lots of people assumed I'd grieve and when I didn't they told me that it would hit me one day. It hasn't. The day she died I felt nothing but relief and continue to do so. She was a toxic waste dump of a human being and the world is better without her I. It.

I get this OP. I feel totally out of the current collective grief pool as a 'lockdown christmas' is pretty much the normal christmas in this household. No contact with any family whatsoever. I thought the current situation would feel less shaming for me but actually, it's a different type of shame as I feel bad that I have nothing to be sad about.

theleafandnotthetree - I agree with you. We had to work things out for ourselves, we knew our parents were there if they were really needed, but mostly they left us alone to figure things out, and I really think that helps when you get to adulthood. I sometimes wonder how they children whose parents do everything for them and fight all their battles cope with life. Balance is indeed the key.

This thread has made me feel more normal and less alone, so thank you. I feel the same about my crap parents who I don’t see, the same about people who get to miss something I’ll never have to lose.

As to the people saying ‘you’ll understand one day’ or ‘they did their best’, all you’re doing is showing you lack empathy. People are talking about sometimes lifelong hurt, about complex grief (ie grief for parental love and unmet needs), no doubt after spending years trying to untangle something they can’t untangle. I’ve spent a long time wondering why I couldn’t get my parents to treat me lovingly when others could (spoiler: it’s nothing to do with me), and what’s wrong with me (there’s nothing wrong with me).

I am strong enough now and have had enough therapy to know that, having spent a very long time having to put up and shut up - because as a child you have to just do what you can to survive in a situation you didn’t choose to be in and can’t choose to get out of - and trying to understand what I did wrong, why they are like this, I don’t fucking have to keep making excuses for them because their behaviour is not my responsibility.

I, and others in this thread, need to look after myself and be kind to myself, to know it is ok not to miss them, that it is ok and understandable and a natural consequence of their behaviour that I don’t miss them, and not to have to sit around making excuses about the ‘time’.

People who have lived in loveless households, who have been treated like shit, do not need to be told that their feelings somehow matter less than making excuses. If you see a thread about the very complex hurt that many are dealing with and your reaction is to tell people to be more understanding or bang on about how they did their best, then you are making some strange choices about how to support others.

It doesn’t matter if they did their best. It matters that they caused terrible hurt. And those of us who’ve witnessed friends receiving better, more loving parenting know ‘the time’ is not an excuse - it’s not that simple, or that excusable.

So stop with those stupid comments. Because OP, you and I and everyone else who feels this way - including jealousy - don’t have to apologise. What you do need to do is be really good to yourself. You didn’t choose this. You can’t just choose another set of feelings. That’s not how feelings work. Be proud of breaking the cycle, and be good to yourself.