Did your poor sleeper turn out normal?

[EnidMatilda]

So stressed. My daughter is 10 months old and has always been a highly strung sleeper, particularly at night. We worked hard on routine and settling and for a while she slept well (would still have 1 night feed at about 4am/5am but I can handle that). Last week she caught at cold and she slept on me for three nights and fed all night as she was so sad and unwell. She has since recovered but it's like we are back to square 1.

Tonight she woke at 11.30pm. After TWO HOURS of hysterical screaming, I gave in and fed her. She is now asleep. What worries me is she can't seem to calm herself down. I can't even explain how angry and upset she gets. I was there with her the whole time either rubbing her back, singing to her, rocking her. Nothing would soothe her. She stopped crying for 10mins when we read a story so I knew she wasn't in pain or ill. I obvs don't want to overstimulate her but leaving her to it is also awful. She rejected dummy from young age. I've also tried giving her water from her cup but that doesn't calm her.

I feel like this behaviour is so different from other babies we know. Is two hours of screaming when obviously tired normal? Is there something wrong with her? Weirdly for naps in the day she will settle herself in the cot and drift off to sleep.

Yanbu - not normal behaviour
Yabu - normal. Don't panic.

Help and advice desperate wanted. Would love any solidarity. Sick of hearing about sleeping babies.

My DC3 was like this as a baby. He's a great sleeper now (age 11).

My DD1 never slept. She didn’t sleep a night through in her own bed til she was about 7. She screamed the place down. We tried everything.

She’s in her final year at uni.

Still isn’t a great sleeper but at 22 that’s her problem. (She’s already up and doing some uni work).

Totally normal and totally horrendous. My daughter only started sleeping through consistently at the age of 4, although things became much more bearable at about 18 months. I think if you've had a properly bad sleeper you always remember how bad it was and you have all my sympathy. You will get through it, although I'm sure it doesn't feel that way at the moment. My daughter is now 11 and is definitely an owl, she absolutely hates early mornings. I've just gone in to wake her for the second time for school - not a problem that I thought I'd ever have!

DS1 (4) still sleeps with us most nights, apart from that he's turned out normal, and is pretty clever.

In our case, no. She has ADHD and ASD, although is happy and doing well several years on. There were other signs she’s wasn’t like other kids, wanted to move and climb more, massive hour long meltdowns daily and sleep terrors most nights. There were probably other things I didn’t spot but 10 months is very young to know anything and some babies are just like that. Just as some adults are more anxious and need reassurance or just need less sleep.

Overall it’s too early, but ask for support from the HV, I did, rather than listen to judgemental advice online. If she’s in nursery the staff will spot things too. Once walking it may settle and you can tire her out. If there is a developmental issue, like ADHD and ASD, it’s highly likely you have family with traits too, although very unlikely to be diagnosed if over 30.

DD1 was a horrific sleeper. In the early days she'd scream from 4pm until 11pm then be up hourly. Sometimes she'd go straight back off after bf in the night, other times she'd be up for an hour or two screaming. DH nearly wore holes in the carpet from all the pacing he did. She would only sleep if she was in our arms, we were touching her or breathing right in her face. She went through a stage of sleeping 4hr stints between 4mo and around 10mo (except when poorly), but was back to hourly wakings after that. We sleep trained at 12mo and she managed to get back to 4hr blocks, but it didn't get better than that until we changed her to a toddler bed at duvet at 16mo (wasn't why we switched beds). The first night in the bed she STTN for the first time ever. I woke up in the morning panicked that something had happened to her! She STTN the next night and then on for quite a while - it turns out she likes to spread out and stick a leg out if hot! Then she went back to waking once a night until about 3yo.
Shes 6.5yo now and once asleep she rarely wakes, however she takes an age to shut her brain off and get to sleep. Bedtime is 7.30pm with reading alone in bed until 8pm, yet she is still awake at 9pm and often even 10pm complaining she can't sleep. She is still just as physically clingy when awake and quite highly strung generally.

It was a really hard period of my life, made worse by some other horrible life events, but the lack of sleep was a killer and it has etched the time in my memory. I couldn't believe it when DD2 came along and I discovered that, like the books recommend, some babies can be put down 'drowsy but awake' and they just fall asleep only waking for milk then go straight back off again! DD2 prizes sleep very highly now at 4.5yo, and will tell us when she's tired and happily go to bed. They are like chalk and cheese sleep-wise!

What worries me is she can't seem to calm herself down

This shouldn’t worry you at all: it’s very very normal. We cannot reasonably expect a 10 month old to emotionally regulate. Her brain is still immature and growing: the logical left side of the brain, which can rationally process that everything is actually OK, takes a long time to fully kick in. She can give up hope and stop crying, but that’s not the same as ‘calming herself down’ which is an incredibly sophisticated process.

You see it all the time. Parents often try sleep training successfully at around 6 months but then something else surfaces months down the line: separation anxiety or nightmares or random night wakings. There’s often no permanent quick fix that will cover their entire childhood.

So I feel for you, but we’re constantly bombarded with messages about how babies and children should be more ‘independent’ in their living habits and whatnot. This is really for the benefit of adults. This behaviour is completely normal.

I had a poor sleeper and complete cot refuser who now (20 months) still isn’t excellent but is definitely improving. Will happily sleep in the cot on conditions that I’ll sing her a little song etc. The language and understanding over the last few months has definitely helped and will continue to do so.

Yes, sounds normal. My 3 year old DD has only just started sleeping through and I can finally get a good nights sleep.

I honestly don't know how any of you coped with two hours of hysterical screaming. I'd have brought her downstairs with me and her dad, sat her on our laps or in between us, in front of the telly if it was on, and carried on as normal. She'd have maybe had a drink, a nappy change, then snuggled up and gone off to sleep eventually. She must have been distressed to cry so much.

Haha, you clearly didn't have a baby that woke screaming hourly then did you, otherwise you'd have literally never made it to your bedroom.

OP - my DS was a really bad sleeper - he woke up 10+ times a night on average until he was 2. Then about 3-5 times a night until 3. By 4 he was down to once or twice most nights, thankfully. I would say he's not "normal", whatever normal is.

But I'd also say that's very different to your DD.
She was waking once a night for a feed until recently?? That's quite good!

But 8-11 months is a notoriously bad sleep time and it sounds like she's going through a phase. It's tough, but it will improve with time.

Honestly if she'll settle for a feed, give her a bloody feed rather than endure 2 hours screaming.

At 10m DS woke every 2 hours at least for a feed.
By 13m he slept through 11 hours straight, waking for a night feed on 2-3 nights a month.
We had to work on this a bit but not in a mega stressful way. I believe he was just 'ready' at about 11/12m.

My DD woke for 2 feeds a night at 10m. Night weaned at 11m, started sleeping through consistently from 12m and has woken us about 4 times a year since!

Mine just weren't ready until 1ish and then thankfully were!

I made it to 3 months before calling a (very pricey) Baby Whisperer lady. She was in the house for under 20 minutes and revolutionised our lives.

She wrapped DD up so tightly that it was lucky she’d warned me ‘Mum’s tend to need to look away for this bit’. She made the cot room completely dark, even pinned black bin bags over the shut blinds (I found a less tacky replacement the next day!). She tucked the sheet over DD and jammed it either side with rolled up muslins. You could have bounced coins off it. DD looked over at me in alarm once, then fell straight to sleep and never looked back.

I followed all the strange lady’s instruction sheet to the letter- I’m sure it was hilarious for my mum and childless siblings. But there’s nothing quite like finding your baby’s ‘off switch’. It’s the greatest miracle of my life. I was happy to look a bit loony, and run the routine by the book.

Now she’s 10yo, and the exact same personality I saw at Day 1. Full on extrovert who hates to be alone, and is endlessly fascinated and stimulated by the world. She’d stay up 24/7 if she could. I still can ‘switch her off’ by saying a certain goodnight phrase I started when she was little. I’ve even done it by phone from the other side of the planet! It’s not magic, it seems to just give her permission (and the idea) to change modes.

A bit of ritual counts for a lot, even if it’s a big pain to be so consistent to get it to stick. I also used lavender pillow spray very early to create a sleep cue for her with that smell. I used CD sounds (uterus soundscape, white noise, etc). Don’t know for sure which bits failed or worked, but something in there did.

I’m not suggesting every kid has a sleep solution if you look hard enough, or that I’m fabulous in some way. I’ll never forget the horror of even 3 months of no sleep. It’s sooooo hard physically, emotionally.
I wish all of you the best of luck- I’m sure luck plays a part.

Yep!!! Been there

And surrounded by good sleepers who all thought I must be doing it wrong

He was so hard I thought there must be something wrong with him.

He is now 6, mad as a box of frogs, but funny, sweet, clever, kind and most of all, sleeps like a log

You sound like you are working so hard to get this right, be kind to yourself, this will pass xxxx

I would have given calpol to a child crying like that for that length of time. Just because she settled for a story doesn't mean she isn't in pain.

My terrible sleeper is in his teens now. He sleeps well and gets up early for a teen but makes me breakfast sometimes. Back then i wished someone had said 'yes it is hard, no its not your fault and yes it does get better sleep wise. So thats what im saying.

Dd1 woke every 3 hours or so for 18 months. Once she did start sleeping through she slept like a log. She's now 13 and an incredible sleeper still.

I think I leaving baby to cry for 2 hours causes huge stress for baby& you. Why do it? I know some people take the cry it out approach, but personally I took the sooth & reassure approach.

My DS didn't sleep through until he was 3. 3 long years and I honestly dont know how I did it and work full time and study for a degree. The turning point was him coming out of nappies and then he slept apart from the odd night

10 months old is a really tough time. Most seem to grow out of it though!

I have a nearly 4 year old who is still a terrible sleeper, always has been, but we're terrible sleepers too. Do whatever is easiest to get you through. For us I ended up safe bedsharing from 6 weeks as they wouldn't sleep in the co sleeping crib. Been in their own room about 5 months now but still wakes up and gets into bed with me second half of the night. Definitely sleeps for much longer stretches now, though we still get nightmares, night terrors from time to time.

Completely normal in my experience .. we had resorted to the buggy in ds bedroom at one point just to get him to sleep without feeding and it was still multiple times a night .. he's now 2.5 and goes to bed awake in his toddler bed listens to an audio book (we do read him a story first) goes to sleep by himself and this past week has been sleeping straight through to about 730/8 ... it was 6/630 for a long time there but at least he was in bed 7-630 . It does get better! Good luck

Normal is pushing it but she sleeps very well and is thankfully old enough now to find a reading light and a book if she wakes.

Horrible teething at that age. She was our pfb and we faffed about with teething powders and other herbal remedies. At some point my cousin, GP and mother of two laughed openly at me and said "if your mouth hurt that much you'd take some paracetamol" which was a) true and b) shaming in its truth. So we got over ourselves, bought some Calpol and didn't look back.

There was a night terrors stage around 2-3 ish but at ten months I'd go squarely for teeth.

I could not just read and run.

I had one just like that - so different to other babies. Huge issues with sleeping, crying from tiredness and crankiness but broken nights for her entire first year and more. She and I co-slept as that was the only way for me not to completely lose it, and she snacked on demand at night while I slept.

She is normal! Completely normal and actually not cranky, a happy girl with a nice sense of humor. At 12, she still needs less sleep than other kids her age - that has always stayed constant - but sleeps like a log. No nightmares, night wakings, anxiety. She was just a completely bad, bad sleeper as a baby.

What exactly does your title mean op? Did your poor sleeper turn out normal? My poor sleeper has autism but you can get to fuck if you're calling her not normal.

A one off doesn't really make her a poor sleeper.

DS used to wake up multiple times in the night and was then up for the day at 5/5.30. He didn't stop this until he was nearly 4, and then he was still up for the day at 5/5.30. I was absolutely on my knees and didn't know how I could cope any longer. So, totally agree with the other people not getting how awful continuous sleep deprivation is.

DS was a particular struggle because when he was hungry he used to just scream and scream (yes, for up to 2 hours or even more) - we knew if he'd only eat something he'd be fine, but he was too hysterical to be able to manage it. And listening to your child screaming when you are sleep deprived is another layer of torture.

He is now 16, is very keen on staying in bed, and regards being asked to get up before 10am as something akin to child abuse. I just remember the period as very bad, but have somehow recovered (and ironically am now perimenopausal and have insomnia myself). so I guess he turned out "normal".

What exactly does your title mean op? Did your poor sleeper turn out normal? My poor sleeper has autism but you can get to fuck if you're calling her not normal.

good point. any that definition I suppose I am the mum of an abnormal child.

people really should engage their brains before putting a posts up using this kind of language

I took the title to mean, were there physical health issues that the poor sleep uncovered? Such as silent reflux, undiagnosed infections.

Hi, I had a very bad sleeper, absolutely fine now. What made it bearable was a) do what works not what you think you should do and b) lie shamelessly to all but the most supportive people

When good friends asked how he was sleeping I told the truth, when jellyfishes asked I would just say 'oh not too bad now thanks' because the last thing you need is some knobhead asking if you've tried using a sleeping bag instead of blankets.