My daughter has become terrified of our neighbour.

[Tillygetsit]

We have a very sweet old lady who has lived next door to us ever since we moved to this house 7 years ago. She often in the past has popped in for coffee, brought the dcs presents and us runner beans from her garden. She wouldn't hurt a fly.
Obviously we haven't seen as much of her with the Covid situation, just the odd wave and me phoning to see if she wants anything from the shops. She doesn't as she has nearby family but it's an excuse to chat and keep contact.
She often waves at dcs as we plod home from school or go for a walk. The last few times this has happened, dd1 who is 6 has screamed and run up the road. It is really embarrassing.
Ndn has phoned to see if she's done anything wrong (no) and I have had several chats with dd to get to the bottom of why she has suddenly decided she's afraid of ndn. All she says is that she hates her and her horrible witchy face
I've told her she's being very unkind, that ndn is a lovely person we've all known for a long time, that waving back and not being silly is the right thing to do but this is met with hands over ears screaming shut up.
My dd1 has always been a bit overdramatic but I honestly don't know how to handle this.
Am I being unreasonable to take a hard line about this?

[juicingqueen74]

Raspberry... Its sad that you see talking to and understanding children as hard line psychotherapy! Young children, adolescents and us adults too! have worries fears and things that really frighten us and listening and understanding obviously work. Punishing fear doesn't make it go away it just makes it turn into anxiety and later a children who feels they cannot turn to parents when they need us most. So they depend on other defences to help them cope. Anyway sorry OP I hope you feel like you have some help here as it sounds like a stressful situation.

[Iminaglasscaseofemotion]

The fact that she is comfortable screaming infront of this woman, and saying the words "she hates her and her witchy face" and when told off puts her hands over her ears and shouts "shut up", makes me think your dds manners aren't great in the first place.
Mine would get severely punished for being so rude.

[Meepmeeep]

@DownThePlath elaborate please. If you didn’t read my post I did actually state the child was being rude too. Some of the responders clearly couldn’t wait to rip into the original poster and her parenting skills.

[Rangoon]

I can't even begin to imagine the punishment that would have rained down on me if I had behaved like that at that age. I was an incredibly shy child but my mother insisted that if I was walking up the street and one of the neighbours was outside I had to at least say "Good morning/afternoon, Mr/s Smith". I had a very quiet voice and if they were gardening or something they might not hear me the first two times so I ended up bellowing "Good morning". In retrospect, it was character building and I did end up being to talk to almost anybody about almost anything which has been professionally useful.

[C8H10N4O2]

How would you handle it if she behaved this way to someone with a disability or of a difference race?

[RaspberryCoulis]

@juicingqueen74 - the OP has done the nicey nicey talking and pandering bit and the behaviour persists.

It's not ok for her DD to behave like this, whatever the reason.

[ppeatfruit]

Yes Meep How do some of these posters who advocate 'coming down like a ton of hot bricks' think that will help? Why not get a whip out? FGS

As others have said SHE'S SIX YEARS OLD,. They are not entirely rational they are still growing up and coming to terms with the world. All those 'sweet' fairy tales, that are everywhere in the media that get told to children from infancy, contribute to irrational fears.

Please discuss her fears with her and explain the above to her. Your neighbour will understand she's an adult.

Don't punish a child for being a child. Reward for being in control.

[DownThePlath]

It's not "rude" of adults to call out very poor behaviour. Which this is.

[Flightsoffancy]

@RaspberryCoulis Absolutely no one is saying that the behaviour is ok. No one! But posters are suggesting ways to change that behaviour which are more empathetic and meaningful (not 'nicey nicey' and 'pandering') than punishment.

[Meepmeeep]

@ppeatfruit

Yes Meep How do some of these posters who advocate 'coming down like a ton of hot bricks' think that will help? Why not get a whip out? FGS

As others have said SHE'S SIX YEARS OLD,. They are not entirely rational they are still growing up and coming to terms with the world. All those 'sweet' fairy tales, that are everywhere in the media that get told to children from infancy, contribute to irrational fears.

Please discuss her fears with her and explain the above to her. Your neighbour will understand she's an adult.

Don't punish a child for being a child. Reward for being in control.

With the likely outcome being the child becoming more scared of this neighbour as she’ll associate punishment with her.

Before I’m jumped on, of course the behaviour should not go unchallenged.

[CulturallyAppropriatedName]

DownthePlath
My "pandering" approach (discussion of life stories, outlined above) does NOT accept the behaviour that is arising as a result of this irrational fear. It attempts to stop the behaviour by removing the fear.

Your "stop it, it's incredibly rude" approach may suppress the behaviour, but it does nothing whatsoever to tackle the fear that is causing that behaviour. This means that a) it is much more likely to recurr and b) the DD might just do other things to avoid the fear trigger, like ignoring the neighbour or running past her house.

So I will stick with my methods, ta.

[MargeProopsSpecs]

Call her, 'the lady/woman next door,' drop the 'old.'
It has such scary connotations for children/adults
due to descriptions like, the old witch, the old crone etc.
The ndn is just a woman/lady the same as half the population.

Apologies if someone has already posted about this - I haven't read
all the posts.

[mrsmuddlepies]

Sorry if it has already been said, but what would you do if a child started screaming at someone because they were overweight, black or disabled?
I think you are being really sensible OP, I am shocked by the posters who seem to think its ok to be afraid of old women or indeed anyone old.
Talking through fears is a good thing and reading books about being kind to everyone no matter what they look like.

[tearinyourhand]

At six she is old enough to have a chat about how society views old ladies as sinister and how misogynistic that is. Obviously not using those words as that might be a bit over her head (although you'd be surprised by how much some six year olds understand). But fear of old ladies and associating them with witches is longstanding. At least in 2020 we're only dealing with the poor lady having her feelings hurt. 400 years ago if your daughter had developed a sudden terror of her elderly next door neighbour, the poor woman would probably have been dunked in the nearest river to see if she floats.

There is a very high chance that some day your daughter will be an elderly lady so it might be worth gently examining with her how she would feel right now if, having done nothing wrong, someone she knows started screaming when they saw her because they find her face so horrible. That is definitely something a six year old can get their head round.

[SleepOhHowIMissYou]

Hopefully this will pass with Halloween OP.

If it doesn't, try some positive reinforcement with kind depictions of older women. Cinderella's Fairy Godmother, Gangster Granny, the fairies from Sleeping Beauty are all age appropriate.

[CaptainMyCaptain]

@nestisflown

Don’t listen to the people on here OP- your child is six. SIX. I had the most irrational fear of slugs at that age. If I saw one I froze could not move and panicked. Would turn around and walk the other way or had to be carried over them by my parents. Had my parents made me walk over them - touch them or try engage with the slugs I would have never trusted them again. You can’t just tell someone to get over an irrational fear- especially a child.

The screaming isn’t really ok but I don’t agree with the harsh punishment others have suggested on your fearful child. Imagine punishing a child for being scared. Crazy.

I doubt if the slug had its feelings hurt by your behaviour. Show some sensitivity to the ndn who might well be feeling upset by this.

[Duanphen]

Hands over ears and screaming 'shut up' would mean X minutes on the naughty step. Absolutely no tolerance for that.

After that, yeah fuck it, the kid's being a brat. There's no actual contact with you basically waving at a friend, there's no evidence the neighbour has hurt her and she isn't asking to break personal boundaries. Your kid need to learn not to be rude. Imagine what a bully she'll be if a child joins her classroom who doesn't meet her standards of beauty.

Where on earth did she learn what 'ugly' and 'witchy' meant in such a negative context anyway? Does she watch a lot of trash TV?

[ChrissyPlummer]

@Tillygetsit I remember a Care Bears story from when I was that age called ‘The Witch down the Street’. Very similar to what you describe. I remember it from when I was that age. Available on EBay and Amazon. Might help?

www.goodreads.com/book/show/1306399.The_Witch_Down_the_Street

[Knittedfairies]

Is there a possibility that any Hallowe'en activities at school have caused this reaction to your neighbour? Any witch-y stories read to the class?

[ItWorriesMeThisKindofThing]

In a few weeks all the threads on here will be about when you should tell 10 year olds that Father Christmas isn’t real or whether you should complain that a teacher let slip something about Santa to a class of 7 year olds.....but to some posters it’s not feasible that this child actually had a real fear of this elderly woman? It has to be attention seeking even though she doesn’t normally behave like this?

[TheSeedsOfADream]

@nestisflown

Don’t listen to the people on here OP- your child is six. SIX. I had the most irrational fear of slugs at that age. If I saw one I froze could not move and panicked. Would turn around and walk the other way or had to be carried over them by my parents. Had my parents made me walk over them - touch them or try engage with the slugs I would have never trusted them again. You can’t just tell someone to get over an irrational fear- especially a child.

The screaming isn’t really ok but I don’t agree with the harsh punishment others have suggested on your fearful child. Imagine punishing a child for being scared. Crazy.

Are you comparing the feelings of a person to a slug?
Sheesh.

[DownThePlath]

@CulturallyAppropriatedName

DownthePlath
My "pandering" approach (discussion of life stories, outlined above) does NOT accept the behaviour that is arising as a result of this irrational fear. It attempts to stop the behaviour by removing the fear.

Your "stop it, it's incredibly rude" approach may suppress the behaviour, but it does nothing whatsoever to tackle the fear that is causing that behaviour. This means that a) it is much more likely to recurr and b) the DD might just do other things to avoid the fear trigger, like ignoring the neighbour or running past her house.

So I will stick with my methods, ta.

I never told you to alter your methods 😂

[timeforanewstart]

Tell your daughter she has to hold your hand whilst walking past and for now she doesn't have to speak but she is not to run away , and she can't if she is holding your hand
But putting her hands over her ears and screaming to you to shut up ? Is that everytime you speak to her about it ?

[Aridane]

Which would still be offensive to neighbour !

And perhaps just attention seeking instead of primal fear ...

[Wellpark]

I'm puzzled as to why the OP needs to check on here whether she is doing the right thing to come down on this behaviour. It's very simple the child is choosing to behave in bad mannered and melodramatic fashion. In days gone by shed have had a slap on the bottom and sent to bed with no dinner for her cheek both to the old lady and her own mother. I don't advocate slapping but I do take issue with endlessly explaining why cheeky behaviour is wrong. Sometimes you have to get angry and show children that rotten behaviour towards others makes adults cross with you.