#Trump thread No 111 and the count goes on.

[lionheart]

Come on over and let's see this through to the end.

Another reason for not taking Trump's legal threat too seriously is that he does not exactly have a crack legal squad. He was told weeks ago to get good lawyers together in all the swing states. They didn't. He was told weeks ago to find someone who could lead the effort. They didn't. Legal team is now Pam Bondi, Cory Lewandowski, Rudy Giuliani, and David Bossie, all of whom are known more for their right-wing/Trump activism more than their legal prowess.

They could still be messy, yes. They have some very sympathetic ears in the judiciary, yes (after all, Trump appointed over 200 lifetime federal judges). But taking full advantage of that is almost impossible, because like everything, they fucked up.

@grauduroi

Very informative thread, thank you (from a brit who also has a child in charge!).

Just out of curiosity, when could the Supreme court get involved and could it sway the outcome even if Biden gets the 270?

The SCOTUS gets involved as the final step in any litigation. But the lawsuits will have to work their way through the lower courts first. The SCOTUS then decides whether or not to make a ruling on cases placed before it. If they refuse to hear a case the lower court ruling stands and there are no further possible appeals. How long the whole meshuggaas takes is unknown, but I'm sure all courts involved will make election lawsuits a top priority.

As far as affecting the outcome, theoretically yes. It was SCOTUS' ruling to stop the count in FLA in 2000 that gave the election to GW Bush. But lawsuits in this case will be a very different kettle of fish. Bush v Gore just stopped the recount in one state and it didn't invalidate a certified result. Lawsuits now would be to challenge the outcome of certified results based on alleged 'fraud'.

As far as a timeline, who knows? Bush v Gore was decided in mid-December. But it was one lawsuit dealing with one issue. Scrotus is going to file multiple lawsuits dealing with multiple allegations. One of his business tactics has been to tie things up in litigation until his opponent ran out of money or just gave up due to 'legal emotional exhaustion'. I seriously think he believes the same tactic will work. He'll file suit after suit and eventually the USA will just say "Fine, keep the White House, we're too tired to deal with this anymore".

I definitely think she is lost in her little world. You can't argue with batshit. Hey ho.

He just needs to be diagnosed with some bone spurs and walk away from this fight too.

MAKE WAY FOR THE FAT LADY

🎶🎶
The party's over
It's time to call it a day
They've burst your
Pretty balloon
And taken your toys away

It's time to wind up
The masquerade
Just make your mind up
Deutschebank must be paid

The party's over
The candles flicker and dim
You frothed and screamed
Through the night
But you've lost the fight
And been dumped in the bin

Now you must wake up
All dreams must end
Take off your (orange panstick) makeup
The party's over
It's all over
You bigly orange bellend 🎶🎶

(with apologies to the original)

I admit to being a tad worried- I'm afraid it is only inevitable that close scrutiny will find a few overtly fraudulent ballots. Among so many, it's given...There will be Democrats who wanted to push the result. And of course the Trump team will leap all over these and cry foul, want the entire election deemed invalid

I'm NOT remotely thinking there has been gross fraud- TBH if there was an orchestrated effort, the fraudsters would have made sure they swung the House and the Senate!

Following on from someone's query upthread--- anyone know any update on Mark Meadows AND HIS RECENT CONTACTS? (ie the Trumplings)

DH has made me spend the morning with the 3 dimensional people. Back in front of CNN now (happy place).

This thread is such an education. I have followed US politics closely over the last 4 years, but have learned so much more in the last 4 days. Thanks to all the amazing posters.

RedToothBrush

Typically Electoral College votes follow the results of the public ballot but they don't have to. There have been occasions when they have gone against the public vote in some states - faithless electors. This did actually happen in 2016 (both for Clinton and Trump) but didn't change the result.

I saw an interview with General Colin Powell recently. I think he said he actually came 3rd in the 2016 election, despite not having run for office (beating Jill Stein who did run for the Greens). Some electors had returned his name instead!

This is the full Trump school trip skit from the President Show, including the tantrum. Everything running up to it is so funny too.

What I like most about Joe Biden's tweets is the total absence of exclamation marks and random capital letters

I can't watch today as I've lectures all day. It's very inconvenient I tell you.

Has Trump gone angry tweeting recently?

I would love to know how he behaves out of the public eye. I mean he evidently has no decorum but imagine if he actually makes an effort to be professional (in his head anyway).

@Nancydrawn

Another reason for not taking Trump's legal threat too seriously is that he does not exactly have a crack legal squad. He was told weeks ago to get good lawyers together in all the swing states. They didn't. He was told weeks ago to find someone who could lead the effort. They didn't. Legal team is now Pam Bondi, Cory Lewandowski, Rudy Giuliani, and David Bossie, all of whom are known more for their right-wing/Trump activism more than their legal prowess.

They could still be messy, yes. They have some very sympathetic ears in the judiciary, yes (after all, Trump appointed over 200 lifetime federal judges). But taking full advantage of that is almost impossible, because like everything, they fucked up.

What's also notable is how his top team of lawyers have fallen out with him.

None of them have their names attached to this bullshit despite their republican leanings. They want to have a career after he has gone.

Even specialist election lawyers are saying they won't get anywhere.

All it is, is an exercise in sub standard lawyers making a few big quick bucks which they wouldn't ever make through their stella skills (or lack of) , burning through many raised from conspiracy theorists to stir up unrest and burning though state and democrat money in order to defend it.

Eventually it will run out of steam.

I think for the most part its only still going because those closest to him are too afraid to stand up to him and know they are up shit creek when the dust settles and they lose his protection of office.

And beause Trump is having a temper tantrum and wants to smash everything on his way up and just incite violence to do that.

The IRS and Feds will be all over it.

Bruce oh yes. I loathed the exclamation marks especially when it was so out of order, like sending comiserations to the family of someone who'd died. It jarred.

Yes Cherry Trump is angry tweeting bigly. So many lies that CNN won't even repeat them. Enabled by Jim Jordan who is sound off big time

Mary Trump was so right. She said that if Trump can't have it, he will make sure to try to wreck it.

I am a complete convert to CNN live stream now. Loving John King.

@BruceAndNosh

I admit to being a tad worried- I'm afraid it is only inevitable that close scrutiny will find a few overtly fraudulent ballots. Among so many, it's given...There will be Democrats who wanted to push the result. And of course the Trump team will leap all over these and cry foul, want the entire election deemed invalid

I'm NOT remotely thinking there has been gross fraud- TBH if there was an orchestrated effort, the fraudsters would have made sure they swung the House and the Senate!

I'm not too worried about this. My understanding of the recount process is that it doesn't include an assessment of the validity of each ballot (they're anonymous so this would be difficult), it's just literally counting them again. The most it usually changes a count is a few hundred. I think this is just more bluff and bluster.

I think Trump is well aware that he has no case here. I think his aim now is undermining public faith in the democratic process. He also wants to call into question in the legitimacy of a Biden presidency, just like he did with his Obama birther conspiracy theorism.

@BruceAndNosh

Following on from someone's query upthread--- anyone know any update on Mark Meadows AND HIS RECENT CONTACTS? (ie the Trumplings)

I've not been able to find anything beyond what I posted last night.

He's been in contact with the Trump offspring - who've merrily been going round here, there and everywhere with Giuliani.

Given his lack of a mask at the HQ visit, on Air Force Once etc, there should be a lot of people in his contact tracing, but I bet they'll keep just how many quiet.

Did someone mention angry tweeting?

@JamieLeeCurtains

I am a complete convert to CNN live stream now. Loving John King.

Me too! I've never watched so much of the one channel.

My 10-year-old rolled his eyes this morning and said "I didn't even know there was a CNN channel before this"

If Trump does leave the US any bets on where he will go?

Also watching CNN today after having one eye on it all day yesterday. My 3 year old just said "We want the blue one to win, not the red one.... he's the baddie." I'm so proud!

@DeRigueurMortis

If Trump does leave the US any bets on where he will go?

Somewhere with no extradition treaty with the US?

@Flavabobble - that is a delight to see, thank you!

GUARDIAN NEWSFEED - Trump is GOING OUT! (I mean, leaving his bunker, destination unknown?) Dum dum dum, drumroll...

President Donald Trump appears to be on the move and about to go … somewhere?

Linda Feldmann, who is on press pool duty today has this update:

Pool has been Covid-tested and is now waiting in motorcade on WH south driveway, destination unannounced. The weather is spectacular - 57 degrees, will hit 70s by early afternoon, not a cloud in the sky.