AIBU for giving partner a 'bedtime'

[Braneycat]

Okay, context

My partner is not the best drunk. In the past there has been alot of trauma due to his drinking, from fights (with me and others) vile arguments, even got arrested once. He has grown out of all that but he still has a stupid habit of not knowing when the party ends, and goes too hard.

Now, on normal days this is fine. If I don't have work, I don't care what time he comes home (I mean I do, but it would be unreasonable of me to give him a time). But there have been occasions in the past where he's come home so late or so drunk I've had to call his mum early hours to pick my children up so I can go to work.

Now this is an argument that we've had for years, that he thinks it's unreasonable for me to ask him to come home at a certain time (2am). He does NOT like being told what to do. Normally he's fairly chill (like I said he has grown out of alot of his past bad behaviour) but frankly I don't trust him and the last thing I want before an NHS 12 hour Sunday shift is to be up worrying that he's going to be coming home in a fit state.

So, we compromised that he wouldn't drink much. He took a 4 pack of beers with him tonight, which won't get him tipsy. But to me it still feels dicey. He still won't commit to a certain time to be home by.

Tonight I've decided to trust him and 'let' him go. He doesn't go out drinking often anymore, even before the pandemic, and figured if we're going into another lockdown he won't know when he'll get to see his friends again (all properly done, rule of 6/outside area/social distanced btw, they're all fairly sensible. My anxiety would not let him go at all if I didn't think he was being safe) but its 1am and I can't sleep for fear he's not going to behave.

Is asking him to come home at 2am when I have work in the morning, even sober, really that unreasonable?

Yabu to give any adult a bedtime
YANBU to LTB

@Hobnobsandbroomstick no sorry, I mis spoke. They're both our children.

Now I'm starting to worry about my own drinking with these standards 😬

YABU to even have to do this to yourself. By the time you're setting bedtimes for a reckless adult and putting into words that you don't trust him, there can't be much joy in this scenario for you.

Guys you really are reading abit too much into this

You said you don't trust him, OP.
Listen to your own voice. What's your gut saying? Are you happy? Is this good enough for you and the kids? If it's all in the past, why are you here on MN now? Think about your answer. You don't need to even share it with us. Just be honest with yourself.

He has not 'failed our kids' since these incidents years ago, but I still worry

So the problem is your worry, rather than his behaviour?

I voted YABU, not because I think it's unreasonable to expect your partner home at a resonable hour when he is responsible for childcare the next, but because I think it's sheer madness to put up with this sort of irresponsibility from the father of your children. YABU for tolerating this.

He needs to step up, and you need to have a serious conversation about sharing responsibilities equally. To do that, he will need to start acting responsibly.

I don't think you are being unreasonable at all. My boyfriend used to wake me up before a 12 hour shift when he was drunk, say I had to get up at 5.30am, he'd wake me up at 2/3am and I wouldn't be able to get back to sleep. It was torture. In the end I went mad at him and said if he did it again I was moving out. He slept on the sofa or at a friends house from then on. If he still did it now I couldn't take the stress, and that's without him being a nasty drunk or having any kids. Your partner sounds very selfish and irresponsible.

I think you’re minimising, totally understandably, because you didn’t expect this strong reaction. It’s wobbled you off your standpoint of many years. Use it as a springboard to question why you posted, what you want, and where you see this going for years ahead. I read into your posts a feeling that wish you hadn’t opened the box on here, you back pedal quite a bit. You may feel attacked. I get that. But the majority of posters on here want to help you.

After years of minimising, you’re not going to suddenly turn this around, but it’s worth looking inside at yourself, what are you prepared to put up with for the rest of your life? You don’t seem to value yourself very highly. You are entitled to be happy, to strive for happiness, and you are entitled not to clock-watch at night time, and entitled to free yourself of stressful feelings caused by someone else.

I don't think it's unreasonable to discuss how someone's behaviour is impacting you. I think it's possibly unreasonable with what's written to expect that just him coming home at a certain time is going to stop the underlying fears.

I have a lot of anxiety around drunk people. My spouse has respected that by not being drunk around me - he's gone out occasionally and I know his brother used to try his best to get everyone plastered, but I never saw it. Everything from childcare to where he would sleep was arranged so he could do that while impacting on me and the kids as little as possible.

The past still has an effect, especially when it's the same person. Alcohol and late nights equalling aggression and chaos is a hard thing to unlearn, it's your brain trying to protect you even when that old pattern has faded. Part of that is on you to work through at your pace, but it's also largely of him - things having changed doesn't erase the pain he's caused and is still causing. I wouldn't view it as controlling that part of going out with his friends is arranging practical things to minimize the impact on you and the kids.

Having been the kid who has had to deal with and care for an intoxicated parent, I don't think it's hysterical to think that parents who choose to use recreational drugs as their way of letting loose and spending time with friends shouldn't do so in a way that impact kids & negative effects on loved ones and life should be minimized. There are plenty of other ways to do those things, and if that's someone's choice, they need to arrange things for that.

Also, along with fears from the past, there is the anxiety that it will repeat - and part of the issue of kids 'straightening things out' (rather than dealing with it before having kids) is that that doesn't always last. I'd argue often from those I've known who fell back into it especially once their oldest was viewed as old enough to drink, but I haven't seen the research on this topic and that might have been a community thing, when with people who drink heavily, it's more likely to come back.

Let HIM take care of his kids, severely hungover or not. That will teach him a valuable lesson. Now you are just enabling his behaviour

Don’t do this. Don’t use your kids to “teach a lesson” It isn’t their fault and being taken care of by someone who has a hangover won’t be pleasant for them. I can’t understand why this is so often the fall back on MN. If a man doesn’t want to look after his children, forcing him to do so is unfair on the kids.

Leave him OP. Setting him a bedtime isn’t the answer.

* I think the main issue is that he sees OP as default parent and himself as a single man. *

^I think this is the key issue. They’re his DC, too, so he should be the one arranging childcare with his DM and not leaving it to the OP to do so.

I have to say, though, that he sounds to me like he has a problem with binge drinking, and once he starts he can’t control it. It’s immature at the very least.

I would tell him not to come home at all. He is an adult with responsibilities and yet getting drunk comes first

YABU for staying with him and putting up with this shit.

@PeppermintPasty

I think you’re minimising, totally understandably, because you didn’t expect this strong reaction. It’s wobbled you off your standpoint of many years. Use it as a springboard to question why you posted, what you want, and where you see this going for years ahead. I read into your posts a feeling that wish you hadn’t opened the box on here, you back pedal quite a bit. You may feel attacked. I get that. But the majority of posters on here want to help you.

After years of minimising, you’re not going to suddenly turn this around, but it’s worth looking inside at yourself, what are you prepared to put up with for the rest of your life? You don’t seem to value yourself very highly. You are entitled to be happy, to strive for happiness, and you are entitled not to clock-watch at night time, and entitled to free yourself of stressful feelings caused by someone else.

This

Living with an alcoholic is hard. Especially a 'nasty' one that gets into fights.

I once met a chap {Now RIP from drink related issues} and his infidelity and aggression when pissed made me end it for my own sanity.

Sober, he was charming..Drunk, an irresponsible sulky child.

OP, you deserve so much better.

Did I understand this correctly? His drinking/staying late is not a problem anymore but due to past experiences you are worried that it is. He hasn't done enough to convince you that he will be ok, therefore you are worrying cause you don't trust him to be ok with the kids the next day?

How old are the DC? Are they old enough to get themselves breakfast and to use a phone? So could they have someone to call, if Daddy won't wake up?

What a horrible option for the kids. "Can you come help us, daddy won't wake up.

Yes, it's a horrible option but this is the horrible reality this man sometimes imposes on his family.

He needs to face that, rather than expecting his wife to swoop in, mother him and magic all his paternal responsibilities away.

OP said: But there have been occasions in the past where he's come home so late or so drunk I've had to call his mum early hours to pick my children up so I can go to work.

He hates being told what to do - but he's happy to be mothered like a poorly toddler? Weird kind of self-respect he has.

So he needs to be the adult and organise the childcare needed to cover his socialising (and its consequences).

OP has already organised childcare to cover her working day. Him. If he can no longer meet that commitment, he's the parent who needs to make plans for cover.

I just don't get how he can be all 'nobody tells me what to do' one moment, then all 'poor little hungover me... but mummy and wifey will sort it all out for me', the next. Those are contradictory positions. Either he needs to be looked after like a baby (reasonably including having a bedtime imposed), or he doesn't.

So I think YABU to indulge him OP, by colluding in his contradictory, cognitively dissonant behaviour.

You both know that drinking causes hangovers and that sometimes he's in no fit state to care for his children, when he's committed to do so.

For you to be able to relax enough to sleep well, you need to be able to rely on him to face up to the consequences of his choices and plan accordingly.

Why do you have a cupboard full of alcohol if you dont drink at home?
If 4 cans of beer doesnt even get him tipsy he could easily be having the odd drink while you are out and you wouldn't even know.
Also he had 4 cans of beer but was still "sober" would he still be able to drive your dc to A and E in an emergency or would he be over drink driving limit??
Sounds like both of you may have had alcohol problems in the past but youve had to grow up and maybe he hasn't had to adjust his behaviour as much as you. Saying he hasnt attacked you when drunk for 4 years shows he has improved but inevitably it will have left emotional scars that you might have brushed under the carpet and left unacknowledged. Has he ever admitted the hurt and pain he has caused you? Possibly couple counselling will help rebuild trust.
But yanbu to expect him to be able to provide childcare for DC whilst you are at work and that means coming home at a reasonable time so he is awake and below drink driving limit to engage with them and look after them safely.

I read your post and felt tired, OP. Years of striving to police a grown man. There's more to this 1 life.

@DeeCeeCherry

I read your post and felt tired, OP. Years of striving to police a grown man. There's more to this 1 life.

Exactly this. So tiring. I had a boyfriend like this for a long while. I’ve been happily married to someone else for 10 years, but I still think back to those times and thank god I didn’t marry the guy who came home wasted at 5am or not at all, wet the bed, left the front door open. OP, I can’t imagine my residual anxiety about his behaviour would have faded over time either. Hell, I haven’t even seen the guy for a decade, never had kids with him, and I still think about how awful it was.

When I opened this thread I was expecting a drumbeat insert answer.
AIBU for giving partner a 'bedtime' massage, blowjob, foot rub.
Given your updates and the fact he has changed come to a compromise on a monthly night out. You shouldn't be worried if he has truly changed hopefully he has.
It is tough pre lockdown I worked nights and weekends there was no weekends off unless military planned it was tough socially.

@SentientAndCognisant

Posting just to say sigh is really wanky and passive aggressive.shocking Op, he’s an argumentative,problem drinker. Sadly you can’t negotiate with that He needs to decide to behave responsibly and he needs to take responsibility for that

No it isn't. It's what you write when there are really no words....

Op. Some folks literally get hysterical on here at the thought of someone going out and getting drunk every couple of months. Are you like them. Do you wish to be? If not then disregard their responses.

🙄🙄

DH and I enjoy a drink every weekend, and most weekends involve getting together with friends for just such good times. We are very far from teetotallers - indeed, the idea is laughable.

But our experience sounds vastly different from the weary situation described in the OP, and frankly, I think you’ve been deeply disingenuous on this thread.

Or, perhaps, the ‘socialising’ the OP describes her DH partaking in genuinely sounds like a good time to you?

"We don't drink at home at all"

This was a BIG thing my parents used to bang on about! Meanwhile dad was pissed at the pub most nights and aggressive with it, even before he was drinking every night when he used to "only" drink on a Saturday night it was his BEHAVIOUR when drunk was the problem. He'd ALWAYS come home spoiling for a fight!

That he drinks infrequently IS NOT THE POINT!

And it's an excuse used by MANY alcoholics and their enablers,

"Alot of the horrible traumatic drunk things he did happened early in our relationship"

To be perfectly honest that begs the question why you didn't dump him then? Do/did you have similar issues with alcohol? Did a parent?

"He's like a different person now" no he's not - truly!

"The only person who can change the behaviour of an alcoholic is the alcoholic themselves"

Yep!

"he’s been out four times since feb and doesn’t drink in between, get a grip for gods sake".

the frequency is irrelevant. There are different types of alcoholics/problem drinkers, the frequency isn't what defines alcoholism it's the effects when they DO drink on themselves and others and their behaviour when they drink. And this has been during lockdown too so fewer opportunities to go out and get drunk

Honestly how often does he do it outside of lockdown/covid op? How often last year?

"Also definitely not an alcoholic everyone, could possibly have been accused of that 10 years ago but not now."

Well I - and the alcoholics in my family who've successfully achieved long term sobriety - would say "once an alcoholic always an alcoholic" the ones who haven't achieved long term sobriety don't believe that - make of that what you will

"Irrespective of how frequently this happens, there's a serious issue"

exactly

"I think there's an elephant in the room- op said it had been 4 years since he had last become aggressive when drunk.
Are you scared of him when he's drunk?"

Yea I'm wondering about that too

"The fact that they don’t have alcohol in the house is telling too, because if he didn’t have a problem they would be able keep it in the house untouched for a while"

True

"How old are the DC? Are they old enough to get themselves breakfast and to use a phone? So could they have someone to call, if Daddy won't wake up?"

As someone who's been a child in that type of potential scenario it's a dreadful idea! He'd blame the kids for "embarrassing" him! To be honest I wouldn't risk their safety with this either given he can be aggressive!

"We have a cupboard full of alcohol (vodka, whisky, rum, bacardi plus beers in the garden) that aren't touched because we don't drink at home."

That makes NO sense at all and frankly I'm sceptical!

I think your posts today are disingenuous as they're coming from a place of relief that he didn't let you all down THIS time

Your current attitude is a case of you wishing to have "a triumph of hope over experience" which is not likely really.

"All of your subsequent posts are making excuses for him."

I totally agree

Speak to al anon or similar op, I think you'll find they've heard everything you're saying before!

I also agree his and your attitude that going out to get drunk is an actual planned goal is extremely worrying!

"Or have some standards?"

From experience of dealing with such drinkers too, as children or as adults

"What was happening 4 years ago OP?"

Yes they seem to be studiously avoiding that don't they?

Whatever we are "reading into" is based on what you post as much as anything else

"If 4 cans of beer doesnt even get him tipsy he could easily be having the odd drink while you are out and you wouldn't even know." that thought crossed my mind too

I have been over the years someone who socialises where I drank alcohol, a teetotal (partly due to meds being incompatible, but also dd was little and I was a single mum and I needed to be very on the ball) and now I'll have an occasional drink if I feel like it but it's not a regular thing.

Even in my late teens/20's I was never a big drinker, partly due to my own family history yes, but also because I genuinely don't like the feeling of being drunk which occurred a couple of times when I was younger and yet to learn my limit and once when a dick "friend" of ex's mickeyed me "for a laugh" arse!

I don't like the loss of control and I don't like the dizziness, nausea etc it gives me. Where I'm unusual I don't get hangovers, a factor I am sure is part of the problem for those in my family who are alcoholics as they don't get them either.

But I have been and am (if I weren't otherwise ill) perfectly capable of having a night out, socialising, dancing etc without a drink at all or having a few but not getting drunk per se - this is something that is true for the vast majority of people.

I have one ex who every time he drank he was spoiling for a fight, which was ridiculous as he's a small guy and it usually meant he got himself a battering when he picked on someone like himself but who was bigger and stronger! I gave him an ultimatum stop drinking or we're done, he chose the drink albeit not by saying so but by saying he'd stop then the very following weekend getting absolutely rat arsed, then blew up my phone with aggressive messages! I was asleep at the time in my own home but as soon as I saw them that was it, he was gone!

It's a choice op, your choice.
And indecision is STILL a choice!

But you're not only making that decision for you but for your dc too and I'm telling you as the child of a similar man it is NOT acceptable to continue exposing them to his behaviour around drinking. It's not fair on them and it's not safe - even IF it's safe physically which I strongly suspect is doubtful at best, but for their mental/emotional health, their sense of home being a safe, relaxing and welcoming place at all times,

YABU to allow your children to be raised like this.
How can you be with him? Any good points?