Husband acts like my child

[Hoc1]

Please help me get some perspective here, opinions would be gratefully recieved!

My husband has always been a bit of a loner. At 32 I was his first serious girlfriend. However he was kind, affectionate, caring, romantic and patient. He is socially anxious.

We've now got 2 DC, one 3.5 year old and one 5.5 month old.

I feel like a completely selfish person, bringing another baby into the world as we were still having issues on and off when I got pregnant again.

He see's me as the person responsible for everything.....kids, house etc. I'm currently on mat leave but will go back 3 days a week in March. He'll still see me as the person responsible for everything when I'm back at work too. He even asks my permission on things.

He never goes out, doesnt want to suggest doing anything. He's constantly anxious about getting things 'wrong' this comes from his upbringing. He'd rather not try than get it wrong.

After years of this, he's been seeing a counsellor but nothing really changes. He still says it's his upbringing and he can't help his anxiety. I get tha, but he literally doesnt know if taking DC 1 to park is ok and asks me if it's ok to do it rather than suggesting it. He looks for my permission. I have explained so many times he doesnt need to 'ask' that he's a dad and a partner, not a child at school.

Some of my friends have it much worse. Their husbands go out with friends and leave them to deal with kids alone, aren't there for kids bdays etc.

So, I feel like I should appreciate hubby, he's a bloody good dad.

But I feel like we're not equal, he doesn't ever want to discuss anything and he strops like a toddler when I try to get an opinion. He says he feels put on the spot and he just can't give an opinion.

Is this just what a relationship is like with kids???? Should I stop expecting anything different? Do I just keep going like this? I'm really unhappy.

This is definitely not 'just how it is' with kids, and it sounds tough.

I've a very different problem - my husband takes responsibility for the kids, but overestimates how much he does, and then claims the right to make decisions on the basis of his inflated ideas of his contribution. So I constantly struggle not to end up with 70% of the work and 30% of the decision-making powers. Basically, relationships with kids are difficult.....

Something clearly has to change on his side, and it sounds like that may be very difficult to achieve. But people 'on the spectrum' can learn things. I'd start by trying to make very clear to him, in the calmest way possible, how distressing this situation really is for you; that your relationship is at stake. Which is itself not easy to do.

I hope you find a way forward. Best of luck.

I think the most important question here is: How long has he been seeing the counsellor for?

It sounds like he has some extremely deep rooted problems with confidence and self-esteem, to the extent that he can't really make decisions alone at all. As you say that probably stems from something in his childhood. There isn't going to be an overnight fix for that, but therapy is a good step.

Sometimes it can take months, sometimes years, even with a good therapist. But if there has been no movement at all and it has been more than a year with this therapist, maybe he needs to try a different one. Not everyone can click with every therapist.

Sorry OP but I think unless you're considering leaving him you will be in this for the long haul. There are some very fundamental things he will have to look at and change - and that's only if he wants to change. If you want to support him then that is great but if you don't feel able to go on that journey with him it would be kinder to leave sooner rather than later.

There should be a law against suggesting 'Any ASD traits?'

My first thought was autism.
My dh is similar,nothing happens unless I make it happen
My dh needs a bit of a kick up the bum ,then it’s ok
I suppose it boils down to what you can put up with .
We made it work ,but you might decide not to ,it’s your call

Why should there be a law against suggesting ASD.
It’s massively under diagnosed
Some people struggle their whole lives not knowing what was wrong
Then get a diagnosis and it’s like a light bulb going on ,it explained so much.

Just suggesting could it be ASD does not diagnose anyone with it
The waiting list is huge and takes over a year to complete.

Would your life be easier without him?
He sounds exhausting and while I understand that he can't help his anxiety (is he on medication?) it isn't your job to manage him. Why should you on top of everything else be expected to write lists on a white board so a fully grown man can make it through the day? That's just adding more to your plate and making him more dependant on you.
I feel like your life is going to get harder as your children grow up.

My DH is a bit like this and almost certainly has ASD as our 7 year old was recently diagnosed with it and they're very similar. It's hardly an unreasonable suggestion.

I can relate to your husband. I vividly remember as a 11 year old being asked what I thought about something by my mum and dad and desperately wanting to get the answer right. I had no idea what my own opinion was, only that I needed to say the right thing. I took a guess, expressed an opinion and my parents got annoyed at me and told me what I’d said was awful. I felt so ashamed.

All through my life, I've wished I could tell what people were thinking so I’d know what to say, so I could agree with them and ‘get the answer right’. If someone could just tell me what to think and do, that was just fine by me.

It’s exhausting and meant I struggled socially as the effort to try and agree with everyone, match their opinion, not say the wrong thing is hard work. Also impossible! I didn’t feel I knew what I was talking about, or what I thought or that having a different opinion from someone else didn’t have to be a big deal. I felt like I had no sense of self.

I’ve had therapy - 3 years of it! Things are definitely better than they are but it’s a work in progress. And I have to say, I’ve always been very opinionated with my husband!

I’m not saying all this to say that you should stay with your husband, or not. I just wanted to give you an insight into how it might feel for him. Without more therapy, the situation is unlikely to improve, I think. All I know is that for years I have felt pathetic, feeble, worthless and like a non-person. It’s a miserable way to live.

Do I just keep going like this? I'm really unhappy.

I think you have your answer there, OP. You are really unhappy.
If he strops like a toddler rather than trying to get to grips with this, I don't think anything will change. I know there could be any number of reasons why he behaves as he does, but unless he is at least willing to try to modify his behaviour, and get past childhood stuff, it's going to be very difficult for you.

And only you can decide if that is worthwhile, continuing this relationship. He will leave the decision on that to you too, I imagine.

I'm not going to say LTB, but if you did split, he would really need to step up in order to be capable of looking after the children.

I'm so glad you're addressing this now Op, a friends DH was very like yours, couldn't make a decision and was pretty unsocial. She managed it all through DC and working years but hoped to have a peaceful retirement. Now her DH doesn't want to go anywhere because he gets anxious and hates her leaving him alòne. Get some help and enjoy your life

OP you start by painting a picture of a man who is kind, affectionate and patient, but you end up by saying that he strops like a toddler if you ask him for an opinion. That isn't kind or patient and would be a huge red flag for me. I could possibly put up with a lack of initiative or confidence, but someone who throws tantrums over being asked to participate more actively in family life must be exhausting. That kind of behaviour is controlling and is designed, whether consciously or unconsciously, to ensure that you stop trying to involve him, out of fear for the consequences. Think very carefully about whether you want to go on like this for years and years. And in the first instance, every time he throws a tantrum challenge him and make it clear that this kind of behaviour is absolutely unacceptable in your relationship. It should be your red line.

Yes, wanting to be kind, having kind intentions, kind fantasties, identifying as a kind person... these are not the same thing as actually being kind to another real life person.

I have 2 things to add. 1 - it took me a long time, therapy, reading and soul searching to start to find my own opinions and decisions without the approval of others. DF actively cultivated an environment where he wanted us to 'tow the party line' and didn't want us 'to think just do' etc so I totally understand how people end up in your DHs position. However, I'm an adult and had already made some progress by exceeding either parent in career achievements. It actually took a horrible birth trauma for me to re-evaluate everything and move forward. Your DH can likely make changed but he has to really want to as the insights he may find could be very uncomfortable.

2- I use an app called trello to divide up household tasks if not DH seems to think he can literally just go to work and come home without considering pets, DC, housework etc. I've taken on more hours in my business and had to stay at my paid employment due to covid so I've said I'm not doing it all and he needs to do a fairer share. Assigning tasks on trello means he can never say he doesn't know what needs doing. It does mean me 'managing the house' but hey I was doing that anyway.

@Daleksatemyshed

I'm so glad you're addressing this now Op, a friends DH was very like yours, couldn't make a decision and was pretty unsocial. She managed it all through DC and working years but hoped to have a peaceful retirement. Now her DH doesn't want to go anywhere because he gets anxious and hates her leaving him alòne. Get some help and enjoy your life

I think this is a really good point to consider too, OP. This is what your future may look like.

Shh, @Pringlemonster... I'm autistic. Diagnosed. Not all autistic people are faulty. Not all faulty people are autistic.

OP if you split up from him you will still be doing all the same stuff!

Likewise if you split up he will probably have difficulty managing to ensure there is sufficient food to plan meals or could struggle with bills for his new property he will be in alone and turn to you to help, so then you’d have double the work as if you refuse it will affect the kids.

Either way you will have the lions share until he can somehow learn or come up with a coping strategy to help him manage to make decisions.

Even if he could phrase things differently could it help with frustration? Like don’t ‘ask’ me if you can take the kids to the park. Say “I’d like” to take the kids to the park.

The rota idea is a good one. He will have clarity about what’s expected of him on what days.

Oh my goodness, so many amazing responses, thank you so much.

It's made me feel confident that my situation isn't fair on me and something needs to be done. Very interesting that ASD has been mentioned a lot, as I have, for years said I think he may be on the spectrum. He's actually on the waiting list for the autism clinic for assessment as counsellor agreed to refer him.

By saying he's a good dad, I mean he gives his all to our dc1. Today he's played all day with her today and made her her lunch. However, this is where the 'mental load' stops. He plays with her a lot but anything adult is often left to me. Eg money, clothing children, routines, etc

We've tried the lists of things to do. We have a joint do do list app on our phones. But then, its about having to put things on that list.

He does work, currently from home. I suggested we take time out when his work is quiet when dc1 is at preschool to chat about what needs to be done. But of course, if I dont organise it, it doesn't happen.

I'm going to show him this thread to show him how other ppl see this too as I dont think he gets the magnitude of it.

Whoever, posted a link to the 'mental load' cartoon, thank you ! That describes it perfectly and I'm going to show him that too.

And I'm taking it all on board, from the books suggested, to all tips and thinking through what I want from our marriage. Thank you for putting all sides across, from his to mine.

Yes, he has been a great husband at times. Kind, patient with me when going through issues myself, funny. We'd chat about music, culture, politics all sorts. All well and good when it's just 2 of you. Then kids came along. He also wanted them. We didn't accidentally get pregnant. He said he was ready. Then that's when the cracks start to appear.

I want to fight for the marriage, I got married and made that commitment. But he needs to see his side if the commitment too.

Honestly though, you have all really boosted my morale here. Thank you!

I'm in the same boat OP. Dh has accepted he is most likely autistic after a counsellor said this is most likely our biggest issue and I try to live life around avoiding him having to ask me a question.

So my dh is the same as yours, will ask if he should take dc to park even when no one would stop him and it would actually be better if he just went instead of asking.

The night before I'll say you go to the park tomorrow and I'll have a break. He seems to respond much better to this. Then I'll say please get dc clothes out for tomorrow's park trip so you're all set and ready without worrying.

In between these kind of things I tell him he's not to ask me any questions unless there's some kind of emergency. He's to think the question through and if the answer is yes an ambulance is required he can ask away. This probably sounds ridiculous but I don't want to leave my dh. I have cried, shouted, got angry but I know that won't change a thing so either I accept I must change something or leave.
Of course he still asks non ambulance related questions but it's gotten a lot better me literally telling him he'll be doing xyz the next day and once I've told him he can't ask a question unless he's going to plan something else without asking me anything.
It is tiring, boring and endless but for me worth more than us splitting up as I do actually like him in the end. He is a lot happier as well once he knows what he's doing, that bit is the anxiety unfortunately. I think it would probably take decades for my dh to sort out his anxiety something I'm not willing to wait for.

Might be worth looking to see if something wrong. Does sound that way.

I’m sorry maybe I’m being harsh but I couldn’t function with someone like this.

Blaming that kind of incompetence on your upbringing only goes so far. Also anxiety etc: up a point but it’s only men who have the luxury of using anxiety as an excuse for incompetence. You don’t see women claiming to be too anxious to parent their own children,

The point of having a partner is supposed to be sharing the load. What on earth is the point of having an adult child to add to the workload? Would it not be much easier to be on your own?

Gotta say my first thought was 'is he on the spectrum?' Can you Google typical traits? Dies this sound like him?
Maybe it is just anxiety but you need to get to the root of the behaviour and reasons in order to make any changes . It will alter your perspective and frustrations if you can work this out

I have been in your position to an extent, OP. My husband is someone who rarely seems to think outside the present moment. This can be nice sometimes, definitely, but it's a total pain when it comes to forward planning...

Something that might help, or be really eye-opening for him, is if you both sit down and make a master list of all the household responsibilities, including "strategy"-type responsibilities (e.g. short- and long-term planning, how to approach various problems, etc).

Tell him how you feel about having to be responsible for the bulk of things - overwhelmed, pressured, drained... Explain that you need him to contribute and that you weren't born knowing how to do all this, you had to learn through experience, and that he can learn too.

Has he ever looked after the children on his own? I feel like this is key to him developing some confidence and initiative.

Why are you such a pack of wolves ? If OP was the anxious one in this situation she would receive help and support.

He is going to counselling. He is asking her for guidance. He is not incompetent or feckless - he is anxious and looking for support. What more could he do?

@thepeopleversuswork

I’m sorry maybe I’m being harsh but I couldn’t function with someone like this.

Blaming that kind of incompetence on your upbringing only goes so far. Also anxiety etc: up a point but it’s only men who have the luxury of using anxiety as an excuse for incompetence. You don’t see women claiming to be too anxious to parent their own children,

The point of having a partner is supposed to be sharing the load. What on earth is the point of having an adult child to add to the workload? Would it not be much easier to be on your own?

Simply untrue. Many, many woman admit to struggling after having children - resenting their children , hiding from their screams and cries - and we support them. We would never ever belittle a woman in that position as we do men.

Why are we jumping to an armchair diagnosis when the more obvious solution is that his parents completely failed to teach him how to be an adult, and a good dose of laziness and sexism means that he expects his life to be managed by a woman? I find it concerning that so many people are so quick to attribute crap behaviour to being somehow “on the spectrum”.

Does he hold down a job? If he can do that he’s capable of behaving as a functional partner ought to.