Ban on new petrol/diesel cars by 2030 - AIBU to be excited?

[almostautumn]

The government are set to announce a ban on sales of new petrol and diesel cars by 2030. As someone who lives in a polluted city (London) and worries about the effect that carbon emissions are having on my family’s health, I’m so excited by this news because I think it will really change our children’s lives for the better. And it’s fantastic that it’s only 10 years away!

www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-54981425

@AntsInPenzance it wasn’t me fixating on the Nissan Leaf. I had said earlier in the thread about needing a car that would cover many miles working in community nursing rurally and another poster said the lead would cover it thus my replies about this

Can you imagine being a mobile carer and asking some poor pensioner if you could ' charge up your car' ready for the next visits?
Knocks 'can I borrow ' a cup of sugar' ? ' into a cocked hat! 😃
(The ' aibu ' thread will be swamped. )

Given that there are lot of rural areas that still don't have decent broadband I have no confidence that the infrastructure will be in place. In my village the pavements (where they exist at all) are too narrow to house charging points and a lot of the houses have no drives (weren't a requirement in the 18th and 19th centuries). If the govern haven't already got a pretty ambitious plan ready to roll out it will be like the switch off of analogue radio.

If the govern haven't already got a pretty ambitious plan ready to roll out it will be like the switch off of analogue radio. Which I doubt many of those here wondering if I live on a small atoll somewhere off The Pharoah Islands ever had to think about!

@AlaskaThunderfuckHi!!!!!!!! The leaf isn't the only car out there. Look at the eNiro, the soon to be released enyaq, MG have an estate.

This thread is just proving most people need to do a bit more research.

Some people in more niche situations like living with unreliable electricity may need to invest in things such as personal battery storage at their properties, something to charge up during reliable or low demand times and then cover the unreliable times. Invest in personal energy production like solar panels.

Those complaining about range, expect range to increase significantly we've gone from sub 150 range to near 400+ in less than a decade already.

Those complaining about charge time again charging is getting faster and faster. The network will improve.

The government haven't handled this pandemic that well thus far and that isn't over yet. Still the vaccine to distribute and it'll be a good year to get that sorted out.
Brexit has been a shambles too ; I know there is more to come about that etc, but it's not looking great up to now and been on the back burner for a long time and things still need sorting on that front.

So.. let's let everyone now worry about their cars in the name of beating climate change! They might be better at this one! I live in hope .. ( that's all I have )
Formula one might be a thing of the past though. Every cloud ..

@CuriousaboutSamphire Yes we employ around 300 mobile technicians, many cover 300 to 500 miles per day, fixing customer issues.
The ones in Scotland can drive even further.

The only way round this would be to employ more staff, so avoiding travel but then costs rise and have to be passed on.

All the issues raised on EV means it won't happen, hydrogen is the future!

@the80sweregreat

Can you imagine being a mobile carer and asking some poor pensioner if you could ' charge up your car' ready for the next visits? Knocks 'can I borrow ' a cup of sugar' ? ' into a cocked hat! 😃 (The ' aibu ' thread will be swamped. )

my MIL is a pensioner in her late 70s and when she visits friends (admittedly not very often right now) she is quite used to saying exactly that. She bought an EV last year and all her friends think it's a marvellous idea, particularly with regard to air pollution impact on their grandchildren.

[quote MyDucksArentInARow]@AlaskaThunderfuckHi!!!!!!!! The leaf isn't the only car out there. Look at the eNiro, the soon to be released enyaq, MG have an estate.

This thread is just proving most people need to do a bit more research.

Some people in more niche situations like living with unreliable electricity may need to invest in things such as personal battery storage at their properties, something to charge up during reliable or low demand times and then cover the unreliable times. Invest in personal energy production like solar panels.

Those complaining about range, expect range to increase significantly we've gone from sub 150 range to near 400+ in less than a decade already.

Those complaining about charge time again charging is getting faster and faster. The network will improve. [/quote]
Yes, many posters need to do a lot or research

Battery storage? Flats? all sorts of properties without gardens or any outside space? There are very many of those round here too. And then the legal side of that, chemical and fire risks etc.

Range isn't really the issue IF you can easily recharge. Which is why I have been banging on about the lack of appropriate infrastructure.

Yes, the network will improve. But in the meantime what about those who cannot make the change? There are far more of them than you may like to think!

I can't see the infrastructure being available to only support fully electric cars by 2030 unless technology improves vastly by then. Something like plug-in hybrid type cars as a minimum requirement rather than full on electric is probably more realistic.

It's good that people are embracing the new technology and seem to like their EV's. It'll just be a big operation to get everyone on board with it over time.
Lots of things to iron out.

Oh, meant to say, we can't have solar panels. Wrong pitch roof, conservation area etc etc etc

[quote AlaskaThunderfuckHiiiiiiiii]@TalbotAMan and what about boot space for all my nursing stuff as there is a lot and I need it every day? What about cases if we go away as a family? Nissan Leaf would not suit my situation[/quote]
As others have said, the Leaf may be the first decent modern electric car, and because of that there are more of them than any other electric model, but the range of electric vehicles is expanding all the time. If the Leaf doesn't work for you, look at others. For example, MG (now a Chinese brand) have just introduced an electric estate with a claimed range of over 200 miles --

@Whatsissname

I can't see the infrastructure being available to only support fully electric cars by 2030 unless technology improves vastly by then. Something like plug-in hybrid type cars as a minimum requirement rather than full on electric is probably more realistic.

That was my thought for my next car. I'd run the long distances on petrol, the shorter ones on electric. That would leave me able to make significant change without having to move house!

Hydrogen is not the future for personal vehicles. It's so difficult to transport. If you think the gov will struggle to invest in the grid and electric charging, how do you think they're going to do the infrastructure required for hydrogen?

• it's difficult to contain
• it's highly flammable and dangerous
• it's takes a lot of energy to produce

Whilst it will suit some situations and I think there will be some models of cars, it will most definitely niche. It will have more uptake in large transport like ships, planes etc.

For example, MG (now a Chinese brand) have just introduced an electric estate with a claimed range of over 200 miles -- Again, range isn't the insurmountable issue!

My parents aren't even particularly rural (they live in a village of a few thousand) yet can only get 512 Kbs broadband, a speed that has not increased in the past 16 or so years. The idea that the infrastructure for EV will be put in place for rural communities is laughable.

A significant proportion of people have offroad parking so that's them sorted fairly easily.
What if you then put charge points in all car parks?

Hahahaha houses with off road parking are like gold dust where I live. This adds considerable value to houses which puts them out of many peoples price range.

And car parks??? Round here most are flat bits of ground, no tarmac etc. One pay and display that would hold about 10% of one residential road that would need to use it!

@MyDucksArentInARow

Hydrogen is not the future for personal vehicles. It's so difficult to transport. If you think the gov will struggle to invest in the grid and electric charging, how do you think they're going to do the infrastructure required for hydrogen?

• it's difficult to contain
• it's highly flammable and dangerous
• it's takes a lot of energy to produce

Whilst it will suit some situations and I think there will be some models of cars, it will most definitely niche. It will have more uptake in large transport like ships, planes etc.

Imagine a hydrogen fuelled car crash

[quote AlaskaThunderfuckHiiiiiiiii]@TalbotAMan and what about boot space for all my nursing stuff as there is a lot and I need it every day? What about cases if we go away as a family? Nissan Leaf would not suit my situation[/quote]
@AlaskaThunderfuckHiiiiiiiii I think you may be underestimating the boot size of a leaf - it's not a large car but it is sort of Ford Focus sized.

Definitely you could fit 5 people in it, but maybe not with car seats, but that's the same for any mid sized hatch back.

Nursing kit - plenty of room.

Suitcases - it will easily take 2 suitcases, or 4 cabin/weekend cases, We've definitely had our 4 cabin cases plus sleeping bags, pillows and 2 camp beds in the boot.

@Frazzled2207

Given that it’s just a ban on NEW cars it’s far too late IMO. Traditional cars will still be available for years. They should ban sales of fossil fuel cars within months if they were properly serious. I’m an EV driver. Yes the infrastructure needs investment but there is time yet. 70% of the population (guessing) could cope really nicely with an EV by charging at home or at work, once long range EVs are commonplace (200+ miles is doable now, but quite expensive).

Some manufacturers don't have a pure electric yet - also as a number of people on thread have mentioned there are almost no electric cars with Towing capability.

You're expecting someone who needs a new car to pull their horsebox or trailer to pay a £50K premium for a new one (80K vs 30k) in the course of a few months.

I understand the eagerness to reduce tailpipe emissions but people's entire livelihoods and manufacturing jobs are also important surely?

I love your 70% guess - what is that based on exactly?

@Ifailed

At a guess if you know you won't have access to a petrol station for a while you can fill up petrol cans and shove them in the boot

you can at most 30 litres of petrol in two containers.

Anyway, why the obsession with a few exceptions, that vast majority of people in the UK don't live the back of beyond, and for those that do there will exemptions. All this WhatAboutMe is usually what holds us back from going forward.

It's not about just people who live in remote areas, I suspect the bigger issues will be people living in more crowded areas where parking is at a premium as it stands, so no ability to fit a charge point on their property eg. how would you fit a charge point if you lived in a block of flats?

It's going to massively affect people in poorer areas. It'll be ok in middle class areas where people own homes with driveways, but if you live in a rented flat in a crowded area? I can't see how it'll achieve anything other than increasing inequality.

Monthly costs will go down for the well off, while the poor will be stuck in ageing petrol cars, with higher fuel and maintenance costs while being taxed more because they can't upgrade, and finding it harder to source a new car when their old one packs up.

Just to reiterate, I think we should go electric, but the infrastructure needs to be in place and the timeframe seems far too short

You're expecting someone who needs a new car to pull their horsebox or trailer to pay a £50K premium for a new one (80K vs 30k) in the course of a few months

I'll be buying a brand new diesel pick up on Dec 31st 2029

As usual this is the daily mail putting things out there today to gage a reaction. None of which was positive at all.
I remember climate change being discussed when I was around 13 , 40 odd years ago now and not much has changed for the better really : why? Because governments have seen the motorist as a cash cow for too long and made is too reliant on cars for everything in life.
All this is just to say ' we are doing something' without doing anything much.
It's all too much money for them , especially now. The big car companies won't be in a position to spend much either I suppose ( or won't want to)
I haven't the answers here , but getting people to part with their petrol cars won't be that easy.