To wonder how people make it to adulthood without knowing

[Staffy1]

That a Christmas tree decoration is called a "bauble", not "ball ball"? Or how they make it through junior school without knowing the difference between "his" and "he's"? What happens in schools these days and don't people ever read anything?

Watch the film 'idocracy', it's the future of the human race.

[quote FitterHappierMoreProductive]@ravenmum

I’m sorry, I don’t understand what you mean. Clearly there are people who write “would of / could of” etc when they mean “would have / could have” and don’t realise they are wrong. But the people criticising them on these threads surely have sufficient imagination to realise that “would’ve and could’ve” is the reason for the mistake?! Because the way these threads read, no one ever acknowledges that...[/quote]
I was answering another poster who made this point; that people on such threads act as if this mistake is inexplicable.

I was telling that poster I have heard people saying they would never make this mistake, as they don't pronounce "would've' and "would of" the same. They claimed that anyone pronouncing these two things the same was a sloppy speaker, and that was just as bad as being a sloppy writer.

I was pointing out that in fact, they were mistaken in thinking that this pronunciation is sloppy. That belief was based on their knowledge of the spelling. So they weren't paying any attention to the real-life pronunciation, while accusing others of not paying attention to the real-life spelling.

Hope that detailed explanation helps, as I really can't be arsed to explain this any more

Would of instead of would have!!!!! Grrrrr!!!!!
Yesterday on a thread- sort after instead of sought after!!!!

@Cam77

I wish teachers would pull kids up on the correct usage of "loose" and "lose" though. They're such common words and when you write the wrong one some people will immediately class you as uneducated, fairly or not.

My Maths department used to get in trouble with the English department because we corrected too much spelling and grammar! Miss, can I have a ruler? Certainly, try Queen Victoria Miss, can I lend a ruler? Certainly, to whom do you wish to lend it and note the use of 'whom' ?

In some Maths the poor use of English can cost marks in exams where they're having to explain an answer, the incorrect use of borrow/lend, cost/income can make a difference when taken literally.

@Notjustanymum

Ravenmum, it’s also a naval term, spelt that way because it refers to a rope that’s towed behind the ship. I have to admit that a primary school teacher back in the 1970’s told us it was associated with canal barge kids, because they would tow the barges through tunnels where the tow-horse couldn’t get through. So without explaining the actual, rather more dirty, meaning to a class of 9-year old children, he certainly managed to convey that meaning of it being something to do with towing! It’s interesting, isn’t it?

I'll admit that I believe what the OED says it means over what a 1970s primary teacher thought it meant. Nothing naval in the OED definition. But etymology is indeed very interesting.

@LindaEllen, you say 'obviously' no one is having a go at people with learning disabilities, but how on earth can you know?

People are citing examples on this thread drawn from all over MN and facebook - you truly believe they know whether or not those posters are dyslexic, every single time? It could well be that the posters don't even know themselves. I taught someone who was diagnosed aged 55 when he went back to do a degree, and he ended up in tears in front of me because he finally understood why people had been mocking him and making him feel stupid all his life.

@ravenmum The thing at the edge of the pavement is spelt "curb" in US English. So you might have come across someone who reads international literature

I'm not sure, I usually point out spelling mistakes in the American literature I read, but on that thread so many people spelt it curb that I think in one of my responses I spelt it both ways

@SchrodingersImmigrant

Do you routinely change how you spell /write things based on how you see it written by others on an Internet forum? Cos I don’t. People tend to assume they’re right. And not everyone has the same level of ability to start with in terms of critically evaluating their writing in the context of other people’s!

@ravenmum

We appear to be singing from the same hymnsheet!

@safariboot

Equal parts not knowing and not caring I think. And I know it's the cliched bad workman's excuse, but a smartphone is not a good tool for writing.

Following from what lazylinguist said, I think it's safe to say that nowadays more people are writing more than ever before and their writing is being much more widely read. In the 1990s if you read something outside a school or work context it was probably a book or newspaper or magazine, written and spell-checked by professionals. Nowadays it's a post on social media by random Joe/Jane.

The bad spellers have always been here, it's just that now we're reading what they write.

Great point!

@Knittedfairies

I was at school in the 1960s and have never had an English grammar lesson in my life. I went to a girls' school where it was assumed we would assimilate grammar through reading, but I can't say that reading 'Jackie' and 'Fab 208' was particularly useful. French and German lessons were a surprise; grammar was taught there.

Same. We were also taught that grammar was assimilated.

I learned Russian at university and that was the first time I came across a whole bunch of grammar rules. (None of which I can recall right this moment).

@draughtycatflap

I used to be on a forum dedicated to the TV show Lost. During one episode a reference was made to Plato’s cave. Cue lots of forum discussion about what this meant. Because the phrase was outside a number of people’s experience it was suggested that ‘Play-Doh’ was the word used and a bizarre conversation continued where people took sides and some insisted that Play-doh made more sense as WTF was plato’s cave anyway!

Which was kind of ironic. 😂

But if you say Plato in an American accent, it does sound more like Play Doh. There weren't many British accents in Lost if I remember correctly.

Can l just go back to the start of the thread and the MIL’s pronunciation of anal.😧

Wtf do you talk about? I’ve had 2 MiL. I have never mentioned the word anal to either of them.

[quote FitterHappierMoreProductive]@SchrodingersImmigrant

Do you routinely change how you spell /write things based on how you see it written by others on an Internet forum? Cos I don’t. People tend to assume they’re right. And not everyone has the same level of ability to start with in terms of critically evaluating their writing in the context of other people’s![/quote]
Of something is being consistently spelled differently, I check it out and amend if I was wrong. Which happens to everyone once in a while. That's how I learnt a lot. Only bog issue I really have is US vs UK spelling on some things considering my learning was a mix of textbooks and predominantly US series and movies

Again. If you are the only person writing it in a, let's say, 20 posts, it must hit you at certain point that something is not right, either with them or you.

I am actually gobsmacked taht there was no grammar taught at schools here!

The teachers in my son's school are worse than the pupils. I know I'm hated for it but I have corrected their written comments on occasion. Don't get me started on the communications that come from the school office , it's seriously worrying .

@LividLoves

I’m a teacher. People do this precisely because they never read. I mean, I watch telly with subtitles because I need to know how to spell names etc.

See also: trickle treat.

I’m a retired teacher and agree wholeheartedly.

However when I’m just casually writing online (e.g., social media / MN) I’m not too phased, and presumably most people can understand what I’m trying to say regardless of my grammar 🤷‍♀️ don’t think it’s that deep.

I am sure we can see that you are not fazed.

I read. It was my thing at school. I don't spell well . We have quite a few ways of making the same sound in English and I cant always remember which it is. I'm better at things like chest of drawers though. I also use words i have never heard said out loud so I do say things wrong too.

Congratulations on putting people down who you think are below you because they say or spell things wrong.

As you're using the adverbial form it should be wrongly not wrong. Sorry, tongue firmly in cheek

Incorrect, I'm afraid, regardless of where your tongue might be. The word 'wrong' may be used both adjectivally and adverbially. These threads do tend to be heavy on the smuggery and light in actual knowledge.

I can’t spell very well, it’s seems like I’ve forgotten a lot of words, but in my defence in my job and at home I can go weeks with out writing, apart from SM, then auto correct takes over, is the days of writing with a pen or pencil over now?

@lazylinguist, would you not think 'wrongly' is better there, though? I know you could attach 'wrong' to the noun 'thing' but it'd be more natural to use the adverbial form and attach it to 'spell,' because that's what the emphasis is on?

I take your point about the way these threads go, though.

My kids used to go to an International School. Not long after they started, an American family moved to the area. The mother was livid at being forced to purchase textbooks with British-English Spelling, when “Everybody knew that American-English was the most widely-used in the world” and that they were wasting everyone’s time and money teaching “British-English”. She acted as though American came first and “British” was the country bumpkin. She was shocked to find that most English-speaking countries still stick to the mother tongue.

@SchrodingersImmigrant

I am actually gobsmacked taht there was no grammar taught at schools here!

I was taught grammar at state school in England.

I’m a teacher. People do this precisely because they never read. I mean, I watch telly with subtitles because I need to know how to spell names etc.See also: trickle treat.

I’m a retired teacher and agree wholeheartedly.

I'm a teacher and partially disagree. Reading helps a lot, but some people absorb spelling and grammar less well from reading than others do, even if they are intelligent. Dh and I have both been prolific readers since a young age. He is intelligent with a history degree from a very good university. He's a headteacher. He knows bugger all about grammar and his spelling is ok but not great.

So the spelling of a not-very-bright person with a non-languagey brain might not benefit massively from being a keen reader. Their vocabulary, comprehension skills, cultural knowledge etc would still benefit though, of course.