To be furious at GP....

[Dopeyduck]

Saw GP on Friday as DS was screaming inconsolably. Confirmed ear infection in both ears. As no temp no antibiotics were given. Pain relief and call back in a couple of days if no better.

Saturday DS developed a temp. By the middle of Saturday night it was 39.9 after paracetamol and ibuprofen, so I called 111 and spoke to out of hours GP.

She refused to see him as he had a temp - re covid, even though it’s an ear infection. Wouldn’t give antibiotics without seeing him and said ‘he’s probably just burning it off.’

Sunday DS is really poorly but temp is only 38.8. Called out of hours to be told they still won’t see him but he’s getting better.

Monday DS is worse still so I contact GP. They also won’t see him and tell me to keep at home or take to A&E if I’m very worried.

At 2am Tuesday morning I did take him up to A&E. temp 39.9 still. A&E were great and he was seen quickly by a lovely doctor. Doc took one look in his ears and said he’s got a very severe infection in both and he needs antibiotics immediately. He was appalled that nobody had prescribed antibiotics when he worsened and that they didn’t see him.

I now have a very very poorly baby who has suffered for 5 days because in my opinion the GP failed to give him adequate care because they’re more concerned about covid than sick kids.

I do understand covid is very serious situation but a temp is a symptom of many things. Covid or not sick children shouldn’t be ignored.

AIBU to complain?

It’s times like this that remind me what love and being a parent really is. It’s not that overwhelming rush at birth, it’s sitting unwashed without sleep trying to comfort a screaming child and wishing you could take their place or make it stop. Parents really are, for the most part, remarkable people.

Quite.

@YouDidWHATNow that is truly shit. Please, please make an official (written) complaint.

I find GPs mostly not fit for purpose. A competent advanced nurse practitioner can deal with most things and could refer to consultants in the area of concern for other problems - apart from this country doesn't have enough hospital consultants either.

GPs seem to specialise in fobbing people off, minimising, patronising and pretending there isn't a problem.

To balance this, although my GP surgery has been running drastically reduced services during covid - they are very good if it's an emergency.

Receptionists in particular get a bad rep, but the ones at my practice are always very nice and helpful.

Complain.
When my ds was small he was always seen asap with sore ears and always given antibiotics.
You gp surgery was totally uncaring imo.

GPs seem to specialise in fobbing people off, minimising, patronising and pretending there isn't a problem.

I’m so frightened of my baby or husband getting ill, because we essentially don’t have a GP at the moment. I feel there’s nowhere to turn and we’re on our own when it comes to our health

@BuggerBognor - some things such as moles can be viewed in the first instance via photos or video. GP takes a full history in the telephone consultation - competent GPs are very capable of this. Patients are brought in for physical examination where necessary but these can then be kept brief and safe for everyone. Sometimes it's appropriate to take a history, order some investigations and then arrange a face to face review - again, competent GPs are very capable of making this judgement.

@Tappering - I still disagree with you. Human beings generally, whether in the NHS or in private practice, do not react well to criticism, especially where being struck off or sued for large sums of money are a possibility. If someone feels like their entire profession is being criticised, they will likewise feel defensive and react accordingly. It’s human nature, not specific to the NHS. Same would apply if solicitors felt they were being attacked generally by members of the public about being greedy, lazy, corrupt lawyers - irrelevant whether they receive money through legal aid or direct from their client (as many threads on mumsnet show, particularly in relation to conveyancing!).

That is really awful, op. How is he doing now?

DS is home. If I can keep him below 40 he can stay home. If not we have to go into hospital for IV.

I absolutely have no issue with the 1st doctor not giving antibiotics - and I’m sure had he know I wouldn’t have been able to access effective OOH care all weekend he would have given a delayed script - but of course he presumed there would be an appropriate OOH service.

My issue is not that we weren’t given antibiotics immediately - it’s that I was then fobbed off for 4 days resulting in an 11 month old baby suffering.

Someone asked if he had been covid swabbed - yes as soon as he had a temp but the results came back this afternoon - another service that’s shoddy but that’s another thread.

Unsurprisingly he doesn’t have covid - because he has an ear infection.

@BuggerBognor - according to the latest Standard Operating Procedure for GPs as published by NHS England:

GPs should be open for delivery of face to face care whilst triaging remotely in advance where possible. Online consultations need to be made available and remote consultations should be used where possible.

GP is not ok.

But I have to tell that you should have used your own sense - you sound like you understand the situation, no? Once the temperature rose and GP refused to prescribe antibiotics you should have gone to A&E (it that’s the only place that would see you). It sounds like you thought that your child should be seen and this is then ultimately up to you as his guardian yo take him to the doctor. GP is not responsible for you child, you are.
I not blaming you of course just saying that this is the mindset you should have for the future. The world is full of incompetent, blaze and just plain irresponsible doctors, in all specializations. Just like in any profession some are good, some just don’t care. Complaining won’t change that...

@BuggerBognor it's not business as usual but at this particular surgery it's as close as it's going to get for a long time. But yet again, not all GPs are workshy. As in all professions there are the good, the bad and the ugly.

Responses from GP practice staff on here are only confirming the inference that there is naked self-interest at work

Not all, but with some, yes

As we've seen, there are still GP practices who are doing a great job in these difficult times, but others - even within the same area - are failing miserably
There'll always be some differences of course, but personally I'd like to see more done about the second group, especially where it contains GPs who are just downright taking the piss

[quote Walkaround]@Tappering - I still disagree with you. Human beings generally, whether in the NHS or in private practice, do not react well to criticism, especially where being struck off or sued for large sums of money are a possibility. If someone feels like their entire profession is being criticised, they will likewise feel defensive and react accordingly. It’s human nature, not specific to the NHS. Same would apply if solicitors felt they were being attacked generally by members of the public about being greedy, lazy, corrupt lawyers - irrelevant whether they receive money through legal aid or direct from their client (as many threads on mumsnet show, particularly in relation to conveyancing!).[/quote]
I understand it's human nature to feel defensive - that doesn't make it appropriate as a response though. And what I find particularly confusing is that where someone has posted their specific experience, another poster who works in the NHS then dismisses this as untrue, on the basis that their un-related practice/field/area doesn't have that same problem!

If someone has had poor treatment or service then the sensible reaction to this should not be to accuse them of lying, or to treat them so poorly that they regret having said anything in the first place?

I don't respond to professional complaints in my workplace by telling the customer they're a liar, so why should the NHS be any different? How can it be right that a child's hearing is left permanently damaged - as sadly evidenced by some posters and their experiences which they've shared on this thread - and the reaction is to shrug and be defensive and we must excuse that because it's natural to be defensive (or in one poster's case, a note on the medical records which was patently untrue as it accused her of not seeking advice!)

@BuggerBognor - whatever you may think I have a clear conscience that me and my colleagues at this particular practice are working very hard to provide a safe and responsive service to our patients.

I was in my GPs surgery the other day (meeting not medical). A very elderly lady on a walking frame popped in to make an appointment to see a GP. She was told that she cannot see a GP and that she will need to have a telephone appointment first. Yet there was I in a meeting with GPs. It took 10 mins to get the lady to understand what was happening and to confirm her telephone number. What are the chances that when the GP calls the patient will understand what is happening. It’s poor service.

I am fortunate to have a very good GP practice near me.

My aunt, however, has had shockingly poor care from her local practice resulting in admission to hospital yesterday because of repeated refusals to attend her in the care home where she now lives.

One of the carers told me that they had been trying and trying to get her seen and were fobbed off every time. Her leg is now so diseased there is nothing they can do to help her.

Of course this might always have been the outcome (she is very elderly) but I am left wondering whether it would have been different had she been able to see her GP weeks ago when it first became a problem. Certainly she would have been spared a lot of distress.

I am a former NHS professional and feel uneasy about criticising at a very difficult time for everyone but sadly it does seem that some GP practices are failing their patients very badly.

@Ocies My surgery is working in a very similar fashion to yours. Not the same surgery though - my practice manager was at work today! The phone consultations are generally working brilliantly, particularly as they are all same day appointments so no waiting weeks to speak to or see a GP. We’ve continued to do baby imms throughout, and the only thing we’re still not doing is ear syringing. There were changes on virtually an hourly basis in the early days of Covid - it was a rollercoaster and hugely stressful for everyone involved. A lot of the changes will stay post-pandemic as they’ve worked so well and proved so popular with patients too.

I’m a lowly admin person and very rarely interact with patients these days, but I share an office with the reception staff. Sadly what I have noticed recently is the huge increase in crap they are having to endure from patients in the past two months - screaming, shouting and swearing at them. 90% of the calls they deal with are from lovely patients, the other 10% are from thoroughly nasty, rude and entitled people. It actually used to be probably less than 1%, but seems to have increased hugely. Our reception team are fantastic and fall over backwards trying to help people. They get lots of thanks from many, but of course it’s the abusive people you tend to remember. They, like the GPs, nurses and HCAs have worked throughout.

Unfortunately COVID seems to have brought out the worst in many people in all areas of life (including Mumsnet sometimes) which I find very sad.

@Dopeyduck none of what I’ve said is aimed at you. With the exception of possibly the first GP, you have had a shoddy service and should definitely complain. Apart from anything else, in my surgery errors like this are used to learn and hopefully improve the service we provide.

@Tappering - of course defensiveness is not an appropriate response, but people posting on here are not responding to professional complaints in their workplace, are they? This is not an NHS complaints service. People on here are responding defensively as private citizens, as is their right, because they are not listening to a formal complaint, they are reading what feels to them (not always justifiably - certainly not in this case!) like a one sided attack and they are trying overly hard to put across another possible interpretation of the situation.

I am furious on your behalf OP. I am sick to death of Covid being wheeled out as an excuse for poor service. It is starting to wear a bit thin now.