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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

#closetheschools is trending

713 replies

Allthestarsarecloser · 01/11/2020 08:44

I work at a university on the front line seeing students 1-1 (I work in student support) and have continued to see students this term at a distance & with measures in place. ALL the students I have seen have been grateful for the human contact.

I also have 2 kids in primary and secondary. I want them to stay in school as my eldest had to have counselling after the last lockdown.

Aibu to say that schools need to stay open and I say that as someone on the front line.

YABU - they should shut
YANBU- they need to stay open

OP posts:
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Mumofsend · 01/11/2020 11:23

My DDs primary of 600 has had no cases. Nor has the three nearest.

The secondary school has had 2 cases. One further out within our LA had a few issues with transmission and multiple cases. The cases were all year 11 which fits with the higher years being a risk.

Admittedly we are South West but our particular LA is a hotspot and was tipped to be going to tier 2

echt · 01/11/2020 11:23

And yes unions don't have power to close schools but as they showed in June they do have the power to keep them closed

No. They. Don't.

StaffAssociationRepresentative · 01/11/2020 11:25

Lots of posters commenting on parents not following rules, need to socialise/mix, references to meet ups and parties etc

Just who is following the COVID rules? No wander cases are rising!

Look at your own behaviour people!

NoDramaMama14 · 01/11/2020 11:27

Seen a few of these threads, and have been stupid enough to give my opinion before realising, it generally doesn't matter what I think or want anymore. I will do as I am told by UK GOV. If they told me to eat 100g raw pineapple everyday for 7 days to avoid covid, I probably would. That is the problem with all this. The best we can be is adaptable at this point in time, and try to stay sane.

Witchend · 01/11/2020 11:28

@Allthestarsarecloser

I work at a university on the front line seeing students 1-1 (I work in student support) and have continued to see students this term at a distance & with measures in place. ALL the students I have seen have been grateful for the human contact.

I also have 2 kids in primary and secondary. I want them to stay in school as my eldest had to have counselling after the last lockdown.

Aibu to say that schools need to stay open and I say that as someone on the front line.

YABU - they should shut
YANBU- they need to stay open

To be quite fair, if you work in student support the students you see will be those who are grateful for the human contact. You're also doing 1-2-1 which is very different from facing 30 children, so it's a bit silly to say you don't mind when you're facing a very different situation. A bit like someone in the area I live in that has 7 sites where bombs fell in WWII saying that they didn't find the blitz very traumatic. What's more, on the basis support groups are still allowed, you would be still able to support them on a face to face.

I have a student. Actually she's really enjoying the online learning. She says she can listen to the lectures at her own speed. If she doesn't understand it, she can listen again. She can go back and rewatch if she doesn't remember a bit. It's working very well for her.
She feels the least useful thing is the face to face tutorial, where they have to wear face masks and keep their distance and it's really hard to see what the tutor is doing/saying. The online tutorials, done by Microsoft teams, I think, are far more helpful.
She's in a house with 2 other students doing the same subject, and they've agreed they basically isolate except for their face to face tutorial once a week and shopping.

Thing is people are saying it's not fair on children to send them home as different schools have different competence on home learning. Well, schools have different competence anyway! That doesn't change.
But at the moment it's even more choppy than normal. Half ds' year went home just before half term. 25% of year 7 missed 2 weeks just before that. 2/3 of year 12 have also had to isolate for a fortnight. And we're in a low area.
A friend's child (year 6, different school) is on her third bout of 14 days isolation currently. (yes, all school cases) The other year 6 class hasn't missed anything.
So you could have a child who is fine all the way through, and gets all their teaching, and another, even in the same school who misses months.
How is that any fairer?

Looking at the statistics, I think the current measures will stop the rise, and possibly lower it a little, but I don't think are going to make a huge drop.
Which means that either they'll have to backtrack and pull schools anyway, or they'll have to extend lockdown, or accept that more people will die.

The number of deaths are going up approximately half as much again each week. If this continues, in 3 weeks we'll be on approximately the same as the peak deaths in the first wave. In 4 weeks we'll be looking at around 10k deaths a week.
Oh! You're saying. They're people with health conditions and elderly people. They'd have died anyway. It won't be by then, not that it always was. It'll be people like you who there's no space for because people are already occupying the beds. The current increase in patients needing hospital treatment is the 25-40yo lady. The parents of these school children who don't spread it.
Then we've got the long covid. I know someone who had covid back at the start of April. No health conditions, young, didn't expect it to be a problem. She's still breathless going upstairs. That's not running upstairs. That's walking. It's limiting her life because she genuinely can't get on with day to day activities. She can't walk her children to school without frequent stops, she can't do the shopping on her own, even things like hanging the washing out makes her breathless enough to have to stop halfway through.

We all think (hope maybe) that we won't be effected by something like this. But the truth is we don't know. You could have had it and don't realise, or you could end up being one of the statistics.

Aragog · 01/11/2020 11:28

Schools are repeatably shown to be relatively low risk compared to many environments , yet there are posters constantly refusing to believe the data

Some of the data shows lower risk, some shows cases rises consistently within schools. Depends which data you look at and from when.

Regardless of the data, as a clinically vulnerable person I still, almost certainly, caught covid within school where my only close contacts are young children.

So yes, as I slowly recover and look forward to taking medication for the rest of my life, due to covid complications, from covid picked up in a school, I remain somewhat annoyed that school safety, regards covid, is being minimised constantly.

StaffAssociationRepresentative · 01/11/2020 11:38

People are adapting the rules to suit their own wants. Let’s just recognise that and the implications it may have.

We even had trick n treaters last night! I am still seething. Get a grip people

TicTacTwo · 01/11/2020 11:39

My kids want schools open and as they exam years then they need the education in person.

I understand why people without kids in education would want them closed though- they will be why lockdown doesn't end on 2nd December

Tinty · 01/11/2020 11:39

In my DDs secondary school, there have been no cases that we know of. The school haven't told anybody to isolate.

The only person that I actually know, that has tested positive is a nurse, who was told she had been in contact with a positive case (patient). The school has been back since September with no cases. They update us every week and no cases yet.

The cases started rising in August when lockdown was stopped, they have obviously just risen as everyone has gone back to work and eating out, getting haircuts etc, not just because DC's have gone back to school.

I think Boris's ultimate plan is to lockdown for a month with just some people going to work and DC going to school. Then in December cases will have dropped, maybe Uni cases will have burned themselves out (they are already dropping in my area).

Then Boris will say "look it worked, cases have dropped even though DC are at school."

I do wholeheartedly agree with DC going to school, they can't miss any more education, especially the exam years.

herecomesthsun · 01/11/2020 11:42

Schools are repeatably shown to be relatively low risk compared to many environments , yet there are posters constantly refusing to believe the data

1 in 50 of 7 to 11 year students have covid. Where the hell do you think they got it?

Why do you think year 7 to 11 figures appear to have the sharpest rate of increase of any group currently?

Could it just be that transmission is rife in schools, maybe?

Why do you not believe the data?

To quote the unions

"“It is clear from ONS data that schools are an engine for virus transmission. It would be self-defeating for the Government to impose a national lockdown, whilst ignoring the role of schools as a major contributor to the spread of the virus."

TicTacTwo · 01/11/2020 11:44

maybe Uni cases will have burned themselves out (they are already dropping in my area).

BJ and Gav need a plan so that the uni students don't spread to their areas over Xmas and bring back the virus in Jan.

Lazypuppy · 01/11/2020 11:46

If they close nurseries, half of my team will be off work on special paid peave as we refuse to WFH again with toddlers. It nearly broke all of us the first time. That means very little work getting done this side of Christmas.

Schools/unis/nurseries need to stay open. Businesses that can keep operating need the staff to be able to.

The children need to be at school, socialising and being educated

Devilesko · 01/11/2020 11:47

All educational and childcare needs to be closed, just for a short space of time.
Whatever measures are in place aren't working.
I would much rather mine be in school, but let's face it they aren't getting a very good experience there atm, being sent home and education suffering with them being there.

herecomesthsun · 01/11/2020 11:48

Here are some figures.

In secondary age schools children, there was a 50 fold increase in cases between 1st September and 23rd October. That is higher than any other group, much higher therefore than community transmission.

Do you have any intelligent explanation of that other than a massive transmission in schools?

Nah, thought not.

#closetheschools is trending
TicTacTwo · 01/11/2020 11:48

Schools are repeatably shown to be relatively low risk compared to many environments ,

Have you seen how overcrowded state secondary schools are? The environment is perfect for transmission just like the workplaces that have had outbreaks.

If they mass tested secondary schools they would have as much Covid as unis did imo. Only 10% of uni students had symptoms so considering that secondary school students are a similar size physically, there's going to be loads of cases (100s of thousands) not showing in official data.

Thrownaway · 01/11/2020 11:49

Dont all the kids mixing threads currently probe though that while schools are open that people will not be following guidance?

Appuskidu · 01/11/2020 11:51

maybe Uni cases will have burned themselves out (they are already dropping in my area)

Thousands of students will all be heading back home across the country in 5 or 6 weeks-I can’t see that ending well.

BlueStethoscope · 01/11/2020 11:51

@ohnothisagain

Other countries are keeping schools open and cases are going down. I also find it interesting that teachers unions (where members have nothing to loose from lockdown, but are very comfortable) push for closure, but you don’t hear anything about the need to close from early years practitioners who’s risk is much higher (bodily fluids etc), but who will loose their jobs and income....
That sounds promising. I also agree with the Early year settings and that unions are trying to shut schools. It's a difficult situation all around. Please let's all stick to the rules now, and get on with it.

I truly hope that when we come out of lockdown in December (hopefully) the government won't allow foreign travel over Christmas. I firmly believe that holiday makers pushed the rates up in August and September and it snowballed from there.

Air travel should strictly be for very exceptional circumstance at least until Easter or next summer.

No Ski holidays this year and no visiting your family abroad please. I have family abroad and haven't seen them since last Christmas because of covid. We'd usually see each other many times a year.

TiersTiersTiers · 01/11/2020 11:52

One case at our secondary year 11 pupil....no spread ...no teachers ill....

No way should it close

Devilesko · 01/11/2020 11:54

Maybe the Army could be used at schools taking temperatures on arrival, like my dd school do. Except obviously it's the school staff at present.
You don't get through the gate if you aren't normal, staff or child. Only one case since March, that's a hell of achievement considering international students, day and boarding.

BlueStethoscope · 01/11/2020 11:56

The unions are working hard on Mumsnet.

Remember that fellow posters.

TiersTiersTiers · 01/11/2020 11:56

@Mumofsend

My DDs primary of 600 has had no cases. Nor has the three nearest.

The secondary school has had 2 cases. One further out within our LA had a few issues with transmission and multiple cases. The cases were all year 11 which fits with the higher years being a risk.

Admittedly we are South West but our particular LA is a hotspot and was tipped to be going to tier 2

Indeed similar here yet a call to close schools from teachers with guaranteed income. We had one single case yet apparently schools are hotbeds of infection...rubbish
TiersTiersTiers · 01/11/2020 11:57

@ohnothisagain

Other countries are keeping schools open and cases are going down. I also find it interesting that teachers unions (where members have nothing to loose from lockdown, but are very comfortable) push for closure, but you don’t hear anything about the need to close from early years practitioners who’s risk is much higher (bodily fluids etc), but who will loose their jobs and income....
This
Thatwentbadly · 01/11/2020 11:58

Keep them open but at secondary there needs to be big changes. Secondary schools are not ‘covid secure’ and teenagers are not like young children who are less like to spread it.

StaffAssociationRepresentative · 01/11/2020 12:00

@BlueStethoscope

The unions are working hard on Mumsnet.

Remember that fellow posters.

What unions? You mean Us For Them?
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