AIBU to ask if anyone here still thinks Brexit is a good idea?

[Sundiamond]

There was a time when the board was alive with argument around Brexit.

Does anyone still believe that Brexit is a good move and we, as a country, will gain more than we will lose?

Bulgaria, I think was going to get a certain percentage of the covid funds, there was trouble when they realised that per death they were getting £10,000 a head, while Spain was getting under a hundred.

Yeah, that really stands out because the Covid response from all other countries/organisations have been entirely perfect with no mistakes made anywhere.

How long before holidays, sick pay, maternity rights are under threat?

Move to EU Utopian countries such as France: 16 weeks maternity leave or Netherlands 10 weeks.

The mentality of those that think Brexit will still be fine and the rest is just remainer/eu lies are the sort of people who, in the US, think Biden won by mass voter fraud.

@LadyFelsham

The EU was originally The Common Market-mostly somewhere to trade and no-one paid it too much attention to it.

Then along came the court, the laws, the flag, the anthem and whispers of an army as well as the Gravy Train that most of those in power around the EU jumped on.

This was a step too far for the majority, who had no qualms about a trading block but were made uneasy about the rapid mushrooming of what looked like an unelected superpower.

So, we're leaving. Trade and travel will carry on, despite somel posturing that the UK will starve to death while the rest of Europe parties!

The EU has treated many of its members badly and is not universally popular.

Upthread, someone commented that not many Leavers will come on and that is correct. That is because as soon, as they do, they are exposed to mob patronising by those who fancy themselves cosmopolitan and those who disagree as thick-they even take the piss out of accents, spelling 'foreigners' as 'furriners'.

So, no not many leavers will come on and I won't be engaging after this.

Note however, that the vote-at the time of typing-is not far off 50-50 and then ask why the comments are 80-20 in favour of the EU. It's because no-one wants to wander into an echo chamber of people who-wrongly think themselves superior and enjoy back slapping each other.

I know this post will make no difference. In the same way, that moaning about the result will make no difference at all.

Seen from a EU country, I am expecting BJ to make a trade deal and present it as the best Christmas gift/deal ever. Only reason it's so late is because of Cummings bla bla.

I'm i totally wrong here? Or due you expect similar?

Am I

the court, the laws, the flag, the anthem and whispers of an army as well as the Gravy Train that most of those in power around the EU jumped on

The ECHR, you mean? We remain a part of that, though, you know that's not part of the EU agreement?

I didn't know there was a flag/anthem. And I am not aware of there being plans for an army. Would this be something like NATO or the UN? Why would we object to it?

LadyFelsham, I agree that there is some very unpleasant rhetoric - on both sides. I've NEVER said Brexit-voters were racist or stupid, I think that's a silly, simplistic and othering bit of nonsense.

So - those who voted Leave want to avoid certain issues that they fear might develop in future- am I understanding correctly?

So there are no benefits to be had, particularly - it's more an avoidance of, say, being forced to join an EU army or going bankrupt like Greece did?

giantangry, I fully expect a No Deal Brexit.

Nope.

We have family in France. Even something as simple as driving when we visit will be a ball ache now.

Are there any benefits? Any?

Can I ask why you don't think a last minute deal will come through ArabellaScott? To me it seems likely due to the pressure on your economy caused by covid.

And sorry, I only had one tiny glass of wine and said due instead of do , can't even blame autocorrect for that one .

They've had months to thrash out a deal, and have conveniently failed to do so.

Disaster capitalists want a no-deal brexit. The worse the crunch, the more the vultures will be able to pick over our economy and run off with the best bits.

@DianaT1969

No, nothing better to do. I like pointing out the obvious to goady posters. It gives me joy.

Oh dear

I am a remainer. Brexit is happening. I will do whatever I can to make it be successful. I expect we will find a way to make it work well for Britain somehow, likely in ways that will surprise both Brexiteers and Remainers. Like the pandemic you find that society adapts in ways you hadn't expected.

Whine threads like this one remind me of someone a bit sloshed going on about the mean girls when they were at school. Yeah it was shit. You can't change it. Whining about it changes nothing. Stop moaning and get on with the new normal.

Quite surprised that LadyFelsham complains about remainders behaving as if they’re superior, when her own tone is pretty rude.

I’m also surprised how seldom people acknowledge quite how much Remainers have lost. Many really grieve for loss of freedom of movement and reciprocal rights. I’d have found Brexit fractionally easier if there had been any 3mpathy at all about that. I haven’t heard any.

Brexit is and always was a terrible idea. I will be angry till the end of my days about losing freedom of movement against my will ... and for my kids. It’s very personal - the ability to study and work abroad easily shaped my life entirely and my kids simply won’t have the same opportunities. A leaver friend remarked ‘well, maybe they won’t want to live abroad’ ... but that’s not the point - it’s about having the opportunity. In the meantime, Brexit has meant good friends leaving the country never to return - back to Poland, Iceland, the Netherlands ... sad all round. No gains that are worth having. Diminishes us in every way possible.

Also I don’t think it’s true that the country is still divided 50/50. The latest Yougov poll indicated that 81% think Brexit is now a bad idea.

I voted remain but given that the government has done such a fantastic job of Brexit I am now a committed leaver. I will be rolling out the bunting on 1st January as we finally break free from the shackles of the EU.

The mentality of those that think Brexit will still be fine and the rest is just remainer/eu lies are the sort of people who, in the US, think Biden won by mass voter

Yes. It was all straight down the line! I dont like Trump fyi. Stop being silly though.

@Sometimeswinning

I dont understand why the EU haven't walked away yet? we've been awkward, far too demanding and full of ourselves! Any remoaners remainers have an idea??

Because it the Post No Deal blame game the EU can look straight into the camera and say - "we tried". Hard to do if you walk away first.

And, with Biden now unequivocally heading to the White House, the British Trump arse-lickers now have less room to manoeuvre. Game on.

@Sundiamond

I can't believe that anyone in Kent is still deluding themselves - Kent of all places!

I live in Kent and I despair. Apart from the economic disadvantages of Brexit, we're living with the immediate prospect of the M20 that is the main artery through Kent becoming a lorry park, like it frequently does anyway, but permanently. Our town and outlying estates and villages become gridlocked every single time that Operation Stack happens . Children are late to school, shops open late because staff can't get in. Pandemonium.

@akerman

Also I don’t think it’s true that the country is still divided 50/50. The latest Yougov poll indicated that 81% think Brexit is now a bad idea.

If you support brexit, you are unlikely to take part in this kind of survey, whereas remainers will seek out these surveys to voice their dissatisfaction. Therefore I would not trust these polls at all. My Brexiteer work colleagues, still support brexit and 'don't need to talk about it 'cos they won'

Personally, I'm resigned to the fact it's going ahead and agree with @StrippedFridge that we need to just make the best we can of it.

@ArabellaScott

- sorry, hit return - resentment and refusal to discuss it. FWIW, I haven't commented on a Brexit thread here before, so even if some of you have discussed it at length, I haven't.

Go onto the Brexit threads where you will find hours and hours of reading.

@Nottherealslimshady

Stupidest fucking thing ever. If people had thought about it for even a second they'd have known it was a stupid idea. It was like when your husband complains he had to put your socks in the washing basket without realising the million things you've just done for him.

Fishermen thought "oh let's stop foreigners fishing our seas" now its happening its "oh shit, europeans aren't going to buy our fish!" You couldn't have thought about that three years ago?
"Let's stop foreigners coming over here and taking all our jobs" to "oh no, all those europeans aren't going to come over here and do our jobs that we dont want to do or contribute to our NHS!"

Did anyone really think that little old us could go to the whole of Europe "we don't want to give you any money anymore, we dont want you to be able to come to our country, we dont want you to put rules on our products or animals care etc, but we want to be able to go to your country whenever we want, use our NHS at your hospitals, sell you everything we always did, buy everything we always did, all at the same prices, and we dont want any additional customs at the ports" and Europe would go "well we don't have any choice but to accept those terms that are terrible for us but fantastic for you."
Is that what people thought would happen?
Are people surprised that Europe went "err no."?

This. The idiocy is still incomprehensible.

'Brexit' is a stupid idea, and always was, supported by the capricious, the avaricious and the vicious.

I didn't know there was a flag/anthem.