Are people right to be worried about the vaccine?

[CutToChase]

I had a "good tempered" argument with DP last night. He says theres no way hes putting something in his body that hasnt undergone all the checks and tests and says that normally vaccines take 20 years to approve.

I think that when I have a choice between a known negative (covid) and an unknown (vaccine) I will always take the unknown.

In response he says people have forgotten a minuscule proportion of people actually suffer from covid. He says this is all about money (however he is a conspiracy theorist...)

What do you think about the vaccine and the speed of it?

Also vote:
YABU = I will not be getting the vaccine
YANBU = I will be getting the vaccine

@millymollymoomoo

I won’t be getting it and neither will my children Not be because I’m anti vaccine but because we are not in any higher risk categories and are fit and healthy. I know there is always a chance we could be the outliers and still get hit with COVID but on a weigh up of risks and the fact we don’t know what any possible long term side effects are I’ll pass I just don’t think we need it

Two reasons for you:

Young, fit and healthy people have still died from it, and plenty more are suffering from the long term impact of having had it.

You can still spread it even if you do suffer only mild symptoms or are asymptomatic.

How can people still not get this?

I'm absolutely sure that all anti-vaxxers study the ingredients list of every item of food and drink they consume. They most do, otherwise they'd be complete hypocrites, wouldn't they.

That’s a bit daft. I don’t need to study the ingredients list for familiar foods to be cautious about putting unknown chemicals into my body.

Why are you with this guy? You’ve lost me there

Don't get the vaccine if you're that terrified and think you know better than some of the biggest pharmaceutical companies out there. Hell, you know so much, why not start your own one?

But don't come back here complaining that you can't go to weddings, or on holiday abroad etc. Flight companies are already saying you will have to be vaccinated to be allowed on their flights. I think hotel industries may end up going the same way, can't go unless you've been vaccinated. Might end up the same way for a lot of industries, even your work might say you have to be vaccinated to come back, depending on your job.

Your choice if you don't want to, but you may find yourself restricted in other areas if you don't. Some people won't be able to have it, they are going to be relying on herd immunity. They can't be put at a disadvantage either just because you think you know better. They'll be allowed on a plane, you without a vaccine won't be.

The issue with people not having the vaccine when it is eventually available to them because “I’m alright jack” is that for the long term hope of herd immunity to be reached we need over 80% of the population to be vaccinated. Obviously that is a long way off but it’s the best way to protect the vulnerable.

That's nice @millymollymoomoo, you could have it but don't fancy it. Never mind the risk you pose to the people who can't have it for whatever reason but would be badly affected by Covid. You just carry on infecting people.

I have concerns too, but at this point I'd be happy to get rogered up my jacksie by a donkey if it makes this all go away.

[quote whiterabbitsweets]@UnmentionedElephantDildo

Not really. If you followed the discussion I was called up for saying, correctly, that the long term effects are unknown so people are ok to be cautious. It was claimed that the covid vaccine was safe and was well known so I asked for peer reviewed proof. There isn't any obviously.

That's not conspiracy.[/quote]
The language you originally used (100%) is

Reading up on the tactics of the troll factories is a real eye-opener.

Once you have seen how they deliberate skew debate, especially by choice of language and the utterly unreasonable point dressed up in reasonable language, you can't 'unsee' it

@Brunt0n

Why are you with this guy? You’ve lost me there

massive over reaction there love

That’s a bit daft. I don’t need to study the ingredients list for familiar foods to be cautious about putting unknown chemicals into my body

What unknown chemicals - you do know that the ingredients list has been published?

And if you really do know the chemical composition if common familiar food stuff and toiletries, you'll find this list both short and straightforward

@flaviaritt

I'm absolutely sure that all anti-vaxxers study the ingredients list of every item of food and drink they consume. They most do, otherwise they'd be complete hypocrites, wouldn't they.

That’s a bit daft. I don’t need to study the ingredients list for familiar foods to be cautious about putting unknown chemicals into my body.

It's not. So often the anti-vax argument is "I don't know what is in the injection" or "I'm not injecting chemical xyz!" when they equally have no idea what's in all that processed food they eat or know that just about every ingredient in most vaccines are either produced naturally by the body or are found in the food they eat.

What unknown chemicals - you do know that the ingredients list has been published?

But I know what ‘milk’ means. I don’t know anything about these ingredients or what they do. It’s okay to be cautious about that.

So often the anti-vax argument is "I don't know what is in the injection" or "I'm not injecting chemical xyz!" when they equally have no idea what's in all that processed food they eat or know that just about every ingredient in most vaccines are either produced naturally by the body or are found in the food they eat.

Right. But I am still entitled to be cautious about what I don’t know or what I am not confident about.

But I know what ‘milk’ means

So you probably know what 'vaccine that has passed all normal testing' means

I don’t know anything about these ingredients or what they do

That's probably the same if you read the ingredients of any processed food, or medicine, or make up/toiletries than can be absorbed through your skin.

It’s okay to be cautious about that

Only if you are being cautious about everything you do not understand. Unless you are prepared to admit that your anxiety is illogical. It might be worth really examining why you think it's OK to accept some medicines but not others.

Sure you can be cautious, but there is, as I'm sure you appreciate, a difference between being understandably hesitant and being an anti-vax conspiricy theory nutter.

Cautious means looking up the ingredients or talking to the nurse/GP administering it about your concerns. You discover that vaccines, by the very nature of how they work are generally incredibly safe. You can understand how we've managed to get a vaccine developed so quickly. That's all fine and of course nobody has a problem with that.

Let's just not jump on the OH NO IT CONTAINS CHEMICALZZZ! nonsense train.

"I don’t know anything about these ingredients or what they do"

Well, look them up and put your mind at rest.

@flaviaritt

What unknown chemicals - you do know that the ingredients list has been published?

But I know what ‘milk’ means. I don’t know anything about these ingredients or what they do. It’s okay to be cautious about that.

Would you put this into your body C12H22O11

*Your OH sounds like a right twat. Why are you even giving his views any validity at all.

The vaccine is ready because all The stages were done concurrently rather than consecutively and there has been no delays in waiting for approvals.*

This ^^

It is not unreasonable to have concerns most do, but l wish people would read carefully facts from peer reviewed studies, and listen only to imunologists and scientists with a history of involvement in vaccine research......not hyperbole from unreliable sources and headlines from tabloids.

There have been some excellent plain speaking discussions with true experts on Radio 4 almost daily.

Just to add my two peneth worth! I have in the past worked for one of the companies producing a vaccine so have some knowledge of the industry. As said previously the time taken is usually to do with waiting for funding and other time consuming thing re testing of any new drugs is the testing and find enough appropriate volunteers and analysing the results to see if it works. Because this is such a widespread epidemic it has been very easy to test it's effectiveness in that it has been tested in very highly infected areas such as Brazil. They have also all been tested in a much larger volunteer group with a very wide speed of ages and co morbidities. Thus I am more than satisfied that these drugs are safe and I am over 60 with several underlaying conditions. There is only one thing they can't test yet and it's the long term efficacy but as the weeks and months go on that will become more clear.

@UnmentionedElephantDildo

Not sure why I'm bothering but do yourself a favour and re-read the thread. There's nothing trolling or untoward that I said.

Calling people trolls for having a rational discussion doesn't make me a troll.

The subject is emotive I get it but really

In response he says people have forgotten a minuscule proportion of people actually suffer from covid.

Well he's right there. The majority of people who get covid are asymptomatic or have very mild symptoms, I think it was estimated that was the case for 80% of people?. The only reason for young healthy people to get the vaccine is to protect others, as is often the case with vaccines.
Of all the people I know who've had covid only 1 is suffering post vital fatigue, everyone else shook it off as they would the common cold.

Would you put this into your body C12H22O11

No idea. Why do you ask?

@jomaIone

The vaccine has gone through all the same tests as other vaccines, and has nothing 'new' in it, the scientists know the effects of all the ingredients. It's not a free for all, random mix!

What I can't understand is how we are the first to make one, China, America?? Why has no one else got a vaccine yet.

We're not the first ones to 'make one', there are several vaccines at a very similar stage of development. We were the first country in the world to officially approve and start using a vaccine, which was nit developed in the UK.

Well, look them up and put your mind at rest.

My mind isn’t not at rest. Before I get the vaccine I will assure myself that it’s the right thing to do. That’s all any of us can do, and we have a perfect right to do it.

I know 2 people who have died, 1 who spent weeks on a ventilator, 1 who had it in April and is still poorly. All of them youngish, fit people, all nhs employees. I also know 4 people who had it mildly.
Everyone's experience is different.