Is anyone applying actual LOGIC to Christmas or just blindly following covid rules??

[Christmasisallaroundus]

I’m not changing my Christmas plans. I’m due to go to my parents 50 mins drive away. Myself & DH WFH full time. No DC. We’ve been isolating for 2 weeks in advance of Christmas. We are getting private covid tests on 21st - waiting for presumably negative results on 23rd then will travel home. Parents also not working and have been isolating pretty much since March. Will be home 24th-27th. No plans to leave the house. Then straight back to our house to isolate again for the foreseeable as no plans to see anyone.

Why would we change our plans and not go just because ‘it’s against the rules’. I don’t understand those saying they can’t go how due to rules changing.

If you are working out and about you shouldn’t have been mixing in the 1st place as you’re higher risk! Why are the rules influencing what you do - surely you should be using common sense!

Taking it a bit literally there. They literally said A simple check - can I guarantee I’m not going to pass it on Implying they've done the check and they think they can guarantee they won't pass it on. Their words not mine.

(And why is obtuse some sort of mn buzzword?!)

@WaterOffADucksCrack

Taking it a bit literally there. They literally said A simple check - can I guarantee I’m not going to pass it on Implying they've done the check and they think they can guarantee they won't pass it on. Their words not mine.

(And why is obtuse some sort of mn buzzword?!)

Yes and I can say I'm going to cross the road and not get run over. Because 99.999999% of the time its true. There's always an obscure chance but be realistic

I think the thing about your OP that has annoyed me the most is the "those people shouldn't have been planning to mix in the first place" regardless of the rules. A point you then repeated, being incredulous that ANYONE would be so stupid as to risk their families just because the rules say so.

I am a teacher. So I have been forced to mix with hundreds of families over the last few months. Therefore, outside of work I have barely been anywhere. That's my risk mitigation.
I was fortunate to finish work last Wednesday and so was planning to see my parents on boxing day - 10 days after my last day in school. Not for lunch or for some kind of mass physical pile on. Just to see them, swap presents and share a cuppa.

Now I can't.

So, just consider that those of us blithely making reckless plans, may well have actually simply been taking advantage of the reduction of restrictions whilst actually still risk assessing.

You're not unique. Some of the rest of us can also apply common sense and your post is incredibly dismissive and smug.

Oh and now I'm not going to see my parents, I've cancelled my click and collect to free it up for someone who needs it, as I am free to go to the supermarket.

Merry Christmas

Fifty minutes drive on roads with no lorries, no buses etc, on Christmas morning, returning in the evening. Unfortunate but not preventing you from having Christmas lunch with family.

YABU to think your 'logic' is reasonable. So called 'common sense' that the killer Boris Johnson has applied is partly why we have the second worst death toll from the virus in Europe.

@Livelovebehappy

babyllamazen you have seen recent news have you that suggests the majority of us won’t get the vaccine until the end of 2021/2022? Another lie by the government who told us that the vaccine was here and we were all going to get it so we can get back to normal by Easter. But the reality is that we are going to be in limbo and living like this for most, if not all of, 2021.

What?! Where is this?!

Lots of people have used logic to establish that they are higher risk and exceeded the guidelines given.

Logic would say that my asthmatic husband is more at risk than me. Yet his infection was much milder than mine, and here I am 8 months later still with long covid.

Logic says that now there's a more transmitable variant of the virus I want to see how that pans out with the London exodus before I risk taking it to my 64&74 year old parents who live somewhere that is the epitome of isolated.

Logic means there's been an emergency Christmas chicken and dinner bits in the freezer in case we really can't go.

And logic means that since both households fully WFH and we haven't and won't go out so we'll stay over at the ILs on Christmas Day (early fifties good health) .

TL:DR, you're being a bit of a knobber if you don't understand that there are different kinds of logic. Not doing the same as you isn't being illogical.

@Christmasisallaroundus

I’m not changing my Christmas plans. I’m due to go to my parents 50 mins drive away. Myself & DH WFH full time. No DC. We’ve been isolating for 2 weeks in advance of Christmas. We are getting private covid tests on 21st - waiting for presumably negative results on 23rd then will travel home. Parents also not working and have been isolating pretty much since March. Will be home 24th-27th. No plans to leave the house. Then straight back to our house to isolate again for the foreseeable as no plans to see anyone.

Why would we change our plans and not go just because ‘it’s against the rules’. I don’t understand those saying they can’t go how due to rules changing.

If you are working out and about you shouldn’t have been mixing in the 1st place as you’re higher risk! Why are the rules influencing what you do - surely you should be using common sense!

The difference is it's ok getting tests etc but I tested myself because I had been asked to by track and trace...it was negative...3 days later I felt like I had a head cold...another test..I was positive...by that point you will already be at your parents 🤷🏼‍♀️

Yes and I can say I'm going to cross the road and not get run over. Because 99.999999% of the time its true. There's always an obscure chance but be realistic
Surely you wouldn't say you can guarentee you won't? If nothing else than you may be jinxing it 😂

@WaterOffADucksCrack

Yes and I can say I'm going to cross the road and not get run over. Because 99.999999% of the time its true. There's always an obscure chance but be realistic Surely you wouldn't say you can guarentee you won't? If nothing else than you may be jinxing it 😂

I can't see a situation where that phrase would come up, but in theory yes I would, I could run across my road in my PJs right now and be certain nothing would happen because I live in a rural cul de sac and no one ever drives up here unless they live here.

I get your point but I think a bit of realism can be applied

@CatholicKidston

I didn't know Dominic Cummings used mumsnet!

I needed to see this....really cheered me up 😂

Before your serious lack of empathy, I could kind of understand where you were coming from. But you've shown your true colors the more you've posted; you are incredibly selfish, you are not above the law or those key workers who are so less deserving of a Chritmas than you. I hope you and your parents get fined.

Karma will get you sometime...

I haven't been following the Covid rules since the 1 outing a day nonsense. I won't be following these unenforceable rules either.

The more people who go along with it, the longer it will go on.

@bobbiester

We are getting private covid tests on 21st - waiting for presumably negative results on 23rd then will travel home

Will these be PCR tests or rapid lateral flow? Presumably because of the 2 day wait for results they are PCR tests.

If you have really been completely isolating for 2 weeks and are getting PCR tests then the risk of passing anything on is extremely low.

BUT how are you doing the tests? If you have to travel somewhere to take the test then that's your isolation over. Unless it's a drive through (which private ones aren't) you are going to have to walk into a building full of people.

Exactly. Speaking of "logic."

I agree in a way OP.

You see lots of sanctimonious posts on here about following the rules for the greater good, protecting X and Y and so on. But if the magic rules changed again tomorrow to say you could go to the pub, meet 30 people in a small room or go on holiday the same people would do it because it's allowed now, it's in the roolz.

I am contemplating whether to break the rules too OP. We’ve followed every rule to the letter so far, but are in a similar position to you whereby we are now banned from seeing anyone (tier 4) despite it not being possible for us to pass it on. It’s just DP and I, no DC, we are isolating for the two weeks before Christmas and DP had a negative test immediately before that. We are going to discuss with PILs today whether to see them on Christmas Day - they are also in tier 4, so we wouldn’t be leaving the area.

And it may not be 'fair' to those people who've been mixing through work etc... And are therefore higher risk than people like OP.

But to be perfectly honest, I'm not staying put over Christmas out of fairness to everyone who has to. I'll stay put (or not) based on my individual risk factors, not because it's unfair on someone in a different situation to me.

If I were OP, I'd go.

I just don’t understand people who are like me and WFH and safe changing their plans now that ‘the rules’ are different

Because other people will think 'well, I only saw x, y and z and they said they're being careful', 'I mean, I was only shopping in Primark twice and Sainsbury's once and that person who was coughing must have had asthma, as they wouldn't be out with Covid, would they?' and 'well, I don't feel ill, it's just I'm a bit tired and the kids just have a bit of a cold', etc, etc, and 'in any case, there are tons of people still meeting up like my neighbour Christmasisallaroundus, so there's no point in following the rules if they won't'.

This thread is all the evidence we need to see that we will never get out of this.

Snore....another idiot who thinks they are more important/intelligent than everyone else. As soon as someone says people need to 'wake up' or 'apply logic' its just code for here's a list of excuses as to why the rules don't apply to me but why I'm still going to expect to have the full NHS health care system at my disposal if I get sick.

[quote Christmasisallaroundus]**@LaurieFairyCake* Dh works in a school - a complete Covid hotbed*

So your Christmas plans should be staying at home in your immediate family - regardless of what the rules are.

This is my point. Why on earth were people in your DH position planning to see family before ‘the rules’ said they couldn’t.

It’s unsafe and logic and common sense should have told you that.[/quote]
Do you have any idea how repulsively selfish and smug you sound? Perfectly happy for teachers and key workers to have their Xmas fucked and their families left on their own? OK for us to be forced to deal with the public day in day out and then be rewarded by isolating over Xmas?

I hope you get caught and fined. You make me sick.

Did you isolate all shopping for 72hrs prior to bringing it inside? If so how did you stop chilled and frozen items from spoiling? Or did you wipe everything down with antibacterial wipes? What about the things which can't be wiped down?

🙄

I've linked an article that I read on the coronavirus board yesterday, it talks about the new strain & fast transmission rates.
new covid-19 strain

The thread is called New strain stuff on the coronavirus board and has mnetters who are scientists explaining the science in a very clear way without mass hysteria.

www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/world/2020/dec/15/uk-should-boost-vaccine-programme-to-tackle-covid-variant-says-leading-scientist

You see lots of sanctimonious posts on here about following the rules for the greater good, protecting X and Y and so on

Why is it sanctimonious to follow the rules? Do you even know what sanctimonious means?

But if the magic rules changed again tomorrow to say you could go to the pub, meet 30 people in a small room or go on holiday the same people would do it because it's allowed now, it's in the roolz

Now you sound stupid, designating the rules as "magic" as if they were arbitrary. If the information changes, the rules change.

[quote Christmasisallaroundus]@LaurieFairyCake well there you go - you didn’t need ‘the rules’ to tell you what to do. I know I’m not risking anything going home as I’ve been able to take precautions so again it doesn’t take ‘the rules’ to tell me

I suppose this is a bit of a TAAT which I know is bad but so many threads saying ‘we’ve had to cancel Christmas now because of the rule change’ when really it shouldn’t be impacting on people as those risky should have been staying home anyway and those safe can technically still go ( I know there will be grey areas of safe) but I’m just surprised so many are only doing or not doing something because of this last minute rule change.

Don’t get me wrong I have been following all rules. Isolating wasn’t a hardship as we see no one anyway - just needed to order our shopping instead of the weekly visit to the shop. But I don’t get why people weren’t making decisions based on logic and common sense in general.

Maybe that’s why the rules are needed if those working in risky positions were planning to mix over Christmas even though they know they’re risky![/quote]
See here is where your 'logic' / argument starts to break down.
'I have been following all rules' up to this point. Ah, so it's just these latest ones about Christmas you are deciding to ignore, because you have personally decided there is little or no risk to you and your family personally. So you can pick and choose which rules you think make sense and you will follow and which you will ignore.

But what if everyone did that, but they would have differing opinions about which ones they think make sense and they will follow and which will ignore. So it stands to reason that some will 'correctly' deduce what is sensible and some will get it wrong. Which is why the rules have to just apply to everyone, not on an individual basis. That is how society functions.

Not to mention your overwhelming sense of entitlement and the 'I'm all right Jack' attitude which is pretty galling to everyone in a less privileged position and everyone who will continue to follow these new Tier 4 / Christmas rules just because it's the right thing to do, regardless of how disappointed we all are to now not see our families. Wow.

@blackcat86

Snore....another idiot who thinks they are more important/intelligent than everyone else. As soon as someone says people need to 'wake up' or 'apply logic' its just code for here's a list of excuses as to why the rules don't apply to me but why I'm still going to expect to have the full NHS health care system at my disposal if I get sick.

^ this